540i osv oil catch can conversion

[AK_5eries]

Just for clarification: PCV, CCV, OSV, all same thing, right? Also, wouldn't it just be easier to change the problem part:

http://home.comcast.net/~vicent/osve38.html
http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1445581

That is the problem part, correct?
Parts will run you less than $100.

[fletchermse]

PCV, CCV, and OSV are frequently used interchangeably to refer to the part which you linked. The real OSV (the problematic one) lies inside the case.

Although that part can cause similar symptoms, it is not necessarily the only problem part in this situation. Part #1, the oil separator in the picture below, has a tendency to break in cold weather, and is oh-so-conveniently hidden behind the lower timing case. As such, replacement is either incredibly tedious and time consuming, or incredibly expensive. This approach is an inexpensive alternative to replacing the oil separator. The oil catch can performs the exact same function as the oil separator here, but is just located outside of the engine.



I plan on tackling this job within the next 2-3 weeks, and intend on posting some pictures of the process to supplement this thread.

[fletchermse]

As promised, I installed my catch can this morning and documented the process to help anyone else who may be interested.

Here is the process I used to install the 42 Draft Designs Oil Catch Can. What I did worked for me, but as always, any work done here is at your own risk. I did not find the job to be difficult – it’s on par with changing the valve cover gaskets, and requires removal of most of the same things. From start to finish took me approximately 4 hours, which included a trip to Lowe’s and Autozone to get a rubber stopper and JB weld stick.



Parts & Materials Used:

42 Draft Designs Steal Oil Catch Can
http://www.42draftdesigns.com/catego...catchcans.html

90 Degree Threaded PCV Fitting (3/4”)
http://store.42draftdesigns.com/PCV-...tic_p_364.html
*NOTE - This is an Eldon James brand fitting.

6-8 Feet of ¾” ID PCV Tubing
http://store.42draftdesigns.com/34-P...oot_p_293.html
*NOTE – I only ordered 3 feet to make the run from the OSV to the can. I had some ¾” nitrile tubing, and used that for the other hose. I intend to purchase more tubing to replace the nitrile tubing, which is a bit more flimsy and prone to kinking. 7-8 feet of tube/hose will be plenty with some to spare.

J-B STIK
http://jbweld.net/products/jbstik.php

4 ¾” Hose Clamps

1 ¾” Rubber Stopper
*NOTE – This may not have been necessary to plug the open hole in the CCV. I doubled it up with the J-B STIK to seal it.

2 Zip Ties
*NOTE – Used for temporary mounting of the catch can.0

Canned Air (Keyboard / computer cleaner)
*NOTE – I used this to blow out the intake ports before reinstalling to make sure nothing was in there, and to blow excess plastic out of the CCV while Dremel-ing.

7 Hex Bolts
*NOTE – Completely optional. This is to replace the Torx bolts on the CCV if you haven’t already done so. I did this a while ago, and unfortunately do not remember the size.


Tools Used:

10mm Socket
13mm Socket
T30 Torx Bit
Ratchet and extensions for above sockets/bits
Knife (for cutting tubing)
Dremel
Flathead Screwdriver
Bit/Socket Driver
Needle Nose Pliers


The above lists are just a guideline and for reference only, as I likely forgot a tool or something needed somewhere along the way. There are a handful of DIYs out there that show how to remove the intake manifold – these are usually associated with valley pan gasket how-to’s. As such, I’m going to start this writeup assuming you have the intake manifold off and are ready to go.

When you get to the point where you’re ready to get working on the catch can installation, the engine should look something like this:



At this point, two things need to be removed for modification – the CCV and tube that connects to it. The latter is absent in the above picture, but the location is indicated with a red line. The two parts being modified are:

Vent Pipe, P/N 11151705301
Cover, P/N 11617501563 (CCV)



The fitting at the end of the vent pipe will be reused. To remove it, remove the clamp and slice the tubing so that it may be removed.





There are two ports on the CCV. The one that is currently open (faces the front of the vehicle and connects to the vent pipe) must be sealed, while the other needs to be opened so that a new fitting may be installed.



