results from track 9/20/08

[jfdmas]

well, another day at the track. Expected weather was sunny and about 74deg. perfect right??? no. try more like 85 and humid.

anyway, im at the track so i do my thing. I showed up at the track using anti-lag and finding myself sticking very nicely and sometimes bogging to the end of the day with not using anti-lag and spinning all over. After about 3 DSM's broke on the track and 1 or 2 other domestic cars. Then all the pontiac grand am's and dodge spirits got there turn in dragging water up the track. Conditions worsened very quickly. Wasnt my track day so i had no say.

anyway, Im having some issues that leave me wondering if my gearing is too short or not. When i launch my car and it hooks with anti-lag 1st gear litteraly goes by in a second and my tranny will not go into 2nd gear. Its like hitting a wall with nothing there at all. So my best 60ft of the day ended up being 1.75 and i missed 3rd gear. that shoulda been my 10sec pass.

well, here it is



60ft......1.874
330.......5.001
1/8.......7.426
mph......102.13
1000.....9.455
1/4.......11.154
mph......133.57

the thing that pissed me off is the firebird next to me had a 1.603 60ft and trapped 133 like myself but his E.T. was 10.400 sooo frusterating.

But on the bright side, i hammered the shit outta my car with probably over 10 launches and not a single axle problem. Cryotreated axles and slicks seem to do the trick so far.

I took a bunch of in car vids so you can see what i mean about how short my 1rst gear is and why i cant bang second if i hook.(

[MrBlonde]

Good to see. Switch to a longer diff ratio if you think it will help.

[jfdmas]

run without anti-lag.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QnrphmCmvss[/ame]

run with anti-lag..

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ud5pUpHPIVI[/ame]

One of many runs of me missing 2nd gear.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w8FqtRfzTVc[/ame]


kenny, i dont think i wanna change my rear diff ratio but maybe get a longer 1rst/2nd gear.

Im even considering trying out launching in 2nd gear.:

[MrBlonde]

Try doing your burnouts in 3rd gear. I am not sure how you miss the 1 - 2 gearshift! It's bang straight down, hard to get it wrong, maybe you're trying too hard? Lastly and in conflict with a previous comment, your shifts are too slow, that's gonna cost ya!
At this point any improvement will see a ten second pass!

[jfdmas]

Try doing your burnouts in 3rd gear. I am not sure how you miss the 1 - 2 gearshift! It's bang straight down, hard to get it wrong, maybe you're trying too hard? Lastly and in conflict with a previous comment, your shifts are too slow, that's gonna cost ya!
At this point any improvement will see a ten second pass!

well, as far as the 1-2 shift goes, it physicaly locks me out. I tried numerous times. and those were my 1rst and 2nd vids of me warming up. Those were 11.5's. The 11.15 i ran was with an even worse 60ft but somehow i managed to run a better time. I ended up runnin outta gas again, but i got a ton of runs in.

the car grabs and pulls HARD with antilag and i just know if i can nail 2nd it would be a killer 60ft. i think the syncro isnt matching gear speeds quick enough and prohibiting me from hitting second. Oh well, im gunna wait a few weeks till it gets colder out and then try again.

i have one more trick up my sleeve. Im gunna find and install my rear sway bar( somehow got lost) and disconnect my front so i can get better weight distrabution. Other then that, i think the only thing thats gunna get me into tens is some good cold weather and a little bit of luck.

[morerevsm3]

my gearbox does the same, it is the synchro ring on 2nd gear on the way out

[m3chaser]

ahahaha your 1/8th mile trap is the highest trap I have ever done in my car in the 1/4. NICE!

[///M3 CRAZY]

awesome times but a few comments....

1 i agree with kenny that you should probably run a slightly taller rear gear, going to fifth gear is costing you time and acceleration.
2 i also agree that shift time and technique needs to be worked on.
3 the boost gauge duct taped to the dash is awesome!

[a32guy]

Really glad to see you didn't break out there for a change! Don't sweat it, your 10s will come soon enough. I also think some time could be gained by ditching that last shift. Great job out there.

[davidtm5]

i had the same problem today too at the track cant get into 2 gear couple time , still running with stock axle mickey thomson et street. i agree with mr Blonde you need to shift quicker cause you alot of time...you have to used 2 step a little longer to build boost. i got my 60' down to 1.540 and 1.666 all day when i built boost of the line...good luck

[StreuB1]

u should never break the traps in 5th gear....and u were in 5th for a looooong time. especially if yer shifting inth 2nd hear before the 60'. u should be shifting just after it. taller rear gear and youll get what you desire. faster shifting also.

[good & tight]

Nice times
Had the the same issue shifting from 2nd to 3rd like it was blocked off, under normal driving conditions it was fine though. I was thinking the case was flexing under high load.

[jfdmas]

anyone wanna sell me a taller rear diff? i had one but got rid of it because i thought id accomplish my goal with my current diff.

