Raced an 06 GTI

[MiBmr]

Hey guys my friend with an '06 VW GTI and I decided to wash our cars today. I had my 330 out as it was about due for it's weekly wash. Anyway on the way back the highway seemed really deserted so we decide to do a quick run. We get up next to each other at about 60mph, and then drop in third. I see my friend get ready, and as soon as he steps on it, I nail it. We are dead even until we let off at 110.

After riding in each others cars, it seemed like his car is snappier in the low end - granted he reaches almost all his horse at 1800 RPM... but it still seemed like it really pulled in 2nd. Has anyone had a similar experience? Perhaps raced one off the line? I will have to race my friend off the line next time to see how it goes, but it seemed like a really good run so far.

[SergEG]

I went against one a while back and pulled on him quite a bit in third....down low he didnt fall back to bad but above 60 it just got worse for him

I shut it down around 110 maybe 115 or so and couldnt say for sure how many cars I had on him since it was at night but it was more than a few

[MiBmr]

So I assume with the GTI being stronger at lower speed, racing off the line would mean whatever lead he gains by 60mph, he will probably hold until we shut down.

However, with his FWD I might be able to gain advantage off the line while he battles traction issues into 2nd gear...

[E36M34life]

Techinically off the line, a GTI will stay or even pull a little bit due to its powerband and it being a FWD. But around 80ish when fwd will no longer matter and the 330 will be close to its powerband, things will drastically change.

Very good match up though, a good example of a race that really depends on the drivers

[MiBmr]

I agree, this will essentially be mostly a drivers race. I will keep you guys posted, and hopefully get some video as well while we are at it.

[Revin2Ten]

My buddies '06 GTI MKV (2.0T) ran a 14.7@94 mph stock in his 6 speed. Stage 1's will be mid-low 14's down, trapping at least 97-98+.. Some Stage 2's are breaking into the 13's and trapping as high as 103-104mph when they have traction. Most stage 2's will only be able to manage low 14's at the track however, due to there FWD, no LSD, high torque applications. Horrible launching car's. They do make one with the DSG tranny, and launch control which tends to be more consistent. But still really only capable of so much. Nice little cars IMO.

[phillyM]

I happen to own one, and all that torque through the whole rev range can make it tricky to launch. It has an "electronic LSD" which is supposed to clamp the brake down on a spinning wheel, but it's no substitute for the real thing. The APR chip is supposed to put it up to 252hp/303lb-ft at the crank on 93 octane and probably have similar times to the stage I's. I just like to take the car for what it is: a fun and practical daily driver that will pull just about anywhere in the rev range. The 330 is a more focused driver's car. I don't have DSG, but it's pretty amazing technology. Lets see if it holds up over lots of miles.

[jettore]

Can you please explain this to me?

Originally Posted by E36M34life

Techinically off the line, a GTI will stay or even pull a little bit due to its powerband and it being a FWD. But around 80ish when fwd will no longer matter and the 330 will be close to its powerband, things will drastically change.

Very good match up though, a good example of a race that really depends on the drivers

[Montague]

Actually, from personal experience, you should pull off the line due to RWD. Also there's a slight, but noticeable turbo lag before the GTI gets going. A friend has the 06 GTI too.

[bigbeansm3]

Makes no sense. FWD is a factor all the way through 1st gear (traction control cuts power on those cars all the way through 1st) and the 1-2 shift will be a bit of an issue. once the GTI is fully engaged and getting traction in 2nd, FWD no longer matters. It will chirp 3rd, but nothing that would cause it to lose ground.

My friend has a Jetta GLI 2.0T that has trapped 96MPH bone stock. I cannot explain why its that fast, because with the horsepower and the curb weight it should not be as fast as it is, but the numbers dont lie, i watched it run.

[abradic]

In my experience with VW's, they always had a very good 2nd gear, and 3rd seemed even better. My brother's GTI, it's an 02 VR6 6-speed, I love that 2nd to 3rd shift. Really hits nice and just pulls. I have a hard time walking him. He does get walked, but he hangs there for a little bit. A great car, truly a drivers car.

[abradic]

Originally Posted by bigbeansm3

Makes no sense. FWD is a factor all the way through 1st gear (traction control cuts power on those cars all the way through 1st) and the 1-2 shift will be a bit of an issue. once the GTI is fully engaged and getting traction in 2nd, FWD no longer matters. It will chirp 3rd, but nothing that would cause it to lose ground.

My friend has a Jetta GLI 2.0T that has trapped 96MPH bone stock. I cannot explain why its that fast, because with the horsepower and the curb weight it should not be as fast as it is, but the numbers dont lie, i watched it run.