To do this, I used the Dremel bit shown below on the left to clear out the thin plastic wall blocking the second port. I used a grinding wheel bit to smooth the inner surface a bit. The ¾” threaded fitting will not fit into the port as-is. Slowly grind down the threads until you can get a good, secure, press fit into the port. At this point I used the edge of a small flathead screwdriver to clear out excess plastic from the threads.

NOTE – A lot of fibrous plastic debris will come off of the CCV during grinding. Make sure you get it all out! I tapped it on the toolbox to get most out, then blew it out with canned air to ensure I got the rest.







Now the open port must be sealed and the new fitting secured. Insert the rubber stopper into the open port and push it in so it is slightly recessed. If the stopped protrudes into the path of the other port, take it out and trim it down. The recess will be filled with J-B STIK (be sure to follow the directions on the box when mixing/using) to prevent the stopper from popping out. As noted earlier, the stopper may not be necessary if you want to use an alternate method to seal the hole. I filled the recess with the putty, then scraped it flush.



Insert the 90 degree elbow and align it so that the opening faces upward as mounted on the vehicle. Ensure that the elbow is pressed in securely. Again, using J-B STIK, secure the fitting to the CCV. I did this by mixing a small amount, rolling it into a round strip, and then wrapping it around the joint.





The PCV tubing sold by 42 Draft Designs is just heater hose. Connect the hose to the fitting removed from the vent tube earlier using a hose clamp.





With the intake manifold off, reattach the CCV. If you haven’t done so already, now is a great time to replace those troublesome Torx bolts with hex bolts. As you can see, my manifold had quite a bit of oil in it.





Take the hose with the vent tube fitting and insert it into the socket from which it was removed. It may take a good push to get it in. Prior to the job I was somewhat concerned that this may be able to pop out since it will no longer have the secured tube and spring, but the fit is quite tight and secure, and at this time I am not worried about it coming loose. However, if you can devise a good way to make sure it stays in place, it would be advisable to do so. I routed the hose as shown below, around and behind the engine.



If you plugged the intake ports after removing the intake manifold (which is advisable), remove any material from the ports and reinstall the intake.



The catch can does have a drain port, but I did not install a drain or tap into the drain line at this time. Since it’s easily accessible, I plan on going back later and installing it. I'll likely tap into "#15" mentioned earlier in this thread.

Something I neglected to do at this point was attach a hose to the new port on the CCV. While it’s not difficult to do it last, you do have less room in which to tighten the hose clamp, and it is a bit easier to go ahead and do now.



Now, with everything essential back together, I installed the actual catch can. The hose coming from the OSV is circled in red below. This will go into the inlet port (BOTTOM PORT) on the catch can. The hose going to the CCV can be seen draped over the side of the engine bay. This hose is routed almost the same way as the inlet hose. I trimmed it to size once I found a temporary location for the can.





I fastened the catch can to the power steering reservoir bracket using a couple zip ties to keep it upright. I’ll find a more permanent solution at a later date.




Everything back together:



The only victim in this process was my poor engine cover. It got down to just over freezing this morning, and I think the plastic on one of the mounts had just had enough at that temperature.

[fahrfegneugen]

This thread is awesome! I am having the same problem right now, just with the m60 in my e38.

How are the engines at idle? Any issues?

I think you could just drain the oil back to the pan, like the e36, through the dip stick http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts...87&hg=11&fg=15

The e36 dipstick might even be the right height. One would have to make their own bracket though.

[fletchermse]

My idle is unchanged since the install, but I wasn't having problems with it before.

I did finish the installation with a tap into a drain line and a crude homemade bracket. There was probably about a 1/2 cup of oil in the can when I went back to finish the job. Slipped my mind to take pictures and update the thread - I'll do that this weekend.

[fletchermse]

Here are pictures of the catch can in its almost-final state. Only thing I'd like to do is make a better bracket and get it properly fastened. One thing to note, when I finished it up, the JB-Stik had cracked a bit (go figure), so I removed the fitting and reinstalled it with an epoxy on the contact surfaces. Should hold this time around.

