VANOS and effective ranges

[techno550]

there is no end to the range of effectiveness of being able to alter the cam timing. Removing/disabling vanos narrows the powerband by cutting or removing total power from the system.

[Nj85'325]

there is no end to the range of effectiveness of being able to alter the cam timing. Removing/disabling vanos narrows the powerband by cutting or removing total power from the system.

so its like Vtec YO?!


(hahaha why am i getting into this hahaha)


Edit: im 16 and ahve the flu leave me alone i dunno what im talknig about :'(

[5mall5nail5]

Edit: im not posting an IM as I don't want to risk a TO, but Techno550's real intention was to call out JT and Andreas about VANOS functionality. He decided to wimp out and be vague.

[techno550]

the posts Jon is referring to are:

Actually where the power is used vanos will have no effect. Less parts less headache. ///J.T.///

Absolutly right!!

The problem here is that there is no such ineffective range. Vanos is a tool to alter the LSA. being able to vary cam timing is a very valuable tool any time the used RPM range is a consideration. Even if the "power band" is only 2k - 3k rpm wide, you could still use VANOS effectively and have a great benefit from it.

[Ichbinsobose]

If my turbo reaches full boost at 5-5.5k and I redline at 7.5k, can vanos help me increase power in boost? reall question.

[techno550]

If my turbo reaches full boost at 5-5.5k and I redline at 7.5k, can vanos help me increase power in boost? reall question.

Vanos can help get the turbo online faster, make more torque in the midrange, and make more top end power.

[card counter]

Vanos can help get the turbo online faster, make more torque in the midrange, and make more top end power.

This is true as I have tested this on the dyno.

What I want to test next is how long I should leave the vanos on,I had mine cut out at 5000rpm's.Next time on dyno I will figure this out by having vanos off at higher rpms and crossing graphs to see where torque falls.

[MrBlonde]

DVANOS helps your turbo spool sooner. All else is rhetoric.

[5mall5nail5]

DVANOS helps your turbo spool sooner. All else is rhetoric.

Interesting twist on it - never thought about that Kenny

[techno550]

DVANOS helps your turbo spool sooner. All else is rhetoric.

Power on boost is also effected greatly.

[card counter]

If I can get my scanner working I can post the dynos.The only explanation I have is vanos increasing torque mid range made more air flow that in turn spooled turbo sooner.All this was done with a leaking intercooler so results could be diffrent now we will see soon

[Bmwandreas]

Yes it makes the turbo spool faster.
But who needs that for dragracing?

Euro S50 spools very large turbos quickly!

PT76GTS/GT4202 at around 4000 rpm full boost without vanos with correct adjust cams.

[techno550]

Yes it makes the turbo spool faster.
But who needs that for dragracing?

Euro S50 spools very large turbos quickly!

PT76GTS/GT4202 at around 4000 rpm full boost without vanos with correct adjust cams.

Spooling faster is spooling faster. would full boost sooner not be better?

Even when drag racing, you use a band that is probably 3k wide, and you could either use the vanos to spool the turbo before that, or use it to make two narrow peaks in that 3k rpm range. with dual vanos, you could do all of the above.

[card counter]

My vanos does not even work on the track leave line 5200rpm's shift at 8000rpm's next gear catches at 5600-5800.Now on the street it comes into play alot.

[MrBlonde]

My vanos does not even work on the track leave line 5200rpm's shift at 8000rpm's next gear catches at 5600-5800.Now on the street it comes into play alot.

Leave the line at 5200 RPM?

[Bmwandreas]

I left the line at 7500 rpm on my 9.42 run.

[jfdmas]

WOW, i feel like im at home in this thread. Everyone kept riding my nuts about vanos this and vanos that. But the bottem line is i dont care about low end tq. the only thing that matters to me is 5500ish to redline when im drag racing. I have antilag that i can use to spool my turbo if needed. Id be extremely interested if there was a way i could adjust/lock my cam into place to ONLY gain top end.

