Z3/MZ3's with Roll Bars/Roll Cages & Racing Seats - Any Regrets?

[OldYoda]

Hello all,

I have been thinking for a year or more now about adding some of these things; seats, harness and maybe a bar. I was wondering if anyone who has done this may have some kind of regret after they did it? I have been going to the track more regularly, so, I have been thinking that it may be a good investment. I've seen some pictures and it does add to it, kind of a mean, aggressive look.

Also, the question of street driving presents it self. Is it worth the trade off, of the ease of the stock setup. Now I know it's my car and I have to like it, but I must also ask this. While, I know it's a personal opinion between women, but in any experience have you found that they do not care for it in anyway.

Thanks for you time guys.

[twinscrewed]

i added a bar this summer- cam out nice- but you lose some critical seat space...if I were 1/2 inch taller I would not fit in the car. Sure it looks cool- but that a terrible reason to do it. I spent 5 years tracking the car 10 plus days a hear with a HMS harness bar. If you are looking for a good way to attach belts, add some stiffness to chasis and not effect interior space, the harness bar is the way to go. Downide it it is not a roll bar in any sense of the word. I happen to have it for sale..if you are interested- PM me..

[OldYoda]

It's not totally look I'm worried about. It's just that it won't be a dedicated track car. I will still be cruising the street as I love to do. As for the offer on the bar I will consider it, thanks for your input.

[Rokomis]

I have been daily driving a fixed back racing seat for almost 3 years now and I have loved every minute of it.

[The ZED]

Fixed back racing seats here for about the same time as Rokomis, more specifically Sparco Fighters and I love every minute I'm in them. Probably the best mod that I've done and I've put about 80k on the car with these seats.

[Randy Forbes]

I did a rollbar for local 2.8 Coupe owner, and he already had racing seats prior to that. I hope he drops in and adds his take on this, as I'm sure you'll get another positive response. He likes doing track days at Nelson Ledges.

I'm just on the west side of Toledo, and made the rollbar for his Coupe, along with doing his trunkfloor/differential mount reinforcement.

[OldYoda]

Thanks for the input guys. I've been on the fence about this stuff for so long now. I just, for the moment anyway, can't get past the whole changing the look so dramatically thing. However, I'm sure it's just a quirk I can easily get over.

Any pics you can throw at me would also be great.

[MC28REPSOL]

well, for me i like it. i think it's more comfortable then the stock seat (once you get in). i find that girls don't like it so in the very near future i'm going to replace my passenger seat with something less restrictive for them. my racetech's seem to have a higher side bolster then most so a little harder to get into. a roll bar shouldn't really shouldn't take away any room currently there. if you need Max Room i suggest you go with a Custom Set Up (made for your car with your requirements) and not some generic model.

Here's what mine looks like (picture by StarReaver ... Thanks):



ps .... if your interested in some Racetech's i can give you a good deal on my passenger seat.

[z3papa]

I've found that once in, race seats are actually more comfortable/supportive than stock seats. After a few entries, getting in an out is much less of an issue and now it seems like an afterthought.

[ragnarok2late]

I'm who Randy installed the roll bar for, and my setup doesn't look too different than MC28REPSOL's, there, except I have Corbeau Forzas. I'm happy with the setup, the seats are perfectly comfy after 2 years (or more), the only caveat I have is: the vertical side bolsters are kinda aggressive, to get in and out of on a DD...might choose a more open seat design next time. Other than that small issue, no regrets at all...

[Mbryo]

I think this guy regrets his design:




Get it done right so you don't end up with a ROFLCAGE like the one above.
(see feet poking out in 2nd pic)

BTW, MC28, that's hot!!!

[Randy Forbes]

I don't see the feet; was the driver killed?

There are no forward-facing bars (at least visible in the 1st picture) so it looks like he was racing with just a bolt-in type of "street" bar.

From these pictures, it's hard to say what failed; did the main hoop just collapse upon impact, or did the floor plates rip out of the sheetmetal? On closer look, I DO see the bottom of the main hoop pushed through the floorpan.

Ask Bill (Ragnarok) why his won't break through the floor of his Coupe

[bmellott]

I tracked the coupe since Ive owned it 2002, it see's some where between 30~35 days a year. Last winter it finally got seat's bar and belts.

I went with a recliner type seat since I also drive it to all events, as far North as Mt. T and Mosport and far south as VIR. Couldn't imagine driving is a shell that long. But that said a hybrid seat does not hold you as well as a shell, not matter how tight you make the belts.

Do I regret doing it? including all the other stuff? TCK, etc.
On some level yes, rug's and back panels required cutting to accomidate the bar (no matter how well, it's still cut)
The TCK DA 450/500 suspension is great, personally I think to stiff for DD (and I dont mean the occasional weekend blast, true DD), the shocks with their valving are noisy.
The car see's more "ware and tear" then normal,paint .. mines like sand blasted.

All that ... Think long and hard at what you want, then make the decision.
It's hard to go back, buy new rug, side panels, etc.

I love tracking and driving the coupe. In an ideal situation I'd have two, track and street.

