Replacing your starter in an E36? Read this!

[Dispatch20]

After running into some problems with my starter, I decided to post some facts. If I knew these going into the job, it would have saved me a lot of time.

There are two types of starters for the E36: pre-1996 and 1996+. There are some differences that you should know about:



The 1996+ starter is shorter in overall length and cannot be bolted into the engine block with the Bosch OEM bracket. Instead, it has reinforced mounting ears (2-3x the thickness of the pre-1996 version). This starter bolts only to the tranny bellhousing via inverted torx bolts. Also, this verison has threaded mounting ears which make installing/removing a LOT easier.

The pre-1996 starter is a bit longer, and MUST be bolted to the engine block with the bracket. I have a 1997 M3 and I got a pre-1996 starter as a replacement. I did not have a bracket on my original starter, so I didn't use the one in the box with my new starter. Big mistake, since a week later the starter broke clean through at the ears! There are a few tricks to make the pre-1996 easier to use. I used helicoils on the ears to create my own threaded holes. Others have cemented the nuts to the back of the starter.

[blackbimmer328]

I have removed the intake on my 96 328i. How do get this bastard starter out. No room uptop? Help??

[darkness95m3]

I have removed the intake on my 96 328i. How do get this bastard starter out. No room uptop? Help??

The only way is from the top.
You will have to remove the intake manifold to get to it.
It is a very tight place however it can be done.
Someone once mentioned you could remove it from underneath, however I tried that with no luck.
I just did mine last night.
Now I have a nother problem the car is idling to high. I thought of a leak with no luck.

[Dispatch20]

The only way is from the top.
You will have to remove the intake manifold to get to it.
It is a very tight place however it can be done.
Someone once mentioned you could remove it from underneath, however I tried that with no luck.
I just did mine last night.
Now I have a nother problem the car is idling to high. I thought of a leak with no luck.

To do it from below you must have a manual tranny. You must also drop the tranny crossmember and tilt the entire transmission by jacking up the engine block. Then you have to move all the fuel lines out of the way, and take off a heat shield (over the fuel filter). If you snake your arms the right way you can get a 2' extension onto the torx bolts on the tranny, with a wrench out near the guibo/driveshaft area to turn.

A threaded starter would be a lot easier from below. Nevertheless, I was able to install a non-threaded starter from below. I had to construct some weird combo's of extensions to get the starter ear to tranny bolt that is behind the tranny. Craftsmen has an "obstruction wrench" that would have done the trick I believe. I didn't use it since they were out of stock at the time.

I think it would be easier to do it by removing the intake manifold.

[Dispatch20]

Thanks for the comparison, now I have questions.

I am about to do the Auto to Manual swap on my 95' 325i. I have 112k miles and the starter is original. I plan on rebuilding the starter when the tranny is out because it has to come off anyway.

Can I and should I switch to the 96+ starter?

Dunbar

If the '95 325I starter has the same part number as newer models, I'd say yes. Try realoem.com and compare. A call to the dealer may also help. I don't know the answer for sure.

I do think that all the 6 cylinder starters for the E36 were the same and interchangeable, but I am just guessing....no real evidence to back that up.

[zeit00]

If the '95 325I starter has the same part number as newer models, I'd say yes. Try realoem.com and compare. A call to the dealer may also help. I don't know the answer for sure.

I do think that all the 6 cylinder starters for the E36 were the same and interchangeable, but I am just guessing....no real evidence to back that up.

They are not all the same.. But they are interchangeable. When I put in my S52 I used the thread in starter.. So I have an ODB1 tranny with an ODB2 starter.

[shim]

good thread & info.........


i am in the middle of this job, have pulled intake manifold and everything out of the way in order to access the starter. i have dropped the tranny crossmember but i guess i need to take off the x-brace and jack up my engine block. these torx bolts on the starter are sooo hard to get off. anyone else have some useful tips?

man this job is a total PITA

[jestre]

I bought the correct sockets at Advanced Auto for $9. 4 piece kit.
then still had to use a breaker bar to get it loose.

