My use of Redline D4 over Esso ATF

[Trnsprtr]

Several months ago I decided that I would begin running Redline D4 ATF in my transmission. After having read countless paranoiac posts on various forums claiming that running anything but Esso would spell death for the tranny but offering no examples of this actually happening; after learning that the additives are the same between Redline and Esso; and after finding a couple independent shops that use Redline when they do tranny flushes on our cars I decided I would play guinea pig. At this point I had just over 89,000 miles on the car and I'm sure the tranny had never been touched.

My family owns an auto repair shop - my original plan was to use the transmission flusher on it to get all of the old Esso out but we didn't have the proper tool for removing the hoses from the tranny cooler - instead I replaced the filter and filled up with D4, ran it for 10-15 miles and drained and refilled with D4, then drove it for 1000 miles and drained and re-filled with D4 again.

If there were any problems with the D4 I would have noticed immediately as tranny's communicate real quick whether or not they like what you've done to them. Before the fluid change, the only issue going on with my tranny was that it had a semi-hard downshift from 3rd -> 2nd if you let it coast down from 50 or so to the point where it'd downshift on it's own. After the switch to Redline, the hard downshift was gone. Since I had no other issues going on before the switch I began only looking for problems to crop up with the tranny - they've never appeared. I drained and refilled at 1000 miles just to be sure I had all of the old Esso out.

So now I've driven it for another 10,000 miles - 1/3 of my planned transmission flush period. I dropped the pan this past weekend to be extra-sure that nothing out of the ordinary is occurring before sharing the results of my experiment. The fluid came out a couple shades darker than when it went in but still a gorgeous red, the magnet only had a light layer of gook on it (leftovers from the previous 90,000 mile run on the old fluid, I suspect), and I dissected the filter to find it was nice and clean as well. All in all I'm extremely pleased with the D4 and have no plans of ever using the Esso fluid again. Possibly the thing that makes me happiest is knowing that even after buying two transmission filters and about 30 quarts of D4 for my experiment I've still spent less than one transmission service using Esso.


Between trying not to get my camera filthy and being in a hurry to get done the pictures I took came out pretty crappy. The best way to look at fluid is in a glass container but I didn't have any - here's the dropped pan with the remainder in it, it doesn't do a good job of showing how clean everything still was:


and this one is the magnet - has some gunk on it but not even a percentage of the mound that encased it the first time I went into the tranny:


the pic I took of the filter's guts didn't come out well so I don't have that one to share.

[hungdynasty]

Thanks. It's a good news for me since it may be easier for me to get Redline in my area.

[FlyingHigh]

Nice Post! I spent a great deal of time researching this as well when I decided to change my fluid/filter about a year ago. I finally decided to cave in to the recommended fluid since I didn't want to flush it more than once. Since you have access to a shop, what a great situation for experimenting.

[Reed Hunt]

Good stuff, how much per liter for the Redline?

[Trnsprtr]

hungdynasty: That's interesting, I would have assumed that the Esso would be easier for you to get there.

FlyingHigh: Since the additives are the same between the Esso and Redline I think its pretty safe to mix the two together. I went through three times as much fluid as I really needed to just because I wanted to be sure that lack of any problems couldn't be attributed to still having some of the old Esso in there.

Reed Hunt: Depending on who you know/where you get it, D4 can be had for as little as $6/quart up to $9/quart.

[hungdynasty]

Trnsprtr I have never seen Esso LT 71141 anywhere in Hong Kong, not even the Esso gas station. Went to a search on web, nothing about LT71141 come out. Actually I can buy Redline stuff here with no problems.

[Torquewrench]

How's the tranny doing? Any degradation or change in performance? Any problems.

Thanks for the great post!

[Reed Hunt]

Wow, holy post resurrection Batman...

Trnsprtr hasn't been around much for some time, you may want to PM him...

[DaveClement]

Interesting. I'd be even more interested to hear what you think in another 50 or 100K miles. That is not meant to be sarcastic. I really would like to hear how it compares over the long term and if you have any problems.

[Torquewrench]

Wow, holy post resurrection Batman...

Trnsprtr hasn't been around much for some time, you may want to PM him...

For some reason I can't PM. Any ideas why? Could someone else PM Trnsprtr and see if he's till around?

Thanks

[Qsilver7]

are you looking for alternative Tranny fluids other than the Esso LT 71141?

If you search over on Roadfly or BimmerBoard (the e39 & e38 forums)...you'll find many posts where guys are using:

• Castrol Multi-Vehicle ATF (semi-synthetic like the ESSO ATF)
• Valvoline Mercon V (full synthetic)

The great thing is...the 2 fluids above cost about $4 per quart...which is a substantial savings.

Another benefit is that these fluids can be found at your local auto parts vendors and Wal-mart etc. These fluids even state on the packaging that it is compatible (which means it can be mixed) with Esso Lt71141....so if something were to go wrong...you could take the bottle with you to court and present it as evidence!

[Reed Hunt]

are you looking for alternative Tranny fluids other than the Esso LT 71141?

If you search over on Roadfly or BimmerBoard (the e39 & e38 forums)...you'll find many posts where guys are using:

• Castrol Multi-Vehicle ATF (semi-synthetic like the ESSO ATF)
• Valvoline Mercon V (full synthetic)

The great thing is...the 2 fluids above cost about $4 per quart...which is a substantial savings.

Another benefit is that these fluids can be found at your local auto parts vendors and Wal-mart etc. These fluids even state on the packaging that it is compatible (which means it can be mixed) with Esso Lt71141....so if something were to go wrong...you could take the bottle with you to court and present it as evidence!

Q,

....I, did not know this - good stuff.

Must learn to use that search feature thingee...