The GTI's have limited slip, I think. Either way, that car gets very good grip and off the line in a hurry. They also handle amazingly well for a FWD car, really impresses me. It's probably a combo of the weight balance, suspension, and LSD. Still though, if I ever bought one, it would be MKIV R32 all the way...and I really wish I could add it to the stable!

[Montague]

Originally Posted by bigbeansm3

My friend has a Jetta GLI 2.0T that has trapped 96MPH bone stock. I cannot explain why its that fast, because with the horsepower and the curb weight it should not be as fast as it is, but the numbers dont lie, i watched it run.

What was the GLI's ET? One really surprised me when they first came out and I did not know them well. Left me thinking WTF just happened? Been looking for a rerun since I had a few things done.

[Montague]

Originally Posted by bigbeansm3

My friend has a Jetta GLI 2.0T that has trapped 96MPH bone stock. I cannot explain why its that fast, because with the horsepower and the curb weight it should not be as fast as it is, but the numbers dont lie, i watched it run.

That engine is making quite a bit more than it's rated.

[mancim3]

I drove one the other day just to see how dsg felt, I was very impressed; felt just as fast as my modded E36 M3, I am suprissed they don't do better then high 14s in 1/4, might have something to do with it being fwd.

[Revin2Ten]

Originally Posted by abradic

The GTI's have limited slip, I think. Either way, that car gets very good grip and off the line in a hurry. They also handle amazingly well for a FWD car, really impresses me. It's probably a combo of the weight balance, suspension, and LSD. Still though, if I ever bought one, it would be MKIV R32 all the way...and I really wish I could add it to the stable!

I don't believe you could be more inaccurate with your post.

The MK5 GTI's do not have LSD. They can purchase an aftermarket one, but it does not come with the car from the factory. They have horrible traction off the line. Most will do no better then 2.2 60ft with a very good launch. It might be the FWD/NO LSD/high torque (high torque at a low RPM none the less) that makes these cars dogs from a dig. But they are rather slow off the line. There more so of a 2nd gear roll type of car, which will trap higher then it's E.T. would suggest. Not to mention they weigh a lot for what they are. There around 3300lbs.


About the APR software giving them 250+ whp and 300+ wtrq... That's been proven total B.S. No stage 1 whether it be APR, REVO, or GIAC software will go anywhere near those HP numbers, even with supporting mods. Stock they dyno mostly in the 190's, some right around 200whp. With stage 1 software they will be around 210-225 with a DP and CAI (required). Stage 2's will dyno from 225-240 whp, with there torque being in the 280's or so. That is with full 3" turboback exhaust (DP + exhaust), CAI, forged DV, some even have front mounts. And still they have trouble breaking the 250hp barrier. Now I know some have done so, so I don't want to make it sound like no GTI on the planet is capable. But from what I've been around and seen, that APR line is total BS. (Even though it states it on there website) Like 4 of my good buddies have GTI MKV's with the 2.0T motor's, 3 are modded, two have stage 2+++, and none of them are putting down 250whp.

Another thing. I went up to Fixx fest a couple weeks ago with my buddies. It's a giant Volkswagen event up in Bradenton Florida. I was there from 8:45 in the morning until 4:00 pm. I watched over 65-70 GTI MKV's, with all different kinds of mods run down the 1/4 mile drag strip, all day long...........Only 2 managed to get a 13 second E.T.!! Two! I couldn't believe it. Bradenton's one of the faster tracks none the less. My buddies stage 2 only managed out of 8 runs, a best of 14.2@98mph! I was rather disappointed to say the least. Had a blast, but I definitely thought at least some of the GTI's would've been faster. I don't know why they weren't. Here's some of my buddies GTI's in action..

My buddies bone stock RSX type S, vs my buddies '06 GTI MKV with CAI (basically stock vs stock)

http://videos.streetfire.net/video/2...98011e5306.htm


APR chipped vs 350z

http://videos.streetfire.net/video/9...de01498b4f.htm


APR stage 2 '06 GTI vs my '04 G35

http://videos.streetfire.net/video/1...5d0134a4ed.htm


Another APR stage 2 vs stock GTI vs my G35

http://videos.streetfire.net/video/5...d800ffe780.htm

[phillyM]

About the APR software giving them 250+ whp and 300+ wtrq... That's been proven total B.S. No stage 1 whether it be APR, REVO, or GIAC software will go anywhere near those HP numbers, even with supporting mods. Stock they dyno mostly in the 190's, some right around 200whp. With stage 1 software they will be around 210-225 with a DP and CAI (required).

