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Thread: CCV Replacement FYI - M54

  1. #301
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    2003 525i sport

    Cleaning Existing Clogged Diptick

    Thanks Guys, I am going back in to take a closer look at the oil dipstick and did some searches on the winter version of dipstick. I am not convinced just yet on what the winter version does and not happy with cost $160 it should be more like $70.

    Regarding Existing Stock Dipstick
    In the cleaning existing dipstick case, I was wondering if I have this correct insert coat hanger in hole one and it should be able to pass through #2 and out #3 ( these seemed impossible when I tried it first time)? I am going back and trying Jason5driver's suggestion of using propane and air compressor to loosen the oil build up.

    I have not found any hits for modifying existing stock dipstick to avoid the oil this problem , I guess the permanent solution is the winter version.
    I paid little attention to the dipstick in the CCV job , I forgot to replace the O-Ring even though I bought one. It was a nice tight snug fit when inserted it back. I did not see where the new O-ring was suppose to be replaced so hopefully it did not end up in oil pan, big ooops and another main reason why I am going back in to check my work.

    Thanks Gents

    BTY ECSTuning has the winter dipstick for $140 now
    http://www.ecstuning.com/Search/11437565437/ES24265/





    Quote Originally Posted by Jason5driver View Post
    Fernan,

    3. The drain pipe that drains oil from the CCV through the dipstick base is more than likely still clogged.
    Try using some heat (small propane) to loosen up the dried-up oil, along with some compressed air (air compressor).
    I would buy the new dipstick tube version from www.EbmwParts.com , or have the tube modified like mine (but requires the drilled hole to be patched-welded - exhaust shop could probably do it for cheap...).

    Thanks!
    Jason
    Last edited by fernanm; 02-27-2012 at 09:47 PM. Reason: ECS tuning Winter dipstick link

  2. #302
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    Fernanm,

    Yes, I was able to run the extended coat hanger all the way through the dipstick tube.

    Did you not see the PDF attachment, and explanation of the modified standard dipstick tube?

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  3. #303
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    modification of dipstick pdf file

    Thanks Jason5driver , I did a search and did not find any hits relating to the modification of dipstick pdf file. Will try to keep looking for it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jason5driver View Post
    Fernanm,

    Yes, I was able to run the extended coat hanger all the way through the dipstick tube.

    Did you not see the PDF attachment, and explanation of the modified standard dipstick tube?

  4. #304
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    Quote Originally Posted by fernanm View Post
    Thanks Jason5driver , I did a search and did not find any hits relating to the modification of dipstick pdf file. Will try to keep looking for it.
    Again, you are not reading my thread...

    Posts #265 & #267:
    http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...7#post23420297


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  5. #305
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    I have some doubts regarding that dipstick guide tube modification. Specifically, unless the hole it drilled through both walls of the inner tube, it is still possible for the flow from the return to be blocked by debris. Even so, it is a less than optimal solution IMHO, as there remains a fairly small opening that could be obstructed by build-up.

    I removed the inner tube entirely from mine. It is a major hassle involving multiple cuts and welding. Basically, the inner tube is an extension of the upper tube; the outer tube is brazed on just above the drain, and again at the hole just below the o-ring flange. You have to cut in these two places, then weld it all back together. Based on what I saw between the two tubes when I cut it apart - after I had already manually and chemically cleaned it as much as possible - I would not consider anything short of complete removal of the inner tube adequate to ensure proper drainage over the long term. That said, modification to achieve this is a major undertaking unless you are good at metal fabrication. Just buy the updated part and be done with it.





    Life's tough. It's tougher when you're stupid.
    -John Wayne

  6. #306
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    not everyone has Jason mechanic
    looks like he can do a good business here selling updated dipsticks
    Last edited by champaign777; 02-28-2012 at 07:10 PM.

  7. #307
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    Updated e39 winter dipstick permanent Fix to CCV failures ?

    Thanks for the jpeg Jason depicting the modification. If I had a spare dipstick or a second vehicle I would try this mod.

    Getting access to remove the old dipstick and cleaning it may be a 3-4 hour job for me I am a slow mechanic so I am leaning towards what I hope is a permanent 2-3 year solution to the problem with the updated winter dipstick.

