New tubular manifold T61 dyno numbers

[moadster]

New BL turbo kit.
BL T61 .68 ar turbine

9 psi (pump gas)
407.8 whp 337.8 wtq


14.7psi (pump gas)
492.9 whp 418.4 wtq


17 psi (50/50 with 109 unleaded)
563.34 whp 484.3 wtq



I will be posting the video of the dyno's and better pictures of the dyno graph once i get the raw data file.

[BimmerBoyZ3]

Pardon my french, but HOLY SH*T!

Mark one down for the roady's!

Very impressive numbers. Between you and ShawnM, the roadsters are coming out in force!

Hopefully I will join the FI ranks soon!

[rukman]

wow...nice numbers...

what were you guys using for tuning? tec-3?

Rukman

[moadster]

wow...nice numbers...

what were you guys using for tuning? tec-3?

Rukman

This was done on the base kit w/ larger injectors and the optional upgraded MAF. E-manage was used to tweak the fuel curve.

[///3oris]

Very nice numbers, but looks like a huge exhaust. I wonder why it has late torque? What RPM do you get full boost in that baby? Any more specs please?

I'd opt for something smaller unless you plan on running more boost (you probably are...).

Boris

[rukman]

Very nice numbers, but looks like a huge exhaust. I wonder why it has late torque? What RPM do you get full boost in that baby? Any more specs please?

I'd opt for something smaller unless you plan on running more boost (you probably are...).

Boris

i was thinking the same thing...

just looked at the moadster old T61 dyno chart @ 15psi as well as Omar's old t61 chart at 19psi and noticed that tq doesn't drop off as much as it approaches redline.....

relative to the "smaller" turbos everyone else is running looks like peak boost comes on later...but once it does it stays strong...

[aceves]

Damn! That is impressive.

[gol10dr1]

very impressive. do you have any pics of this new tubular manifold. i remember you talking about this setup a while back. glad to see it is finally coming to fruition.

[moadster]

Video of the dyno runs here. Please right click and save as.

Dyno Runs

[justinn]

Nice numbers Moadster...

Now to analyze(or overanalyze) some of the posts.

Why does it spool later?
Quite Simply... turbo and manifold. This header design(tubular) is very efficient at keeping backpressure to a minimum as well as offering complete upgradability by using a T4 flange. This means that you sacrifice a little bit of spool for better engine breathing, and therefore, more efficiency. More efficiency(up top) equates to more power. This also makes for an extremely linear power and torque transition, making it much easier to drive at the limit. This way, you have a very broad torque curve for 3000rpm. If you cannot match gears to keep it in that broad of an rpm span, maybe you shouldn't be driving a BMW

There is more, but I am a little bit sleepy and need to get some rest.

FWIW, This turbocharger and MAF setup is maxed out at the current race gas levels(17psi), or we simply would have gone higher and tried to make some really impressive numbers. This combination would be perfect for a nice street/strip application when you wanted to show those menacing BPU and small single turbo Supras who the real boss is. The car is an absolute blast to drive and thoroughly impressive.

Justin

[ZimDoc]

Those are some nice numbers!!! How about some photos of this tubular manifold and turbo?

[Jaded M3]

Nice job, guys. Great numbers.

[hukalaki]

Are those numbers with stock cams or do you use a turbo cam setup?

How do you think things would change if you stuck a GT35 on there? Would you have earlier torque and maintain thru the top end?

[DakarDave]

Very nice #s.... congrats

hukalaki - I believe josh posted a dyno sheet showing the difference the GT36 Vs the T61 made on his setup... I'll see if I can dig it up and post a link...


-Dave

[hukalaki]

Very nice #s.... congrats

hukalaki - I believe josh posted a dyno sheet showing the difference the GT36 Vs the T61 made on his setup... I'll see if I can dig it up and post a link...


-Dave

Dave, Thanks. I have seen Josh's dyno sheet and note the shift to the left for the GT35. My question is whether the GT 35 would continue to support the top end the way the T61 does, or if each turbo has an effective torque band, and one is simply moving it to the right or left depending on manifold/header configuration, trim, etc.

In a related question, is the good topend from the manifold moving the t61's range to the right, or is it from turbo cams? I don't know how big the impact of cams are on spreading and flattening the torque curve, if at all.

Moadster, again, great great numbers.

[ADVANT123]

Wow, those are some awesome numbers! Congrats! Any in-car videos to see how thw T61 spools on the street?

[moadster]

Dave, Thanks. I have seen Josh's dyno sheet and note the shift to the left for the GT35. My question is whether the GT 35 would continue to support the top end the way the T61 does, or if each turbo has an effective torque band, and one is simply moving it to the right or left depending on manifold/header configuration, trim, etc.

In a related question, is the good topend from the manifold moving the t61's range to the right, or is it from turbo cams? I don't know how big the impact of cams are on spreading and flattening the torque curve, if at all.

Moadster, again, great great numbers.

This was done on stock cams. The GT35R exhaust wheel is actually 2 steps smaller than the P trim.The P trim 61, compared to the GT35R 61, should flow about 30RWHP more.

[EMC]

This was done on stock cams. The GT35R exhaust wheel is actually 2 steps smaller than the P trim.The P trim 61, compared to the GT35R 61, should flow about 30RWHP more.

Yeah...I've measure a StageV wheel, GT35R wheel, and a P-Trim all at the same time. The P-Trim is about 3 or 4mm larger diameter than the GT35R wheel.
There are some definite differences in the shape of the exhaust wheel for the GT35R compared to the straighter P-Trim and Slightly Curved StageV wheel. I'll post up some pictures of each if people are interested.

So Blaise....

Any plans to run 19 or 21 psi???

[M3TurboCa]

Great explanation Justinn, you can't have fast spool in the lower rpm and still expect to make big power up top its one or the other no if and buts.

Don't care you how size the turbo if you want to make big power up in the midrange to top end then there will always be a slight performance drop in the lower end.

I love the way this motor makes power very flat torque 4500 to 6200 rpm and then who care if torque drops off after 6200rpm the hp climbs higher, very nice.

Most other dyno posted make torque quicky and drops off within 500rpm maybe some prefer that quick spool but I prefer a wider torque band that the hp increases as the rev gets higher.

Damm once spooled must just pull so hard and solid.

Congrats.

[ADVANT123]

Anyone want to comment on what sort of software/fuel management this car is running? Is it OBDI or OBDII? How did you hook up the emanage to work? Will this software/fuel package be included with the BL kits?

Joe

[AllEyezOnMy325]

any pics of the tubular manifold and turbo setup?? i would love to see it.

[euro trash]

man that thing is crazy.

[themadhatter]

moadster - what's the CFM rating of that header at 9 psi?

those are good numbers but the torque looks a bit off. then again, I'm still a noob at the boost game so I'd like to see what's doing what for you.

thanks
Ron

[95RogueM3]

THat AFR is ridiculously good looking! Very Impressive.

[moadster]

Anyone want to comment on what sort of software/fuel management this car is running? Is it OBDI or OBDII? How did you hook up the emanage to work? Will this software/fuel package be included with the BL kits?

Joe

It is currently running an obd1 computer and wiring harness with an E manage to control fuel. I have an upgraded fuel pump, regulator, rail, injectors and MAF that is an option on BL kits.

As far as running 19-21 psi, well I would but that turbo is out of air.....maybe it't time for something bigger.