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Thread: why are so many of you money shifting

  1. #1
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    why are so many of you money shifting

    I just bought an E36 M3 for dd and so just started to visit this section. I see that there are many Money shifting threads. Why are so many of you doing this? is this car really easy to make that mistake or are a lot of E36 drivers just retarded?

  2. #2
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    every story ive read about money shifting seems to point to the latter. sorry.
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  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by mkiv98 View Post
    I just bought an E36 M3 for dd and so just started to visit this section. I see that there are many Money shifting threads. Why are so many of you doing this? is this car really easy to make that mistake or are a lot of E36 drivers just retarded?
    I was wondering that myself actually... I'm looking into picking one up and this was making me wonder how well they shift. I always heard in the magazines bimmers were generally some of the best shifting cars. Are these cars linkage or cable shifted? It seems like with me I miss a shift more often on cable shift cars.
    Bryan
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  4. #4
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    I think not enough people replace the shifting linkage bushings regularly. I just replaced them on my 99 M3 with 60k miles and the difference was night and day. I did go beyond stock -- to a full UUC EVO3 with DSSR, but I think somethink like the Pelican bushing kit or the Ron Stygar bushing kit or short shifter kit or the BMA Parts short shifter kit would have been a very significant improvement over well used stock parts and more bang for the buck.

    Philip Bradley

  5. #5
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    I think people just don't shift the best way. A lot of people will grab the shift knob to slam it into gear, which can bring it straight into 2nd if you were aiming for 4th, etc, but they should be almost back-handing it to guide it down into the right gear.
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  6. #6
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    You always get these guys that think their car is perfect and they put 100% of the blame on the driver. If it was totally driver error then money shifts would be just as common on other brands of cars. The truth is that every joint that affects shifting in these cars wears out way too fast and can make the shifting vague. I've never money shifted but I've experienced a vague feeling in the shifter that made me completely stop my shift until I could figure out where I was.

    The tranny mounts go too quick. All the shifter linkages get sloppy. And the shift gates get sticky. If I ever have my tranny out I will replace all of those things.

  7. #7
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    it happens once i wasnt paying attention and misshifted from 4th to 3rd but this was at only about 60mph so it didnt do any damage thx god

    but this was early in the day and i was still half asleep and didnt push tha shiftarr right hard enought
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  8. #8
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    If I ever money shift, it will probably be because the armrest on the center console interferes with my arm/wrist alignment and therefore, technique.Flipping the armrest into the vertical position puts it in contact with my elbow on the even shifts, so I should remove it.
    ymmv.

    I would remove it, but the car was purchased as a long distance hauler/part time commuter, and not for modding and flogging. I have two other cars for track rats.

    m

  9. #9
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    Are m3 the only car in the world to have moneyshifting problems? This is unheard of in the Mustang Arena.

  10. #10
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    The UUC tranny mounts go a long way in helping to prevent a money shift. (Although also updating the bushings and shifter can mostly resolve the issue) They are cheap to buy and easy to replace. Shouldn't take more than 30 minutes to do. Cheap insurance and should be done by everyone.
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  11. #11
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    The car is prone to it, but it's down to driver error. Of course, this is the type of error you can do (and probably have done) in other «forgiving» cars, and you never knew.

    But in the M3's case, the transmission mounts become a bit soft with age, so the housing twists a bit upon hard acceleration (under torque load).

    So if you combine a bit of driver error or lack of attention, a car that is prone to it, and the most recent E36 M3 being 8 model-years-old, it happens...

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  12. #12
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    The 3 reasons for moneyshifting for anyone that doesn't know:

    1. Poor shifting technique (been backhanding for months)
    2. Worn out or simply poor stock transmission mounts (I changed mine with UUC, 90% improvement)
    3. Worn out shifter bushings (on my hit list)

    End of story. I've come close to moneyshifting before by hitting the gates between 2 and 4. If you are using stock tranny mounts, change them NOW. Moneyshift land is not somewhere you want to be.
    Last edited by EricP; 09-05-2006 at 11:57 AM.

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  13. #13
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    +1 on what hugo said. When i did it i blamed myself (cause im a dumbass and didnt backhand the shifter), the tranny mounts just made it easier for me to be retarted. Now i have been backhanding 4th ever since and have never had a problem even before i changed the tranny mounts to UUC reds...
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  14. #14
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    The bigger issue is with motor mounts, they suck and are very soft. I didnt notice much with trany mounts, but noticed a HUGE difference with motor mounts.
    Doug (BMWCCA HPDE Instructor, Respect My Authoritay!)