252hp is from the crank. Factor in a 10-15% drivetrain loss, and you're at 215 to 225 whp, so 252 hp isn't really a false claim. And as for hp discrepancies on the dyno, I suppose the air temperature can really affect a turbo car's hp and torque ratings. And you guys are crazy about times at the drag strip in here, then again I am posting in the "kills" section...

[abradic]

Originally Posted by Revin2Ten

I don't believe you could be more inaccurate with your post.

The MK5 GTI's do not have LSD. They can purchase an aftermarket one, but it does not come with the car from the factory. They have horrible traction off the line. Most will do no better then 2.2 60ft with a very good launch. It might be the FWD/NO LSD/high torque (high torque at a low RPM none the less) that makes these cars dogs from a dig. But they are rather slow off the line. There more so of a 2nd gear roll type of car, which will trap higher then it's E.T. would suggest. Not to mention they weigh a lot for what they are. There around 3300lbs.


About the APR software giving them 250+ whp and 300+ wtrq... That's been proven total B.S. No stage 1 whether it be APR, REVO, or GIAC software will go anywhere near those HP numbers, even with supporting mods. Stock they dyno mostly in the 190's, some right around 200whp. With stage 1 software they will be around 210-225 with a DP and CAI (required). Stage 2's will dyno from 225-240 whp, with there torque being in the 280's or so. That is with full 3" turboback exhaust (DP + exhaust), CAI, forged DV, some even have front mounts. And still they have trouble breaking the 250hp barrier. Now I know some have done so, so I don't want to make it sound like no GTI on the planet is capable. But from what I've been around and seen, that APR line is total BS. (Even though it states it on there website) Like 4 of my good buddies have GTI MKV's with the 2.0T motor's, 3 are modded, two have stage 2+++, and none of them are putting down 250whp.

Another thing. I went up to Fixx fest a couple weeks ago with my buddies. It's a giant Volkswagen event up in Bradenton Florida. I was there from 8:45 in the morning until 4:00 pm. I watched over 65-70 GTI MKV's, with all different kinds of mods run down the 1/4 mile drag strip, all day long...........Only 2 managed to get a 13 second E.T.!! Two! I couldn't believe it. Bradenton's one of the faster tracks none the less. My buddies stage 2 only managed out of 8 runs, a best of 14.2@98mph! I was rather disappointed to say the least. Had a blast, but I definitely thought at least some of the GTI's would've been faster. I don't know why they weren't. Here's some of my buddies GTI's in action..

My buddies bone stock RSX type S, vs my buddies '06 GTI MKV with CAI (basically stock vs stock)

http://videos.streetfire.net/video/2...98011e5306.htm


APR chipped vs 350z

http://videos.streetfire.net/video/9...de01498b4f.htm


APR stage 2 '06 GTI vs my '04 G35

http://videos.streetfire.net/video/1...5d0134a4ed.htm


Another APR stage 2 vs stock GTI vs my G35

http://videos.streetfire.net/video/5...d800ffe780.htm

Well, part of the problem is the assumption you made. I mentioned a 2002 GTI which is an MKIV. They do have great handling for a FWD, and a great gear in 2nd and 3rd. They also get off the line pretty good, better than most cars that are FWD and don't have the problems you mention of the MKV. This is the VR6 version. The 1.8T may not, I never drove the 1.8T. I also never drove the 2.0T MKV, so I don't doubt when you say it's bad off the line. With the boost from the turbo kicking in at a low RPM, I can see the tq overwhelming the tires.

The one thing I am wrong on after further research is that the MKIV did not have LSD. That's why I said 'I think' they may have it instead of claiming it did. I wasn't sure.

All that other stuff about software and hp claims, I never said any of that in any posts.

[Revin2Ten]

Originally Posted by abradic

Well, part of the problem is the assumption you made. I mentioned a 2002 GTI which is an MKIV. They do have great handling for a FWD, and a great gear in 2nd and 3rd. They also get off the line pretty good, better than most cars that are FWD and don't have the problems you mention of the MKV. This is the VR6 version. The 1.8T may not, I never drove the 1.8T. I also never drove the 2.0T MKV, so I don't doubt when you say it's bad off the line. With the boost from the turbo kicking in at a low RPM, I can see the tq overwhelming the tires.

The one thing I am wrong on after further research is that the MKIV did not have LSD. That's why I said 'I think' they may have it instead of claiming it did. I wasn't sure.

All that other stuff about software and hp claims, I never said any of that in any posts.

Oh my bad, dude. I didn't mean to come off as if I proving you wrong.. Just when you said they get off the line quickly, an alarm went off in my head. And since the topic was about discussing the MKV GTI, I just figured that's what you were talking about.