[Tefal]

Ive done these at work and with the right tools(which i have! ) they can b done from underneath without removing anything apart from the battery leads! They r a pain in the arse to do and we always replace them with the threaded bolt holes starter. IF we get a pre 96 starter we super glue the nuts in place to get the bolts started. I jam a spanner on the nut and then with a very long extension+ratchet undo the buggers(On a ramp with ratchet at the end of the gearbox! long extension!)

[billywiz]

Im not certain about other models but to replace the starter on a e36 318is you do not need to lower the tranny etc, all the work can be done from above. My starter used torx bolts and was not threaded but this really isn't an issue, i'll explain how to handle the torx bolts as we go.

1. Remove the battery and battery tray.
2. Remove dip stick
3. Remove rubber/plastic tray from under wiper grill.
4. Remove air box to manifold hose.
5. Unbolt the upper manifold and fold it over placing it upside down on the right of the engine bay (looking at the car front on).
6. Remove both fuel pipes going to the rail.
7. Unbolt lower manifold.

Note I was not able to remove the lower manifold completely, i could not work out how to disconnect it from all the wiring on the underside so made do with lifting it and pulling it towards the front of the car. You can use a little copper wire to hold the lower manifold in this position.

8. The first bolt to remove is easy, its to the right of the starter looking at the car from the front.

Note If like mine you have torx bolts you will need the following. The correct socket (i believe a 16mm) for the front and a small ring spanner for the torx bolt behind the starter (i think a 9mm ring spanner fits the torx bolt but this is from memory)

9. The second bolt is an absolute bxxtard! You are about to find you cant reach it with any standard tool so i'll show you how to make a simple tool to do the job. You will need your small ring spanner to hold to torx bolt and the tool pictured.

Note to make the tool you will need an old universal joint and a bench grinder.

1.Take your U joint apart.
2. Find a bar that fits into it as shown.
3. Grind off as much of the two prongs as you can (you're trying to make this as short as possible).

With this tool you will be able to remove the second problematic bolt. Once you have removed the bolts you can position the starter so the wiring nuts are accessible from the front of the car, use several extensions to reach the nuts through the manifold, pipes, wires etc.

10. On completing the job go to your local off license and buy a bottle of wine or equivalent, drink it rapidly and try to never think of this job ever again! Also stand in front of your car doing this for a while

Ps Sorry guys, couldnt upload the photos. If you need them just ask and i'll email them to you.

[billywiz]

Ps I also found cutting the starter motor studs down made it much easier to handle, space is very tight in there!

[Shoot]

I got to the starter with only disconnecting the battery. I did have to use 2. 3 inch wobble ext. a 18 inch ext. and 2 other 3 inch ext to make it easier. I slide the whole deal with the socket connected above the transmission. You have to kinda push up the insulating shit to make it fit above. with out it connected to the ratchet. put my fingers on the bolt slide the socket on to the bolt then took a shorty wrench and put it on the back nut (shitty pre 96)keeping pressure on the ext. i connected the rachet and held the shorty with one hand and with the rachet near where the drive shaft connects broke it loose and removed both bolts... it did not take very long by my hands BARLEY fit i thouhgt they would get stuck a few times.

[goforit]

I managed to remove the old starter by only removing one end of a coolant line from the firewall. I tried approaching it is several ways but this is what worked.

I ground down the side of a 16mm ring wrench to fit on the nut from above the car and used a number 12 torx socket with the extensions shown to remove the bolt from under the car. It took some patience but is very do-able. It would be nice to have a lift but I did it in my driveway with both driver's side tires up on blocks.

I placed a lit maglight near the bolt head so that I could see the general location from below the car. To get the socket in place took me getting in and out from under the car several times. It would have been much easier with a buddy.

In the pictures the black extensions are wobble extensions.

If you look hard at the pictures taken from above you can just see my socket on the bolt head.


When placing the wrench on the bolt you can use a light and look through in under the manifold an through the wires while inserting the wrench over the back of the engine.

My car is a '94 5-speed 318i

[sjsinyard]

can you send me the pix u have, if you still have them?? sjsinyard@yahoo.com
attempting this 2morow..
Cheers,

[Brent 930]

The SR0448X (the one Turner sells) doesn't require nuts.