    Thanks Gents,

  8. #308
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    Quote Originally Posted by 02Pilot View Post
    I have some doubts regarding that dipstick guide tube modification.
    Specifically, unless the hole it drilled through both walls of the inner tube, it is still possible for the flow from the return to be blocked by debris.
    Even so, it is a less than optimal solution IMHO, as there remains a fairly small opening that could be obstructed by build-up.

    I removed the inner tube entirely from mine.
    It is a major hassle involving multiple cuts and welding.
    Basically, the inner tube is an extension of the upper tube; the outer tube is brazed on just above the drain, and again at the hole just below the o-ring flange.
    You have to cut in these two places, then weld it all back together.
    Based on what I saw between the two tubes when I cut it apart - after I had already manually and chemically cleaned it as much as possible -
    I would not consider anything short of complete removal of the inner tube adequate to ensure proper drainage over the long term.
    That said, modification to achieve this is a major undertaking unless you are good at metal fabrication.
    Just buy the updated part and be done with it.
    While agree to some point, the modification to the original tube CAN be done just fine.

    Yes, you will need to drill through both the exterior and interior tube walls to have a clear path for the CCV tube to drain into the larger dipstick tube base.
    However, once drilled, everything is filed down.
    A rod-file is use on the interior of the tube to remove any debris or weird metal edges, and I am pretty sure the exterior hole is welded shut, grind-ed, primed, and painted to match the existing.

    Like I said before, the modification is not for everyone, however, it can be done easily, and patched by either your local mechanic, yourself, or a muffler shop.

    If you have the ~$160 for a new dipstick tube design, then great!
    However, I do not have that kind of money to throw away on a stupid oil dipstick tube...

    Thanks!
    Jason

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  9. #309
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    Help-at point of no return. Cut hose to dipstick :-) I'm actually flying along and doing great! However, there appears to be a non-OEM electrical connection that doesn't have the spring clip? I can't figure out how to get it off. I got all the other ones off no problem (other than someone going crazy with zip ties in crazy places to reach). I'm ready to remove throttle bottle. but electrical box is in the way. I could probably do it with it like it is but it will be a royal pain. as an FYI, I haven't found any of that mayo yet. dipstick looks clean. Did notice that there was no dipstick gasket in place. Dipstick came out no problem and no mess at all.

    The problem with the connector is that it looks like either the smaller end could come out of the bigger plastic piece, or the whole things comes out. The plastic clips are very rigid and can't tell if the push in, or you have to open them outwards. Either way is very very hard as the plastic is very hard. Once I get this connect off, I'll be flying along again. Notice the yellow circle with the normal metal clip. All the others have that and came right off. Do I remove piece in the red circle from teh piece in the blue circle? or remove the blue circle (which takes the red one with it)? and how hard/far to I squeeze or open that connector? I've tried but no luck either way. But also not sure which piece(s) come out.

    Another note. While I cleaned the MAF a month ago, I did not inspect it well enough. there are major cracks in the both boots.

    oh, bummer, just noticed I can't post pics. grrr.

    Here's link to posting that I could put pictures. http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...25#post6708025
    Last edited by mjbennett9; 03-17-2012 at 11:39 AM.

  10. #310
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    I found a great read here:
    http://www.aa1car.com/library/pcv.htm


    And, a possible CCV alternative (Crawford AOS "Air/ Oil Separator"):
    http://www.iwsti.com/forums/2-5-lite...-answered.html

    http://store.crawfordperformance.com.../categories/78

    Review:
    http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=2228499


    And a related thread by BimmerFiver about the Leak Detection Pump at the Charcoal Canister (Fuel Tank):
    http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...1#post24609271



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by AA1car
    If the pintle inside the PCV valve sticks open, or the spring breaks, the PCV valve may flow too much air and lean out the idle mixture.
    This may cause a rough idle, hard starting and/or lean misfire (which increases emissions and wastes fuel).
    The same thing can happen if the hose that connects the valve to the throttle body, carburetor or intake manifold pulls loose, cracks, or leaks.
    A loose or leaky hose allows "un-metered" air to enter the engine and upset the fuel mixture, especially at idle where the idle mixture is most sensitive to vacuum leaks.
    On late model vehicles with computer engine controls, the engine management system will detect any changes in the air/fuel mixture and compensate by increasing or decreasing short term and long term fuel trim (STFT and LTFT).
    Small corrections cause no problems, but large corrections (more than 10 to 15 points negative or positive) will typically set a lean or rich DTC and turn on the MIL.


