This is lengthy, because I want to be as transparent as possible about what happened when I ordered from BavToys, and the results of that decision. Everything posted here is in order, and verbatim.
I ordered Ordered Prolumen 35w 5k bulbs from BavToys because one of mine had burned out. I know that's the temperature I needed, because the bulbs I already had were labeled:
What I received weren't labeled:
And more than that, they arrived in a box labeled incorrectly without a packing slip to verify what the contents were. I contacted support@bavtoys.com. Below is the conversation (all quotes from BavToys are sic).
Originally Posted by AdamThe bulbs weren't marked. I trusted that BavToys fulfilled the order properly, so I installed them.Originally Posted by BavToys
I know that no two bulbs will match exactly, but what I was sent and what I had already were clearly different color temperatures.
Below is the email I sent after installing one of them:
This was his response:Originally Posted by Adam
Here's the email thread that follows:Originally Posted by BavToys
Originally Posted by AdamOriginally Posted by BavToysOriginally Posted by AdamI had been perfectly nice up to this point, but the idea that they are incapable of making mistakes irked me. I had asked nicely for a replacement 3 times and was refused.Originally Posted by BavToys
What else could I do? They have no shipping address on their website, (which was purchased through a proxy service anyway). As an unsatisfied consumer, my only recourse was to share my experience with others. As for litigation, I have a lawyer on retainer, and he's bored. I'd love to gather the rest of the customer's he has defrauded and pursue something along those lines. Fraud is what we're talking about here, isn't it? To misrepresent something to a consumer, then take their money in exchange for something different?Originally Posted by Adam
My last email resulted in a callback from Ory/Ouri/Orrie (none of his messages had a name on them, so who knows?).
He was pretty upset, saying I was threatening him and "that's now how he does business". He wanted me to send him my working light along with the two he sent so he could compare them. In between being interrupted several times, I told him that given the lost trust I had in him and his company that this was not a suitable solution. He then suggested that I contest the purchase via PayPal before hanging up on me.
I did as he suggested and contested the purchase via PayPal, describing the situation as you see here. His one and only response recommended that I mail the bulbs back.
I asked for a return shipping address so that I could do that. I got no reply.
A few days later I asked again. No reply.
Third time the day after that. No reply.
Fourth time a day later, with my intention to escalate the claim to a higher level of PayPal resolution. At this point it had been a week without a word from him. No reply.
My PayPal claim was rejected.
That SAME DAY, I receive an email from BavToys, rubbing it in:Originally Posted by PayPal
As for BavToys being my "best and only option for a resolution", I had ordered replacement bulbs from DDMTUNING.com, the same 35w 5k bulbs I had ordered from BavToys. They came labeled and packed correctly. I had no reason to be so nice, but I sent another message to BavToys telling them of my experience. Below is that email conversation:Originally Posted by BavToys
Originally Posted by AdamOriginally Posted by BavToysAnd that's where the situation is at this point. It's odd that every time I've requested a shipping address, I don't receive a response. After sharing this experience here and many other places, I doubt I'll hear from him again. I'm out $75, but maybe this will serve as a lesson to anyone else interested in purchasing bulbs online.Originally Posted by Adam
What I've learned through dealing with BavToys is that they/he is either too ignorant or too incompetent to tell the difference in the bulbs pictured above. One is white, the other is yellow. These are not closely colored shades of paint, as BavToys has said.
Another thing I learned is that BavToys and the people who work there believe they are without fault. "We do not make mistakes," he says. How could anyone see these pictures and believe that the order was fulfilled properly?
I'm glad I purchased bulbs from DDMTUNING.com. In addition to being almost half of bavtoys' price, ddmtuning sent the correct color temperature, in a correctly labeled box, with a packing slip, and answered emails using their name, address and phone number (and capital letters) - just like a real-life reputable business would. I honestly do not know why anyone would deal with BavToys when given the choice.
Unlike BavToys, I am admitting a mistake: purchasing from them. Going forward I'll work tirelessly in an effort to keep other car enthusiasts from making the same mistake I have, and hopefully drive a lot of business away from them and towards any other business capable of fulfilling a simple order with accuracy and accountability.
I will gladly share my experience with BavToys until "habbie" and his "business" end up where where all his other poorly lead and poorly operated businesses end up: destitution and failure.