[davidtm5]

stay with 3.23 gear or 2.93 best for you ,when running turbo. turbo car we need stay in gear longer so dont need to shift a lot, every time you shift the boost will drop .unless you can do no lift shift

[MrBlonde]

well, as far as the 1-2 shift goes, it physicaly locks me out.
..

Ah well that you have to fix. With that issue resolved you've got a ten second pass right there. Can't drag race a manual tranny if it's locking you on the 1-2 shift, the time lost is crucial.

[FinalBoss]

I think you can probably pull this off if you start in 2nd gear with anti-lag. Judging from your videos you shift out of 2nd at 45mph and into 5th at 100. Shorter gears help but for the power you're making I think the benefit of shorter gearing is negated by all your extra shifts.

[jfdmas]

I think you can probably pull this off if you start in 2nd gear with anti-lag. Judging from your videos you shift out of 2nd at 45mph and into 5th at 100. Shorter gears help but for the power you're making I think the benefit of shorter gearing is negated by all your extra shifts.

i was wondering that myself, but wasnt sure if it would be wise. I dont want to split my tranny in half trying this.lol

[jfdmas]

well, i just went out and drove around with only 2nd gear, and practiced a few launches in 2nd gear but theres absolutely no traction so i couldnt realy confirm anything, other then it feels like a normal car with a longer diff. However do to the wierd nature of not having 1rst i chickened out and bought a 3.15 lsd. We shall see if this helps me out or not.

[MrBlonde]

You don't want to launch in any gear other than first. I believe the 391s are a great gear in your car but experimentation is a good thing.

Let's consider the basics:

+ With antilag you're going to leave the line hard, you want 10% wheelspin and zero wheel hop
+ You want to cross the line in your 1:1 gear .. is that 5th?
+ Every gear change costs you time, this must be balanced with the improved acceleration achieved through multiple gears
+ Whatever diff gearing you choose, you want to hit redline in your top gear (be it 4th or 5th) a heartbeat after you touch the stripe
+ Remember tires also effect the gearing
+ You want to allow yourself a 1% improvement in trap speed over your best ever trap in your calculations

If you post the following I am happy to help with analysis

1. Gearbox ratios
2. Tire options (sizes)
3. Best ever trap speed and best ever expected trap speed
4. Diff ratio options
5. Engine redline

[jfdmas]

You don't want to launch in any gear other than first. I believe the 391s are a great gear in your car but experimentation is a good thing.

Let's consider the basics:

+ With antilag you're going to leave the line hard, you want 10% wheelspin and zero wheel hop
+ You want to cross the line in your 1:1 gear .. is that 5th?
+ Every gear change costs you time, this must be balanced with the improved acceleration achieved through multiple gears
+ Whatever diff gearing you choose, you want to hit redline in your top gear (be it 4th or 5th) a heartbeat after you touch the stripe
+ Remember tires also effect the gearing
+ You want to allow yourself a 1% improvement in trap speed over your best ever trap in your calculations

If you post the following I am happy to help with analysis

1. Gearbox ratios
2. Tire options (sizes)
3. Best ever trap speed and best ever expected trap speed
4. Diff ratio options
5. Engine redline

yes 5th gear is 1:1 in my tranny.

my final gear ratio is 3.91
tranny is.
1st ....4.20
2nd....2.49
3rd.....1.66
4th.....1.22
5th.....1.00


im running hoosier 26x9.5x16

my best trap is 133.57 and i dont expect to trap more then 136-138.

engine redline is 7000rpm.

Now, the things that ive found out from my own personal experience are this. when i launch with antilag at 5500rpm the car pulls very hard but redline is almost instant making it too hard to grab 2nd.

In a perfect world i should be able to grab every single gear and shift flawlessly, but thats not the case. I understand that if you take out all human error, that the shorter the gear utilizing all 5 gears will be faster. However, it is very difficult to be perfect and to shift as fast as an automatic.

I thought that my shifting was pretty quick according to myself and othes till i came here and everyone tells me im shifting too slow. I dont think that i could possibly shift any faster without an full throttle shifting. My shifts are fast, just the throttle response isnt there.

I just purchased an 3.15 lsd and i shall experiment.

If i could have things my way, i would get a custom 1rst and 2nd gear and leave the rest the same. something a little longer so i can make it through the first 60ft in 1 gear and have time to shift into second.

[MrBlonde]

yes 5th gear is 1:1 in my tranny.

my final gear ratio is 3.91
tranny is.
1st ....4.20
2nd....2.49
3rd.....1.66
4th.....1.22
5th.....1.00


im running hoosier 26x9.5x16

my best trap is 133.57 and i dont expect to trap more then 136-138.

engine redline is 7000rpm.

Now, the things that ive found out from my own personal experience are this. when i launch with antilag at 5500rpm the car pulls very hard but redline is almost instant making it too hard to grab 2nd.