    And, the fuel trims were also mentioned by that retired BMW tech. I met at Starbucks a couple Saturday's ago, when he used his code reader on my car...
    He highly suggested running a WHOLE CAN of B12 carb/ throttle body cleaner through the intake/ throttle body while running my car to FIX ALL of the issues with my car (leaking oil pan gasket, fuel pump acting-up, CCV dying again...)...
    Last edited by Jason5driver; 06-28-2012 at 02:07 AM.

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  11. #311
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    Jason--I have used the PVC fitting on my oil catch can now for the last 75 thousand miles--it's stoped my oil consumption and is a lot easier to deal with. In my book, it's the best way to go--gas mileage is great and there are no code lights from doing this--just need to clean the PVC valve with cleaner from time to time to keep oil from building up inside of it. I can tell when it needs cleaning by looking at my tailpipe of the car--if it's starting to get a little sooty--it's time to clean the PVC--when it's clean the pipe in back is clean as well--I tried 3 times to get the CCV system working after the 1st one failed--never going with that again---oh yeah--still have the same dipstick from when I bought the car new because of the oil catch can as well---2 cents issued

  12. #312
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    Poolman
    thank you for reminder on this sexy thread
    i got very good time re-reeding it again
    fun times !!!
    Merry Crimbo

  13. #313
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jason5driver View Post
    There is no need to get ALL of that.
    Just get the CCV cold weather kit, the (2) additional hoses, and the dip-stick O-ring.
    I would also get the air distribution piece too.

    Great writeup Jason.

    So if I were to order all the pieces:

    11617534237 CCV kit winter version (what is the PN for the non winter version?)
    11437565437 dipstick
    11157532629 hose
    11617504536 hose
    11611440318 air channel
    11431740045 lower dipstick o ring
    11431717666 upper dipstick o ring
    11617502761 air channel o rings (6)

    My car is starting to sound like chubakah at idle and every so often there is some oil smoke under the hood (back of engine) but I can't see from where. I thought it was the valve cover gasket which I replaced, along with the oil filter housing assembly gasket. If there is too much CC pressure, will I have to replace the VG again?

    While I am in there, I think I will swap my DISA & ICV from the manifold I removed from my 330 with 77K miles on it. Is there anything else I should be doing while I am at it, the car has about 168K on it.

    I thought I read about heater hoses in the back of the engine while at it?

    One of these, any guesses?

    http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts...30&hg=64&fg=18
    Last edited by fmzip; 05-16-2013 at 09:15 AM.

  14. #314
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    Hi all,
    I read the full thread last night, admired your passion (even heated at times, especially for such a cold climate) to resolving this problem, and wondered if I could add anything.
    Anyhow picked up on this thread as about to change CCV on E46 320i with hope of curing high oil consumption (no oil leaks, only very occasional small puff from exhaust, though very sooty). I had not read this thread before purchase but had heard of the problems associated with CCV, so although the coldest temp I have ever had to ‘endure’ is -12C I thought the cold climate version would be ‘belt and braces’, so purchased this.

    Before reading the thread the only reservation I had regarding cold climate CCV was whether the insulated jacket may restrict warming from engine block, but thought the insulated hoses must be good idea. On reading, it appears Jason and his mechanic have come to this conclusion due to the circumstantial evidence regarding the worse performance of cold climate CCV, considering it is identical beneath jacket.

    With regards to the above I wondered if anyone has thought of removing the CCV insulation adjacent to the engine block but keeping the outermost insulation which faces ambient? I was hoping that this would mean just removing half of the pre moulded cover; holding the remaining in place with silicone and/or cable ties, but from your diagrams and photos it looks as though the split in insulation is in the wrong plane (but could still be worth cutting it and reattaching the two quarters outermost as a trial).

    My other thoughts were around the dipstick. From your comments/ photos regarding the quality of the updated dipstick tube, especially considering the price, it would appear to me that Jason’s mechanic’s simple mod is the way to go. Especially if you made sure that when you drilled you really opened up a good size hole through both sides of the inner tube (but I understand also your climate is different to mine and that you guys are getting way more problems). But whichever way you decided to go regarding dipsticks, I wonder if anyone had considered insulating this too? For a few pennys/cents on lagging and ties it has got to be worth a go, even if you don’t yet have any probs with your CCV. You will probably now tell me there is no room around it for lagging?! I guess no one prefers their dipstick protected but you know it makes sense!!