[dougmcintyre]

Originally Posted by bmellott

The TCK DA 450/500 suspension is great, personally I think to stiff for DD (and I dont mean the occasional weekend blast, true DD),

I've only had my TCK SA 450/500 suspension for a week, but I'm having no problem with DD. Much better ride than my 98K M suspension (which I DD'd for the last 3 years). Also, much better ride than my 318 TI with Bilstein sport shocks and HR sport springs

Even my wife commented, while on a country road, how much better the ride was with the TC Kline's.

[GB5416]

I don't see the feet; was the driver killed?

That was my first reaction, feet sticking out? I think he is referring to the rollbar bases protruding through the floor pan. Looks like the bar is probably intact, it just punched through the underbody where it was mounted. But I have the same question, what happened to the driver?

[rf900rkw]

Yep. Looks like a simple street/show hoop with a single back brace. It punched right through the floorpan. And if a proper 5 point harness was used, there's a really good chance the guy was not okay.

Years ago, it took me a while to understand why, in autocross classes that didn't require a bar or cage, SCCA insisted that if you had one, it HAD to meet their rules. This here is a good example.

[Rokomis]

Originally Posted by z3papa

I've found that once in, race seats are actually more comfortable/supportive than stock seats. After a few entries, getting in an out is much less of an issue and now it seems like an afterthought.

I have the Corbeau Forza seats and getting in and out isn't as bad as the Racetechs, but really doesn't bother me that much on trips where I am constantly getting in and out of the car.

[pfrangip]

I installed the Hard Dog rollbar for my 2.8 '97 Roadster and I absolutely love it. It significantly reduced shaking and improved stiffness.

I've never been in an accident with it, though, so I can't attest to it's strength, but it sure feels like you could drop a bulldozer on it. It's certainly stronger than the windshield.

[MC28REPSOL]

Originally Posted by rf900rkw

Yep. Looks like a simple street/show hoop with a single back brace. It punched right through the floorpan. And if a proper 5 point harness was used, there's a really good chance the guy was not okay.

Years ago, it took me a while to understand why, in autocross classes that didn't require a bar or cage, SCCA insisted that if you had one, it HAD to meet their rules. This here is a good example.

i wouldn't be so quick to judge on if it was a Legal Bar or not. every rule book i have seen for bars indicate a specific size base either welded to the floor pan or if it's bolted in be sandwiched with another plate on the bottom and as you can see whether it was welded or bolted in or even if it was a Show Type Bar i'm sure we can all agree it wasn't the bar that failed. it was the floor pan.

[OldYoda]

It's pictures like that, that could easily make me sold. It's strange to think that you put a bar in to save your life and the floor pan is the thing that goes on you. Hope the driver was fine.

[rf900rkw]

I didn't say or imply the bar was illegal for whatever sanction this was. What I did imply is the bar is not SCCA legal for any class, including Solo2. There is more than enough visible in the first pic to see that there is no triangulation. Therefore it is a street grade bar.

And yes, attachment is an integral part of bar design.

[bmellott]

Originally Posted by dougmcintyre

I've only had my TCK SA 450/500 suspension for a week, but I'm having no problem with DD. Much better ride than my 98K M suspension (which I DD'd for the last 3 years). Also, much better ride than my 318 TI with Bilstein sport shocks and HR sport springs

Even my wife commented, while on a country road, how much better the ride was with the TC Kline's.

It's always a personal preference. I find the TCK much "stiffer" then stock and true "better", but loader overall in the car and bumper are much more noticed.
Bilstein is a different shock, have them in the 99M I fidn them between stock and my TCK, very nice for a DD

I was recently it a S54 with like 25K on it and stock suspension, very nice.

With the roads arond here I wouldn't do a more then a Bilstein for DD

But that's me

[Rokomis]

Originally Posted by pfrangip

I installed the Hard Dog rollbar for my 2.8 '97 Roadster and I absolutely love it. It significantly reduced shaking and improved stiffness.

I've never been in an accident with it, though, so I can't attest to it's strength, but it sure feels like you could drop a bulldozer on it. It's certainly stronger than the windshield.

Don't be so quick to judge the a-pillars on our cars...they are far more stout than you'd think.

[MC28REPSOL]

Originally Posted by rf900rkw

I didn't say or imply the bar was illegal for whatever sanction this was. What I did imply is the bar is not SCCA legal for any class, including Solo2. There is more than enough visible in the first pic to see that there is no triangulation. Therefore it is a street grade bar.

And yes, attachment is an integral part of bar design.

and your point is? street bar or not. triangulated or not. it doesn't look like the BAR Failed. it was the floor pan, for what ever reason the bar punched through the floor .... Mounting Plate and all.

well, here's some pic's of my bar and whether or not it's legal for anything doesn't really matter if the front floor pan gives way! is it partially welded to the rocker panel ? yes, but if the floor gives way it doesn't really matter does it? and there is no real way to know how that bar in the crash was installed anyway. all we know is that the front legs of the roll bar pushed through the floor.

[Car54]

Are we talking coupe or roadster in this thread?

Here are some shots of my coupe.

Parts list:
Sparco Evo 2+
G-Force 6-pt harness
VAC side and floor mounts for the passenger
custom floor and side mounts for driver w/ Sparco slider
Clip in adapters for harness
custom stock 3pt mounts
fully custom roll bar with driver and passenger triangulation