[Revin2Ten]

Originally Posted by phillyM

252hp is from the crank. Factor in a 10-15% drivetrain loss, and you're at 215 to 225 whp, so 252 hp isn't really a false claim. And as for hp discrepancies on the dyno, I suppose the air temperature can really affect a turbo car's hp and torque ratings.

That would make more sense, however on there website it doesn't say crank HP. It does however say that after long hours on the dyno of extensive tunning APR has brought to you blah blah... It's at goapr.com. Also, on the VW forums like vwvortex.com and golfmkv.com, they claim the HP to be wheel HP numbers also. However, none of the guys with the software are dynoing anywhere near those numbers. It's gotta mean flywheel hp, I agree.

And one more thing. You need other supporting mods to run with the ECU. It's not like you can just throw the chipped ECU back in, and poof, 60hp... You have to run it with a down pipe, and intake at 1st, then stage 2 requires a full turboback exhaust, and recommends a front mount IC for the best performance. Yet even with those mods added to go along with the chip, they don't dyno those #'s to the wheels. I don't know honestly. Just seems like a little scam to me.

[abradic]

Originally Posted by Revin2Ten

Oh my bad, dude. I didn't mean to come off as if I proving you wrong.. Just when you said they get off the line quickly, an alarm went off in my head. And since the topic was about discussing the MKV GTI, I just figured that's what you were talking about.

Yeah, I should have clarified that better too! I wonder if they will put the VR6 in the GTI, or leave it exclusive to the R32 in MKV form. I like the way that VR6 sounds, and for mods, it's a better base to start with. It's more money and not as easy to pull power like the 2.0T, but the potential is better.

[Bavarian_6shot]

Roffle copter @ rev2teck. He trolls all over www.golfmkv.com

Yeah, we're heavy torque whores with itsy bitsy turbos and traction issues. Sorry you couldn't kill one. No LSD here. WOT in first or second gear can result in tire fire.

I'll be dyno'ing my stage II in February.
Mods:
- Revo Chip
- Downpipe+Cat delete

I have ran dead even 20-100 with a stock 6.0 L GTO.
- Posted a 9.2 1/8th mile.
- Get ~34 avg mpg.
- Made lots of dub friends.

Pros:
- German fit and finish
- Not as expensive as my BMW
- Mods are decently priced
- Fast, but not stupid fast.
Cons:
- Tiny K03 turbo runs out of breath
- FWD + No LSD makes it difficult to launch or justify a big turbo (GT3071R kit $2700)

[trevordr]

Wow this thread is full of misinformation. The stock MkV GTi is terrible off the line due to it being FWD and having 200wtq@1800rpm. It is NOT a mid 14 car with a good driver, motor trend got 14.1@ 98 or 99 right out the box, so your friends just suck at driving. With a chip it is an easy 13 second car (with a good driver). They put down 230-235whp @5500rpm and 280-290wtq @1800rpm with just a chip. It should have no problem pulling an e46 330 up top especially, it weighs less and has way more torque and nearly the same power. They pull in every gear (including 6th) because of the V8 status torque so if you race one on a roll beware.


Good kill but the MkV driver needs driving lessons.

[hellrot98m3]

my buddy has a gti, it was a lemon and he just got his brand new one. i drove the lemon before he gave it back to vw, the car is pretty cool looking and i love the interior. i dont know if its just because he has the auto but that thing has turbo lag like crazy but once the gti gets past 1st gear the wheels start spinning and it feels like a different car. having the paddle shifters are cool also but i would like to drive a 6sp to really know how much faster it is. i havent driven the newer one yet but he said there are no problems that he has found yet, its still got the terrible turbo lag but hes not really a fast driver so it doesnt matter i guess.

[kkoma1030]

Originally Posted by Bavarian_6shot

Roffle copter @ rev2teck. He trolls all over www.golfmkv.com

Yeah, we're heavy torque whores with itsy bitsy turbos and traction issues. Sorry you couldn't kill one. No LSD here. WOT in first or second gear can result in tire fire.

I'll be dyno'ing my stage II in February.
Mods:
- Revo Chip
- Downpipe+Cat delete

I have ran dead even 20-100 with a stock 6.0 L GTO.
- Posted a 9.2 1/8th mile.
- Get ~34 avg mpg.
- Made lots of dub friends.

Pros:
- German fit and finish
- Not as expensive as my BMW
- Mods are decently priced
- Fast, but not stupid fast.
Cons:
- Tiny K03 turbo runs out of breath
- FWD + No LSD makes it difficult to launch or justify a big turbo (GT3071R kit $2700)

OMG! i can't believe they still using k03 turbo! i had bad exprience with those turbo. it gave out quike and no power at top (actually i could feel power dropping at top in my s4), but k04 is sweet thing though.
good luck on your dyno.