    Sorry if my ideas are a bit naive but I have not done the job yet and they are purely based on your experiences. Regards Jon.

  15. #315
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    Just to update regarding above, I know thread is old now but it helped me when I found it, so it may help others. I have now changed CCV, 6 hours to complete with oil filter housing gasket too. Struggled, like others have, to get the hose that comes from the air distribution piece on to the CCV. It will push on without twisting if you dont have the CCV on the car, but when in situ I just could not get my fingers in behind the hose to get enough purchase to overcome the clip. So the alternative to twist the hose on worked after filing some of the retaining shoulder away to reduce the amount of twist you need to get the hose on (I saw someone else Dremmeled theirs). Once this is done, with a little washing up liquid it takes seconds to get this hose to locate.

    I know none of this is big news, but what may be of interest is the idea that I suggested above about installing only half of the CCV insulated jacket. After removing the old CCV, I took the whole insulating jacket off the new one as it did look so much easier to work with once removed. After I completed the installation I cracked open the old CCV and although not completely stuffed with 'mayo' it did have some on one side. Which side? The side away from the engine. So in hindsight I wish I had carried my idea through and stuck half (or two of the outside quarters) of the jacket back on to the CCV. I could have done so after I had screwed the CCV to the engine, which I didn't think of at the time as I was busy trying to remember how it all went back together!

    Anyhow, the dipstick. It was the old type installed, and I planned to do Jason's drilling mod mentioned earlier in thread. However when removed, it looked clear, I could blow through it easily by mouth, and an airline blew nothing out. So it looks as though after 13 years of English climate the dipstick was up to the task, so I did not bother drilling it. Obviously this isn't the case in Canada.

    No idea on oil consumption yet as I have not done a journey. It used to be about 600 miles to the litre!! But if no better, I have also installed a vacuum hose to the nipple on the CCV which I have blanked the end of at the moment, but will attach to the inlet manifold (as has 02Pilot and others, with apparent reduction in oil consumption) to trial at a later date.

  16. #316
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    Other Problems

    While replacing my CCV and hoses due to crazy oil consumption (about a liter every 300 miles) and noticing other symptoms including the yellow mustard in the valve cover, I noticed this was not the first time the repair was made. Granted I have had the car for about 100k since the previous owner, I wouldn't think the CCV would go bad that quick after 3 years or so. Could there be another problem?

  17. #317
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    Quote Originally Posted by randycamp View Post
    While replacing my CCV and hoses due to crazy oil consumption (about a liter every 300 miles) and noticing other symptoms including the yellow mustard in the valve cover, I noticed this was not the first time the repair was made. Granted I have had the car for about 100k since the previous owner, I wouldn't think the CCV would go bad that quick after 3 years or so. Could there be another problem?
    IMO, once the CCV fails, the valve stem seals start to go bad from a large amount of oil contamination and oxidation.
    This happens more and more as the car accumulates age and mileage.
    Thus, the engine head is not able to generate the correct vacuum, and thus causing piston ring flutter, and increased blow-by.
    This also causes huge amounts of Carbon Build-Up, and it can/will contaminate your spark plugs.
    And, if not addressed as soon as possible, ALL of your car's seals will be blown (valve cover gasket, oil filter housing gasket, oil pan gasket, and the rear main seal).

    Basically, as the car ages, the layers of oxidized oil and Carbon Build-Up keep building, making it harder and harder for the car to make proper combustion (seal), and allow more and more oil and condensation to flow back in through the intake.

    This is just my take on the matter...

    So, to answer your question...
    I would suspect that your car has bad/ contaminated Valve Stem Seals.

    Thanks!
    Jason
    Last edited by Jason5driver; 04-17-2014 at 02:15 PM.