[M3sRsick]

license suspended

[D Azevedo]

Yes it makes the turbo spool faster.
But who needs that for dragracing?

Euro S50 spools very large turbos quickly!

PT76GTS/GT4202 at around 4000 rpm full boost without vanos with correct adjust cams.

My vanos does not even work on the track leave line 5200rpm's shift at 8000rpm's next gear catches at 5600-5800.Now on the street it comes into play alot.

thank you guys ,its wat ive been tring to tell this guy for days now,LOCKED cams in a race car is the way to go!!!!!!

[stimpee]

license suspended

That is frickin lame.

Just because people don't agree with Mike, and just because Mike is often lacking a bit in "tact" in his approach, he is typically making valid points for people to consider, if they wish to take the time to understand the points he is trying to make.

Some argue with him just to argue, which then brings on all of the drama, without any substance to the argument in most cases.

And once again this forum will be faced with the reality that the majority of people around here that actually KNOW something, and/or have real experience doing things themselves, will be gone, or afraid to post...

A sad state of affairs if you ask me.

And in case any of you are paying attention, Yes, I have made comments both past and present to back up some of the poeple on both sides of these arguments.

My viewpoint is that of an impartial observer, that has been around here for WAY too long...

[M3sRsick]

That is frickin lame.

Just because people don't agree with Mike, and just because Mike is often lacking a bit in "tact" in his approach, he is typically making valid points for people to consider, if they wish to take the time to understand the points he is trying to make.

Some argue with him just to argue, which then brings on all of the drama, without any substance to the argument in most cases.

And once again this forum will be faced with the reality that the majority of people around here that actually KNOW something, and/or have real experience doing things themselves, will be gone, or afraid to post...

A sad state of affairs if you ask me.

And in case any of you are paying attention, Yes, I have made comments both past and present to back up some of the poeple on both sides of these arguments.

My viewpoint is that of an impartial observer, that has been around here for WAY too long...

Yes he knows what he is talking about and does make some very valid points and often is a big help in the FI section. BUT he is constantly shoving his information down peoples throats even after people have chosen their way around the project. It's great that he offers the help and advice but it only needs to be stated once, not 10 pages of the same sh*t regarding Dvanos.

He also seems to instigate anything Jon (5mall5nails) says just b/c of a grudge he has with Jon; he will often rant for 5 pages in a heated discussion which completely ruins the OP's thread. JMO

[dubgray1.8T]

I personally think a HIGH horsepower car can benefit from from a later spool. I the later the better for traction and drivetrain parts. Of course some wastegate tuning could make both pretty safe.

[325icintn]

Why is his license suspended? Strange for a supporting vendor.
Anyway, dvanos may spool the turbo faster, but so would a shot of nitrous or a postive displacement blower. Shouldn't we all be using these as well, Mike?
If the builder/tuner does not want to or can not tune for the use of dvanos, then who cares. There are lots of tradeoffs made in a build, many of which sacrifice power for reliability or ease of use. I don't think there is anything sacred about dvanos.

[NickG]

If the builder/tuner does not want to or can not tune for the use of dvanos, then who cares. There are lots of tradeoffs made in a build, many of which sacrifice power for reliability or ease of use. I don't think there is anything sacred about dvanos.

If the builder/tuner doesn't want to run double vanos for whatever reason, then that's perfectly fine. But to state that running the cams locked in position will produce more area under the torque curve is completely false. I'm guessing that's what the problem really is. People love to state things as fact when they're not.

Case in point.....below is a dyno comparison of my turbo E46 330ci. The blue curve is with the cams in the stock positions, and the red curve is with them tweaked. It's clear as day that using the vanos and varying the camshaft angles are different RPMs gains power under the curve. I was able to pick up power throughout the entire RPM band by utilizing the VANOS functionality.

[Ichbinsobose]

Can you say what rpms the vanos was used in that dyno? since the gains are across the entire board, its as though vanos came on at idle and turned off at redline.