[Reed Hunt]

For some reason I can't PM. Any ideas why? Could someone else PM Trnsprtr and see if he's till around?

Thanks

Just did, I'll let you know what/if I hear...

[Torquewrench]

are you looking for alternative Tranny fluids other than the Esso LT 71141?

If you search over on Roadfly or BimmerBoard (the e39 & e38 forums)...you'll find many posts where guys are using:

• Castrol Multi-Vehicle ATF (semi-synthetic like the ESSO ATF)
• Valvoline Mercon V (full synthetic)

The great thing is...the 2 fluids above cost about $4 per quart...which is a substantial savings.

Another benefit is that these fluids can be found at your local auto parts vendors and Wal-mart etc. These fluids even state on the packaging that it is compatible (which means it can be mixed) with Esso Lt71141....so if something were to go wrong...you could take the bottle with you to court and present it as evidence!

According to Valvoline's website Mercon V is a synthetic blend.

I have 2 quarts of Redline D4 ATF, but I'm leaning towards using the Mercon V, in part because they claim it's compatible and the price doesn't hurt either. I guess I'll let you know how it goes.

[Qsilver7]

According to Valvoline's website Mercon V is a synthetic blend...

Thanks for the correction...that's what I get for posting something important like this without double checking my facts first.

[Reed Hunt]

Thanks for the correction...that's what I get for posting something important like this without double checking my facts first.

To the penalty box with you then!

[Trnsprtr]

Just tying up loose ends:
I sold the car several months ago with 160k or so on the clock. Nary a problem with the transmission.

I can't say whether it's due to Redline or a well-built transmission but I can say BMW, ZF, or Esso has done a great job in terrorizing BMW owners into believing that they face certain doom if they don't use Esso fluid - it's a complete fabrication.

I also know it wasn't due to my leisurely driving style - as the already bald rear tires on my IS350 can attest to.

[BMW5868]

I'm a esso / mobil 1 as well as castrol dealer. I tried to order esso lt71141 figuring i could save a few bucks as well as some of my other buddies. Well i got this phone call back for my sales rep - like two minutes later - told me that is only for sale through Europe and only thru BMW and that we are not allowed to buy it directly from NOCO (they are our esso/ mobil 1 supplier in Canada) and if i want to buy it i would have order it from a BMW dealer. Well i dont know if you can buy it in the US from another supplier but this could be the reason. They did tell me however that even their mobil synth ATF was different and not to use either it nor the VW esso equililant as they did not meet spec. Castrol aslo said the same thing. So i dont know who right or who's wrong so to be on the safer side i've stuck with the OEM fluid. It costs me around $26/liter with my discount from the dealer. This is funny but they only sell it by the milliliter and i have to bring my own jug - crazy.

[M62pwrdE38]

Yeah, I bought Esso yesterday from the dealer, costs $11 for 1/2 liter (after a 20% discount)! And they charged me $12 for 2 jugs.

[PaveIt]

I'm a esso / mobil 1 as well as castrol dealer. I tried to order esso lt71141 figuring i could save a few bucks as well as some of my other buddies. Well i got this phone call back for my sales rep - like two minutes later - told me that is only for sale through Europe and only thru BMW and that we are not allowed to buy it directly from NOCO (they are our esso/ mobil 1 supplier in Canada) and if i want to buy it i would have order it from a BMW dealer. Well i dont know if you can buy it in the US from another supplier but this could be the reason. They did tell me however that even their mobil synth ATF was different and not to use either it nor the VW esso equililant as they did not meet spec. Castrol aslo said the same thing. So i dont know who right or who's wrong so to be on the safer side i've stuck with the OEM fluid. It costs me around $26/liter with my discount from the dealer. This is funny but they only sell it by the milliliter and i have to bring my own jug - crazy.

Thats nuts!!

[PaveIt]

Yeah, I bought Esso yesterday from the dealer, costs $11 for 1/2 liter (after a 20% discount)! And they charged me $12 for 2 jugs.

Thats even nuttier

[PaveIt]

I went over to a highly respected tranny shop here in town today. They work on everything from corvettes to 18 wheel trucks as far as tranny's go. I asked him for a quote on a tranny flush, he said they would use Amsoil. I probably won't have him do just because I plan on doing it at my shop here soon, but will post the quote he gives me just for shits and giggles.

[BMW5868]

The only saving grace is that i can do at my shop, I do use a tranny flush machine, it takes a few litre's just to flush it out. I get about 20 litre's from the dealer - I also changed the filter and gasket. It still a $650.00 (cdn) service for me. I have been told there is a european oil called Mannheim (sp?) that is suppose to be compatible and they say they will guarantee it in writing, i still have the info at the office, buried somwewhwere, so if anyone is interested i will post it.

[m5james]

Good stuff, how much per liter for the Redline?

Wanna help each other out and make a weekend of it?

[RaritanSailor]

I replaced the tranny fluid on my 00-740iL (ZF 5HP24 - Green Label) with the suggested Esso LT, but my 94-740iL has a ZF 5HP30 - Black label, which calls for the Shell LA 2634... Has anyone used the Redline D4 in this application?

I've heard of folks using Mobile 1 ATF, Valvoline MaxLife ATF, Penzoil Multi Vehicle ATF, and even Amsoil ATF in place of the Shell LA, but no one has ever mention Redline D4, NOR have I ever heard what results any of these prognosticators had by doing this in a 5HP30-Shell LA 2634 Tranny.

So, bottom line, has anyone used D4 in one of these? Any of the other fluids mentioned? If so, what was the outcome? My E32 has a LOT of miles on it, and I really don't want to spend $30/Liter on the Shell, but by the same token, I don't want to toast it outright either!

Regards!