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  18. #318
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    Quote Originally Posted by randycamp View Post
    While replacing my CCV and hoses due to crazy oil consumption (about a liter every 300 miles) and noticing other symptoms including the yellow mustard in the valve cover, I noticed this was not the first time the repair was made. Granted I have had the car for about 100k since the previous owner, I wouldn't think the CCV would go bad that quick after 3 years or so. Could there be another problem?
    Do you take a lot of short trips? How long are your oil change intervals? What oil do you use? Any leaks from the oil filter housing or elsewhere?
    I haven't had to change my CCV (yet) but have read extensively about the symptoms. Seems like folks that drive short distances and don't let the oil reach proper operating temp have similar issues although 1L/300 miles is excessive.
    Could also be that the replacement CCV was not OEM and therefore failed early, but 100K miles is probably about right for the lifespan of that part.
    2003 530i -- DD; 1984 Porsche 911 Carrera coupe -- fun car; 1990 325i convertible -- sold; 1974 Porsche 914 2.0 -- sold; 1989 325i sedan -- sold; 1983 633CSi -- sold; 1982 323i -- sold

  19. #319
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    I'm starting to think the dip stick tube is the cause of my vacuum like leak sound... No idea if it can cause my oil burning issue though. I'm trying to figure out though, is P/N 11431433496 the re-designed tube?

    Do I need a DIY or is this something relatively simple that can be replaced in a few minutes?
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  20. #320
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    The dipstick tube is relatively simple to swap, but a PITA to get fully seated. You could probably just remove it, clean out inside from any blockage and replace lower o-ring on tube, and replace both upper o-rings on dipstick.

    When reinstalling it fought me the entire way. Just be careful you don't split new o-ring. I cleaned out the hole and edges it goes into with scotch bright than also put some vasoline on the o-ring.

  21. #321
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    Quote Originally Posted by dwint21 View Post
    The dipstick tube is relatively simple to swap, but a PITA to get fully seated. You could probably just remove it, clean out inside from any blockage and replace lower o-ring on tube, and replace both upper o-rings on dipstick.

    When reinstalling it fought me the entire way. Just be careful you don't split new o-ring. I cleaned out the hole and edges it goes into with scotch bright than also put some vasoline on the o-ring.
    Do you recall if the o-ring was discontinued or something? I thought there was a discussion about them not having the o-ring anymore.
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  22. #322
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    The newly designed oil dipstick tube is BMW part #114 37 565 437.

    http://www.ecstuning.com/Search/Site...14_37_565_437/


    Here is some very good comparisons between the new oil dipstick tube design, and the old oil dipstick tube design...
    Quote Originally Posted by mach.schnell View Post
    Since water condensation builds up within the CCV system (which is supposed to burn off later - I'm sure you've seen vapor or water dripping out of a tail pipe - which btw means the car was just recently started) there are times when you will temporarily see the "mayo goo" in various places (such as underneath the oil cap). Heat the engine up and all that goes away.

    The oil separator (bottom funnel part of the CCV gizmo) is supposed to collect larger droplets of oil from the fumes inside the valve cover. These drops then slide out the bottom, down the hose and into the dipstick tube. But... this means at times you could pull out the dipstick to check your oil level and see the "mayo" or "coffee cream" goo and scream "agghh my headgasket blew!!@#$%" (when it didn't).

    To avoid this, the oil separator drained into an outer sleeve of the dipstick guide-tube so the dipstick wouldn't ever get goo on it. So the old design had a tube within a tube. The outer sleeve into which the oil separator drained was very narrow, and mayo goo tended to freeze inside as it slowly oozed down the hose and hit a cold metal dipstick guide tube. Hey, BMW later fixed all that by getting rid of the dipstick altogether.

    Just so you know, the dipstick does not go all the way down through the guide tube and out the bottom. Instead the oil goes up into the guide tube when your oil level is correct. In the old tube, the goo would have mixed with the oil way down in the oil pan. With the new design, it looks like goo might ooze down through the nipple and get on the dipstick (when there is goo).


    Here you can see how narrow the outer sleve is on the old guide tube at left. I've seen pictures where the ice accumulated right up the hose and into the oil separator itself. (The new design is on the right.)



    In addition, the old tube in tube idea required a vent hole:





    So if anybody thinks they solved the freezing hydrolock problem by just putting a foam jacket on the CCV, well....
    Last edited by Jason5driver; 10-07-2014 at 06:40 PM.

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  23. #323
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    There should be an oring otherwise there would be an air leak. But that's just me thinking about it. The new design looks like it has the same ridge for the oring to sit against.

  24. #324
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jason5driver View Post
    The newly designed oil dipstick tube is BMW part #114 37 565 437.

    http://www.ecstuning.com/Search/Site...14_37_565_437/


    Here is some very good comparisons between the new oil dipstick tube design, and the old oil dipstick tube design...
    Thanks for the info, Jason... he makes it sound like if you get the new design its likely your going to get mayo like oil readings? Or is he concluding in the case of a failed CCV?
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