Parts list for the last bit:

6 Feet of Heater Hose
- Purchase as a pre-cut length from Autozone for $6. Same brand and markings as that I bought previously from 42DD.

1 Drain Fitting
- Purchased from 42DD. Is Eaton brand, and has a "97" stamped on the handle.

1 3/8" Brass Tee

3 1/4"-5/8" Hose Clamps

3 90-Degree Elbows
- Purchased from 42DD again. The fittings are made by Eldon James (http://www.eldonjames.com/index.html), P/N L0-12 GFBN, and can be purchased from their site directly in quantities of 10 or more at a greatly reduced price. Shipping, however, is killer.

4 3/4" Hose Clamps

1 Shoddy DIY Bracket
- I made this from a scrap piece of 0.0625" 2024-T6 aluminum. At this thickness it isn't rigid or strong enough for long term use, but it does well at keeping it up and not bouncing around too much.

~1 foot of reinforced PVC tubing
- Purchased this from Lowe's for the drain line. The line itself is only maybe 6", and I keep the spare piece in the trunk in case it turns out the tube can't handle this application long-term.


I installed the bracket underneath the power steering reservoir on its mount. The "#15" drain line mentioned before is on the bottom-front of the oil filter housing. I just cut it about mid-way in the visible section, and T'd the catch can drain line in using the brass tee. Without clamps, the fit wasn't as snug as I would like, but with clamps it seems to be sufficient, as I haven't seen any leaks yet.

[add is fun]

got mine done this weekend. something i discovered about the piece at the end coming off the manifold is that the end is just a cap. you dont need to remove it and dremel. i used a hammer and screwdriver around the edge to break it off and the cap popped right out.

[fahrfegneugen]

^cool

I didn't know the catch cans were so spendy. Do they come apart for cleaning? I would hate to have a clogged one.

[Kiyoskia]

So let me make sure I have understood this correctly...



Is this correct? And this has caused no problems with crankcase/PCV pressure and VANOS and whatnot?

[bmwhiteman]

So let me make sure I have understood this correctly...

Is this correct? And this has caused no problems with crankcase/PCV pressure and VANOS and whatnot?

Yes that is correct only you don't need a check valve. I've been running my setup for almost 20,000 miles now and have zero smoke and zero oil consumption.

[Cyrix2k]

This is helpful for my e30. Thanks guys!

[Kiyoskia]

So the vaccuum created by the intake manifold IS enough to suck oil from the original cyclone separator (by the timing chain), but it ISN'T enough to prevent oil from draining back to the oil pan?

...oh, well that makes sense, because even if both the INLET and the OIL OUTLET lines are filled with oil, the INLET will eventually run dry, establishing an air connection between the crankcase and the intake manifold's PCV via the oil catch can.

My last question is...

Why not use the OSV from an X5 instead of an aftermarket catch-and-drain can?

[add is fun]

because a catch can is cheaper, easier, and less likely to freeze and crack again.

[Kiyoskia]

The OS from an X5 is $35. Unfortunately, though, it isn't as easy to mount as an aftermarket one.

I'm having a little trouble with the hose that runs from the stock OS to the new OS inlet...how did you get the 3/4" hose underneath the PCV on the back of the intake manifold?!

[fletchermse]

The hose will run to the lower right side of the CCV - plenty of room.

[Kiyoskia]

Doesn't that kink the hose a little?...or does it not matter?

[fletchermse]

There should be enough room for the hose to pass by the CCV and come around to the front in a wide bend without any kinking. I used a single 90 degree elbow later for better fit.

[EditTim]

Awesome thread guys!

I'm in the process of replacing my CCV, made more difficult due to the fact that I'm currently recovering from a broken left arm (I'm right handed), and doing the job with one hand/arm is well, tricky.

Anyhoo, I've managed to get 5 of the 7 torx fasteners out. The last two are giving me trouble. They are well on their way to being stripped, although I hope to get them out while there is some bite left with help from a friend tomorrow.

I've got a 540i6 w/ approx 114k miles.