[BlackBMWs]

I have a 94 325i, non threaded starter. I pulled the starter bolts for an auto tranny swap. With the intake manifold off, it was fairly easy to get the nuts/bolts off. PB Blaster the nut/bolt. I used a E12 external torx with a 3/8-> 1/4 adapter to a stubby 1/4 ratchet to hold the Torx bolt with a 14'' on a 3/8" ratchet for the nut. The stubby was small enough to fit on the tranny side.

5 min to pull the bolts. An hour to figure out hot to get the intake manifold off without breaking stuff. Cleaned the ICV while i'm in there. What a PITA if I was just cleaning the ICV.

Conveinent time to swap out hoses while I'm in there anyway.

[over]

I'm about to start this. It seems most people have a 318 here
I have a M50 with an automatic. I also have the threaded starter
which means I can't just "hold" the torx and crank the nuts from the
front. Does anyone know if it will be possible to remove the two
torx bolts from above (after the intake is removed) or do I have to
do at least 1 from below?

It would be nice to know if I can do the EVERYTHING from above
before I start.

Thanks!


BTW, where do you get those wobbly extensions?

[BuzzLtYr]

you can get the wobble bars at a sears hardware or harbor freight. i did something like that when i did mine. after the intake manifold is off, someone stay up top and someone underneath, with the person up top guiding the torx into the bolt then hold it there while the person on bottom unscrews it. one more thing that really made it easy for me is get a u-joint, that made getting the torx onto the bolt really easy and it makes it easier to turn.

[kaivonp]

I know I'm resurrecting an old thread here, but I did want to comment and to question:

The OP said that pre-96 e36s had a starter with un-reinforced flanges and non-threaded holes (p/n 12411740379), while post-96 cars had a starter with reinforced flanges and threaded holes (12417578684).
But realoem.com does not show ANY e36 as having the latter starter. My car (1998 328i) is listed as having the former starter (though I haven't checked because I haven't yet started this project). Another poster in this thread also said that his '97 e36 had the former starter.

I'm curious to hear from other e36 owners about what type of starter they originally found on their cars. I've emailed my local dealer (which runs penskeparts.com) and am waiting to hear back.
Since the non-threaded type bolts to the engine block with a bracket, and the threaded type bolts to the tranny without a bracket, I'm assuming that changing starters is not possible because there are different features on the engine/tranny depending on the design of the original starter.

[flyfishvt]

You can take really good light and look under the manifold. It you can see the starter look for the nuts on the stater bolts or even one of them. The bolts are inserted from the transmision side so the nuts are on the starter side. You could also look for for the bracket. If you can see the braket or the nuts for the starter bolts you have the first version. I have a 95 325 and I have the one with the braket.

You can take a starter and install it in any e36. it uses the same bolts. You can take the older style an put it into any e36 (i don't know why you would) but you will need the braket that supports it.

I had this discussion over and over when I was getting ready to do my clutch. The general consensus was just what the OP listed. 92-95 had non threaded starters and 96-98 had threaded starters without the braket.

[jmo69]

My 328 build, date 5/98, has the threaded starter. Never had it out, but had to get the bolts out when I put a different ZF 5sp in. They were the hardest bolts to get back in.

[bimmerracer2010]

does anyone have an eta on completing this from start to finish the easiest way possible??? I wanna know how long it's going to take.. def not looking forward to doing this

[flyfishvt]

On a good day 2-3 hours. On a bad day......what month is it
?

[bimmerracer2010]

lmao yaaaaa so lets just say half a day if you're working outside. why did i move back here from cali and az?? lol

[ronmoore25]

Hi all,

I came here searching for some useful information prior to replacing my starter. What I read would be a tricky albeit do-able job (forums and Haynes manual) turned out to be quite a pain.

Just wanted to inform anyone out there about to do this job themselves, the bolts from the pre-1996 starters thread into a post-1996 starter. Not sure if anyone else on the thread mentioned that.

Also, I did not find this to be a 2-hour job, as someone earlier posted. Removing the wire harness (in order to move the intake) was not an easy task. Most of the wires feed into the module from underneath the manifold.

It took me (a relatively experienced DIY-er) and a professional antique auto restorer about 6 hours in total.

Upon firing up the car, it appears we may have mis-wired something or have missed a vacuum line. Troubleshooting on a rough idle (that revs over and over) will begin this weekend.