Clearly I'm not the only dissatisfied customer who he has treated this way. Below are threads from other dissatisfied customers, many of which include responses from "habbie" himself displaying the winning customer service he's known for:
http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1192735
http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1194842
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...php?p=25768953
(He has two other failed companies? I wonder which.)
http://www.bimmerwerkz.com/forum/3-s...s-60449-2.html
What I like about this one is how the response is written in all lower-case letters, just like BavToys! Their slogan should be, "You know it's BavToys if it doesn't have a shift key"
http://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/...Off0408609.htm
http://www.clubwrx.net/forums/2423209-post15.html
He's banned at this forum. I wonder why?
http://www.m3forum.net/m3forum/showthread.php?t=81548
http://www.m3forum.net/m3forum/showthread.php?t=192237
To conclude, I have large doubts about Bimmerforums' judgement in sponsorship choices with BavToys as a lighting sponsor. If forum sponsors are chosen with this type of negative pedrigree, what does it say about TCKline, The Tire Rack, and many of the other forum sponsors here? Why would any of those companies wish to be associated with BavToys?
BavToys: Buyer beware.
Thanks for taking the time to read this.
all this bc you have two different color bulbs? what a drama queen. hope you get it worked out.
+1
That sucks for you but thanks for sharing and keeping fellow BFC members informed. It looks like you received 3K or 4K bulbs...the amount of yellow it's obvious it's not a 5K bulb. He's just playing "dumb" to make you seem like the bad guy.
You should post in the vendor comment section. Habbie can't delete your post there.
I agree that he should be banned as a forum sponsor given his "business" practices. Perhaps he's prepaid for a certain amount of time and when the contract expires they won't renew him.
Doesn't seem dramatic at all to me...actually he seemed to have been very patient. I think it's more the fact that it was an obvious error on BTs part but they won't own up to it.
Last edited by Jackson334; 04-07-2009 at 08:19 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
Return the bulbs like they ask, and see if they give you the ones to your liking?
I have heard many complaints about them, so it would make me think twice before doing business with them. I prefer to use Bimmer95, Chris is always helpful, and very professional. Amazing products and fast shipping.
+1 take my business elsewhere now..
but try to replace your bulbs and hope for the best... whats the worst that can happen.... 10000k bulbs? lol
2000 Silverstone/Silverstone M5 1/34
Good idea to post here as well. Not sure if someone will shut 1 of the threads down tho for simply being a duplicate thread (content entirely aside). Good luck. Thank you for taking the time to post though, I and many more appreciate it.
Thanks for the quality write-up. It seems you went way out of your way to right the situation. It's up to a business to make things right with the customer, not the other way around. BavToys has now lost my business and I'm certain others from reading this. And for what BavToys? A $75 set of lightbulbs? Great job with customer retention.
I recently ordered from Bavtoys and have had no issues - I had a problem with my order ( my mistake) and they went out of their way to rectify it to make sure i was happy.
That being said - sorry to hear about what happened in your situation.
No I didn't miss it. I also didn't miss the the extremely poor way the representative from BavToys handled the situation. If they couldn't get a simple order right the first time, without labeling anything either, why would I want to try again? And I am assuming of course this means the buyer of these bulbs has to pay for shipping back to the supplier too.
You should return them for a full refund and refund of all shipping charges,
its only what is fair and what you deserve
--it was their mistake --
get rma # and send them back
tell them you want a full refund .....edited , finally read yer post completely and noticed you did buy from somewhere else
How come this guy is still a sponsor and moderator , when he doesnt even reply to your emails for a return address
Last edited by belligerent; 04-07-2009 at 09:58 PM.
That's the shady part...by not labeling the product there's almost no way to "prove" it was BTs mistake. To me the pictures say it all but if they're still adamant that those yellow lights are 5000K then what can you do.
To the OP, now that you have new bulbs, you should go ahead and send the BT ones back and see if they can retify the problem. I would not have done it initially either since he could conviently "lost" your package. I would ship it back via USPS in a padded envelope to save postage. If you go to the post office you can get a tracking number for .50 more I think. Don't forget to include your original bulb so that they can "match" it. I bet he'll come back with 8000K is what most closely matched your bulb but it probably won't have a label either. They don't make mistakes....
Just saying...he didn't say they don't make mistakes, he said "we did not make any mistakes." There's a difference there.
But I do understand your frustration. Try sending them back and seeing how the new ones match up.
Last edited by adamnur; 04-07-2009 at 11:14 PM.
+1
i dont see what the big deal is to send the sent of bulbs back. he offered to send you new ones. btw, are you trying to say that those bulbs in your headlights were out of the same pair you were sent?
LOL it costs $4 to ship a set of bulbs across the country... if thats too much, and an inconvience..... you shouldnt be modding your car.
cheap ass. period.
Originally Posted by BavToys
you were sent a matching pair, new bulbs will never match old bulbs its just how it is, new paint will not match old paint.
as long as the pair matches there's not much else we can do and we can not match new bulbs to your one old one.
This is the type of response typical of Bavtoys.
Wow, how sad. If you put it on a credit card, call them and get your money back. Send the crap back to BavToys.
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