Question... IF I need to remove the intake manifold because the last 2 torx become hopelessly stripped, does it make sense to go ahead and do the oil catch can mod while everything is out?

[Kiyoskia]

There should be enough room for the hose to pass by the CCV and come around to the front in a wide bend without any kinking. I used a single 90 degree elbow later for better fit.

Yeah, I noticed the 3/4" hose kinking a little bit as it made its way around Bank 2...I'll probably use two 90-degree elbows for the hose that runs from the old OS to the new OS.

Awesome thread guys!

I'm in the process of replacing my CCV, made more difficult due to the fact that I'm currently recovering from a broken left arm (I'm right handed), and doing the job with one hand/arm is well, tricky.

Anyhoo, I've managed to get 5 of the 7 torx fasteners out. The last two are giving me trouble. They are well on their way to being stripped, although I hope to get them out while there is some bite left with help from a friend tomorrow.

I've got a 540i6 w/ approx 114k miles.

Question... IF I need to remove the intake manifold because the last 2 torx become hopelessly stripped, does it make sense to go ahead and do the oil catch can mod while everything is out?

First off, let us clarify what the PCV (Positive Crankcase Ventilation) valve and OS (Oil Separator) are:
When the engine demands air but the throttle plate is shut, it gets its air via the plate on the back of the intake manifold (the PCV), which in turn gets its air from inside the crankcase, only after the Oil Separator has done its job of sucking in dirty crankcase air and sending the oil in that air back to the oil pan. So basically, air goes from:
Crankcase -> Oil Separator -> PCV -> Intake Manifold -> Combustion Chamber...and the rest is history.

PCV replacement is not a task for the weak of arm, or the weak of butt. If you have a broken arm, it's best to get a friend to help.

If you're stripping torx heads, take out the intake manifold and use an air gun to get them out...then replace them with hex-headed bolts (M6x1.0x25 - 6mm wide, 1.0mm thread, 25mm long). It will simplify your life when the time comes again to replace your PCV.

Since you need to remove the intake manifold, it makes sense to do the external oil separator (catch can) retrofit. Even if your current stock Oil Separator is fully functional, it can't hurt to have a secondary oil Separator, just in case your first one fails. Besides...until your stock Oil Separator fails and starts sending buckets out of your crankcase, the secondary system won't ever see a drop of oil.

[bmwhiteman]

Doesn't that kink the hose a little?...or does it not matter?

Not if you use braided steel line. And I would be careful with heater hose, oil will make it swell and deteriorate.
I like all the additions people have made to this thread and Im glad somebody did a good picture DIY. I was too lazy

[Kiyoskia]

Not if you use braided steel line. And I would be careful with heater hose, oil will make it swell and deteriorate.
I like all the additions people have made to this thread and Im glad somebody did a good picture DIY. I was too lazy

I went ahead and bought 4 feet of braided steel line, and it seems to run around the back of bank 2 pretty well.

I'm trying to retrofit the X5 external OS in place of the 42DD catch can. It may take a some fabrication, though, to hold it in place. I'm thinking about mounting it right behind the power steering reservoir...any thoughts?

[Jason5driver]

I went ahead and bought 4 feet of braided steel line, and it seems to run around the back of bank 2 pretty well.

I'm trying to retrofit the X5 external OS in place of the 42DD catch can. It may take a some fabrication, though, to hold it in place. I'm thinking about mounting it right behind the power steering reservoir...any thoughts?

Nice 7!
I would like to see some pictures of the final product when done...
Thanks!

Jason

[EditTim]

...PCV replacement is not a task for the weak of arm, or the weak of butt. If you have a broken arm, it's best to get a friend to help.

Agreed, I'm just impatient. I managed to get 6 of the 7 out. The one that's stripped is the top passenger side torx, so I'm tempted to squeeze my reciprocating saw in there to cut off the tork head. The ccv, sorry, PCV will slide right off at that point, and the remaining fastener shaft should twist right out. At least that's how it should go in my head.

EDIT: This actually worked and I was able to replace the PCV and button everything back together, despite my bad arm, yay.