In a perfect world i should be able to grab every single gear and shift flawlessly, but thats not the case. I understand that if you take out all human error, that the shorter the gear utilizing all 5 gears will be faster. However, it is very difficult to be perfect and to shift as fast as an automatic.

I thought that my shifting was pretty quick according to myself and othes till i came here and everyone tells me im shifting too slow. I dont think that i could possibly shift any faster without an full throttle shifting. My shifts are fast, just the throttle response isnt there.

I just purchased an 3.15 lsd and i shall experiment.

If i could have things my way, i would get a custom 1rst and 2nd gear and leave the rest the same. something a little longer so i can make it through the first 60ft in 1 gear and have time to shift into second.

I understand what you're saying. I would think that you can improve your shift speed at least 15% from watching the video. That just takes practice and obviously you need to have any damage to the tranny repaired before bothering. You can't shift efficiently enough if there are issues so just get them sorted out.

Rest assured your shifts are not slow, they just aren't fast enough for drag racing when you're trying to find an extra tenth to break a ten!

In regards to catching the 1-2 shift with antilag, then either practice will see you master it and you'll get a tremendous advantage out of the hole, or it won't and you are correct in seeing a lower gearing to give yourself the reaction time required.

Your 391 gears are perfect as they are:

1st 33 mph
2nd 56 mph
3rd 84 mph
4th 114 mph
5th 139 mph

If that doesn't work for you then you want to hit 138 MPH in 4th at 7000 RPM:

With 315: 4th =141 MPH
With 323: 4th = 138 MPH

So 'd go the 323. If you've already purchased a 315 then that's not too bad either.

[jfdmas]

I understand what you're saying. I would think that you can improve your shift speed at least 15% from watching the video. That just takes practice and obviously you need to have any damage to the tranny repaired before bothering. You can't shift efficiently enough if there are issues so just get them sorted out.

Rest assured your shifts are not slow, they just aren't fast enough for drag racing when you're trying to find an extra tenth to break a ten!

In regards to catching the 1-2 shift with antilag, then either practice will see you master it and you'll get a tremendous advantage out of the hole, or it won't and you are correct in seeing a lower gearing to give yourself the reaction time required.

Your 391 gears are perfect as they are:

1st 33 mph
2nd 56 mph
3rd 84 mph
4th 114 mph
5th 139 mph

If that doesn't work for you then you want to hit 138 MPH in 4th at 7000 RPM:

With 315: 4th =141 MPH
With 323: 4th = 138 MPH

So 'd go the 323. If you've already purchased a 315 then that's not too bad either.

thanks kenny. there isnt realy anything wrong with the tranny, no grinds or noises what so ever. Maybe its just starting to get sloppy syncro's. nothing too bad to hear/feel grinding but bad enough to not correctly match gear speeds quick enough. Again, just speculation.

also, i see you figured out the speeds, but unless my speedo is off, im not seeing that high mph in each gear. is it possible the speedo doesnt sweep fast enough to match the actual speed during acceleration in lower gears.

also your thoughts on launching in 2nd? i could completely eliminate 1 whole shift and possible (for me) cut a better 60ft and still keep all gears.

Hmmm, does anyone make custom gearing for our tranny's yet.... Maybe possible outta a different bmw tranny like the getrags?

[MrBlonde]

thanks kenny. there isnt realy anything wrong with the tranny, no grinds or noises what so ever. Maybe its just starting to get sloppy syncro's. nothing too bad to hear/feel grinding but bad enough to not correctly match gear speeds quick enough. Again, just speculation.

also, i see you figured out the speeds, but unless my speedo is off, im not seeing that high mph in each gear. is it possible the speedo doesnt sweep fast enough to match the actual speed during acceleration in lower gears.

also your thoughts on launching in 2nd? i could completely eliminate 1 whole shift and possible (for me) cut a better 60ft and still keep all gears.

Hmmm, does anyone make custom gearing for our tranny's yet.... Maybe possible outta a different bmw tranny like the getrags?

If you have a worn syncho that is delaying your shifts it's gotta be fixed. either it is worn or it is not worn.

If your tranny gearing numbers are right, then that's the speed at 7000 RPM. You could always bump up your redline say 250 RPM to give yourself a bit of time.

I think launching in 2nd is a bad idea. If the total gearing is wrong, then change it with a diff ratio swap.

I would say better to swap to a different tranny with different gears rather than try to fabricate custom gearing for your shitty OEM tranny. The current tranny seems to be fine (synchro not withstanding), just play with the CW&P to find the total gearing that suits you and your driving style.

[bennyfizzle]

Why don't you try launching in 2nd w/ antilag and slipping the clutch a bit more, so as to not just roast the tires?

[davidtm5]

what size is the turbo are you running ? i m running a gt35r . antilag set at 3700rpm and 323 gear . try to set your 2 step at under 4000rpm i see if it made any different, and rev limited to 7200. it should be alot easy to shift to 2 gear