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  15. #15
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    I would have to say most of it is driver error. Its either not using the right technique (not back handing) or shifting at the wrong time (downshift when you are in a hard turn).

    P.S.

    Im no expert at racing, but from what I have read on here and heard on tv, you are supposed to do all your down shifting and braking before you enter the turn, so dont hate if you say otherwise.
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  16. #16
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    It's driver error. These cars are easier to shift than any other car I've ever driven. Excluding P-cars.

  17. #17
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    i dont know it seems like some of you are making up mechanical excuses

    im not that great of a driver but a money shift is a huge mistake...

    ive driven many many cars with transmissions looser than this and even older and never had this problem. 238k 300zx comes to mind.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by marine4u123 View Post
    Are m3 the only car in the world to have moneyshifting problems? This is unheard of in the Mustang Arena.
    I think mustangs have the shifter directly going into the transmission, no? M3 has it attached to the body, with a linkage, so the trans moves independently of the shifter.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidplate View Post
    Are these cars linkage or cable shifted? It seems like with me I miss a shift more often on cable shift cars.
    No cables. The shifter is right on top of the trans, so there is just a short linkage going forward to shift it. You are still thinking of FWD

  20. #20
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    you guys who think its all driver need to do a little homework in the world of cars. E36s are known far and wide for how easy they money shift. I bet theyre ten times as likely to be money shifted as the next closest car.

    it has to do with:
    A) hydro lifters/weak valvetrain. some car can be overrevved and not face certain death like our cars
    B) tranny has soft gates. it lets you put it whereever you want.
    C) tranny mounts
    D) engine mounts
    E) shift linkage

    All those parts are weak on this car. there are just as many good and bad drivers driving every other kind of car out there, but none have the rep (and well documented/deserved) that this car does

  21. #21
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    Of course driver errors are the most common reason. When on the racetrack there are certain corners that have a high g-load through right hand bends. If you are shifting from 3 to 4th in the middle of this corner at WOT, it is quite easy to money shift. But upgrading the mechanical parts will certainly help prevent the twist from the torque load. So only have to focus on the g-load factor when making the shift.

    I realized the M3's weakness at Sebring after the carousel and going under the bridge and at turn 17. Under that high g-load I was pulling the shifter towards me when shifting. Upgraded the mounts, shifter, & bushings and found it much easier and less of a concern. I could focus on driving rather than the mechanical issues.
    "Way-dull" Racing #74

  22. #22
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    The car isn't very forgiving I think is part of the problem... and that is due mostly because of the more aggressive rear end gearing....easier to get the car up past red line mechanically. I've always wondered if it was the same problem on the '95s. I'd bet it's not due to the rear end gearing difference.

  23. #23
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    Man, you guys missed a big factor:

    Stick rests at fifth when cold.

    When driving the thing when it's cold, it's hard to find the right gear (3rd/5th); of course, I'm not bouncing it off the rev limiter then. But it's difficult to build a good mental map, when there's no tranny 'gates'! I'm always a bit hesitant about those shifts, because somewhere in the back of my mind I'm wondering if the gate is there or not...
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  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by weenerdog View Post
    Man, you guys missed a big factor:

    Stick rests at fifth when cold.

    When driving the thing when it's cold, it's hard to find the right gear (3rd/5th); of course, I'm not bouncing it off the rev limiter then. But it's difficult to build a good mental map, when there's no tranny 'gates'! I'm always a bit hesitant about those shifts, because somewhere in the back of my mind I'm wondering if the gate is there or not...

    That is an easy fix and does not contribute to money shifting. (easy being pull the tranny and install $15 in parts) Mine has had this issue for years and I dont missshift.

    most over-revs are user error, the real money shift is when the engine and tranny shifts under corner load and causes a shifter to miss the gate.
    Doug (BMWCCA HPDE Instructor, Respect My Authoritay!)

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  25. #25
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    Also, learning Heel/Toe downshifting will help get you smooth in and out of hard turns, especially carousel turns after a 1/4 mile straight. Nothing worse than trying to downshift in a turn after you've missed the apex. An STI money shifted at the last driver's school I was at and did it after the 1/4.
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