If you're stripping torx heads, take out the intake manifold and use an air gun to get them out...then replace them with hex-headed bolts (M6x1.0x25 - 6mm wide, 1.0mm thread, 25mm long). It will simplify your life when the time comes again to replace your PCV.

I've already got the replacement M6's, thanks!

Since you need to remove the intake manifold, it makes sense to do the external oil separator (catch can) retrofit. Even if your current stock Oil Separator is fully functional, it can't hurt to have a secondary oil Separator, just in case your first one fails. Besides...until your stock Oil Separator fails and starts sending buckets out of your crankcase, the secondary system won't ever see a drop of oil.

That is what I was thinking. Very glad I found this thread.

EDIT: After I successfully replaced the PCV and did a road test, everything is much better (Idle, no spaceship noise), although perhaps not perfect, we'll see in the next couple days. Not sure if the white/blue smoke is completely gone yet or not. I will be undertaking the oil catch can mod regardless, I have time now to let my arm heal up before dealing with the intake manifold. In the meantime, I'm going to start purchasing parts. On that note...

Once intake manifold is out, should I also replace the Valley pan gasket and/or upper timing cover gaskets while I'm in there? What else?

Thanks so much!!!!

[Kiyoskia]

Agreed, I'm just impatient. I managed to get 6 of the 7 out. The one that's stripped is the top passenger side torx, so I'm tempted to squeeze my reciprocating saw in there to cut off the tork head. The ccv, sorry, PCV will slide right off at that point, and the remaining fastener shaft should twist right out. At least that's how it should go in my head.

I've already got the replacement M6's, thanks!



That is what I was thinking. Very glad I found this thread.

So, if the intake manifold is out, should I also replace the Valley pan gasket and/or upper timing cover gaskets while I'm in there? What else?

Thanks so much!!!!

Don't worry about calling the PCV the "CCV"...it's the same thing, really. PCV means "positive crankcase ventilation", which is just a certain type of "CrankCase Ventilation" (CCV) system. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crankca...ilation_system

When you pull the PCV toward the back of the car, it will dislodge itself from the tube that connects the PCV to the Oil Separator (I don't call it an OSV because there's no valve in it) at the front of the engine, behind the driver's side (Bank 2) timing chain. Just make sure that when the PCV is loose, you pull it toward the back of the car, reach back there and disconnect the tube (it'll take a little tug, that's all) before lifting the PCV up from behind the intake manifold.

Those M6's will make your life SO much easier if you ever need to access your PCV again. Ask me how I know...

While the intake manifold is out, you should replace is the gasket between the intake manifold and the intake valves. You COULD replace your valve cover gaskets while your "black boxes" are off, and while you're at it, the upper timing cover gaskets shouldn't be too much of a hassle...but the valley pan gasket requires removing the water pump, which means taking off the fan clutch and what-not....not my cup of tea.

[EditTim]

Don't worry about calling the PCV the "CCV"...it's the same thing, really. PCV means "positive crankcase ventilation", which is just a certain type of "CrankCase Ventilation" (CCV) system. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crankca...ilation_system...

...Those M6's will make your life SO much easier if you ever need to access your PCV again. Ask me how I know...

While the intake manifold is out, you should replace is the gasket between the intake manifold and the intake valves. You COULD replace your valve cover gaskets while your "black boxes" are off, and while you're at it, the upper timing cover gaskets shouldn't be too much of a hassle...but the valley pan gasket requires removing the water pump, which means taking off the fan clutch and what-not....not my cup of tea.

Ha, yeah... so many names and acronyms for parts. Every time I see PCV, I'm thinking "Power Commander V" from my motorcycle forums.

Those M6 hex's are MUCH easier to deal with.

OK, so... (1)intake valve gaskets, (2)valve cover gaskets, and (3)upper timing cover gaskets, while the intake manifold is off. Perfect, thanks so much. I think I will pass on the valley pan gasket for the time being. So far I don't see evidence of it leaking... so far, lol.

Time to look up some part #'s and look for a good DIY intake manifold how-to.

Thanks again!