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Thread: The OFFICIAL bogging, hesitating, no acceleration from idle thread

  1. #351
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    325i
    Quote Originally Posted by a32guy
    I forgot to add, the previous owner replaced the fuel pump himself, and he didn't seem too mechanically inclined. Also on a side note, once in a while I will get a somewhat strong odor of gasoline inside the car. Maybe I should double check his work...
    i have that same gas smell but its only because its cold and you drive hard

  2. #352
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    Ah, intake tubing cracks...I'll have to look into that. Also would kinda make sense as far as the problem showing up now when it's cold and things are brittle...although, I'm not sure how to relate that back to the engine temp thing. I'll inspect it this weekend.

  3. #353
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    Perth, Australia
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    96 323i, 94 318i
    Just to add a point for us 4 cyl guys - when the car is sitting parked in the sun, the engine bay heats up and it runs like crap until cool air flow sorts out whatever the problem is.

  4. #354
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    I just took mine to the dealer. $100 for their scam diagnostics is worth it.. I'll let you guys know what they find out

  5. #355
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    I'm taking some stuff apart this weekend to see if I can find anything out, I'll report back...

    Dan
    Dan

  6. #356
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    i just have this feeling that someone will find something and everyone will go AH HA! and there will be no need for this post......

    well, at least i hope they do......
    "Before you can think outside the box, you have to know whats in it"

    -Matthew

    M42 Club Member #126

  7. #357
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jetblack95
    i just have this feeling that someone will find something and everyone will go AH HA! and there will be no need for this post......

    well, at least i hope they do......
    Huh? I think this thread has been a great resource...surprised if anyone would say otherwise. I don't care if it's the stupidest solution ever, I just want to get it fixed.

    Dan
    Dan

  8. #358
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
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    1992 325i e36 ~ 1985 318i ~ 1995 Audi A6 Quattro
    I was speaking with Mike Murray from Bimmer Magazine and I thik he was as stumped as the rest of us....I have tested everything including the resistance on every sensor. My car has been parked as I have to replace the brake light switch but I am taking the car in for a CA smog diagnostic on Sunday as-is...cold and with 87 octane to make sure it runs like crap! I wish I had another 2k on oil change but we'll work with what we have. I am strong on my belief that this is a catalytic convertor issue....let my no sense making ass put it this way-

    If our cars were chimneys and the pedal was the fire to provide the heat...our fire would not last long as we have plenty of fuel potential but nowhere for the air to flow as needed (sorry I am involved in construction-home inspection) If the OBDI system has any flaw I think we have found it. I have yet to have a check engine light but at 208k how many miles can you expect out of the CAT? Manufacturers only warranty 50k...If the CAT is recieving irregular flows due to diagnostic issues this will overwork the whole management system and send it into a haywire mode because it compensates for raw fuel dump... I believe any mechanic will tell you if you smell any fuel bypass, whether raw or exhaust, that you have a CAT issue. We are troubleshooting everything from air intake to fuel delivery but it doesnt make sense...an efficient or new o2 should compensate for this. The purpose of the CAT is to make efficent exhaust - dont we all have a resonation issue when bogging? I sound like a V8 when cruising light to light in traffic - love it but believe this is the porblem as I usuallu experience the 'Bog' in this environment. I also have a 1500 foot climb over 2 miles in which I climb every day and this brings out the oh so best in my car. If I keep the car under 2k or over 4k I never have any problems.. . I believe the fuel return test was a failure....Lets get these CAT's replaced and see where we are then. What is a CAT to perform milage wise anyway = I would think it is tired of seeing carbon and cleaner build up from the last 14 years of use in my situation. I am a religious Cevron 89 fan as well as using Red Line Complete Fuel Traeatment and synthetic motor oil-Mobile 1. How much better can you be, I believe that the previous owner went 30k+ on the K&N filter and caused severe issues. I believe exhaust flows will take us to our solution...this is the only item that makes sense to anyone I correspond wih. Looking forward to hearing some answers this weekend. Keep me posted Please.

    Mike Fowler
    Mr. Mike36

  9. #359
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    1993 325is
    well I got a call from the dealer and they said mine is a fried computer and an ignition coil. the guy said the computer smelled like burning. im not sure if this pertains to any of your own problems or not.. I'm kind of curious how this could be the issue, as it was doing the same bad idling thing both before the tire iron slid on top of the battery in the trunk and arced itself and after.. So i'm about to go $1300 in the hole for a new computer. good times

  10. #360
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    Quote Originally Posted by prophecy
    well I got a call from the dealer and they said mine is a fried computer and an ignition coil. the guy said the computer smelled like burning. im not sure if this pertains to any of your own problems or not.. I'm kind of curious how this could be the issue, as it was doing the same bad idling thing both before the tire iron slid on top of the battery in the trunk and arced itself and after.. So i'm about to go $1300 in the hole for a new computer. good times
    Well, this sounds like a legitimate issue for you, only because of the tire iron incident. Putting power through grounds never turns out well. Don't be surprised if that's not the only computer that got fried...though I hope for your sake it is.

    You may want to try shopping for a used one on here, you'll save a LOT of money...I think they regularly go for around $200.

    Dan
    Dan

  11. #361
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.mike36
    I was speaking with Mike Murray from Bimmer Magazine and I thik he was as stumped as the rest of us....I have tested everything including the resistance on every sensor. My car has been parked as I have to replace the brake light switch but I am taking the car in for a CA smog diagnostic on Sunday as-is...cold and with 87 octane to make sure it runs like crap! I wish I had another 2k on oil change but we'll work with what we have. I am strong on my belief that this is a catalytic convertor issue....let my no sense making ass put it this way-

    If our cars were chimneys and the pedal was the fire to provide the heat...our fire would not last long as we have plenty of fuel potential but nowhere for the air to flow as needed (sorry I am involved in construction-home inspection) If the OBDI system has any flaw I think we have found it. I have yet to have a check engine light but at 208k how many miles can you expect out of the CAT? Manufacturers only warranty 50k...If the CAT is recieving irregular flows due to diagnostic issues this will overwork the whole management system and send it into a haywire mode because it compensates for raw fuel dump... I believe any mechanic will tell you if you smell any fuel bypass, whether raw or exhaust, that you have a CAT issue. We are troubleshooting everything from air intake to fuel delivery but it doesnt make sense...an efficient or new o2 should compensate for this. The purpose of the CAT is to make efficent exhaust - dont we all have a resonation issue when bogging? I sound like a V8 when cruising light to light in traffic - love it but believe this is the porblem as I usuallu experience the 'Bog' in this environment. I also have a 1500 foot climb over 2 miles in which I climb every day and this brings out the oh so best in my car. If I keep the car under 2k or over 4k I never have any problems.. . I believe the fuel return test was a failure....Lets get these CAT's replaced and see where we are then. What is a CAT to perform milage wise anyway = I would think it is tired of seeing carbon and cleaner build up from the last 14 years of use in my situation. I am a religious Cevron 89 fan as well as using Red Line Complete Fuel Traeatment and synthetic motor oil-Mobile 1. How much better can you be, I believe that the previous owner went 30k+ on the K&N filter and caused severe issues. I believe exhaust flows will take us to our solution...this is the only item that makes sense to anyone I correspond wih. Looking forward to hearing some answers this weekend. Keep me posted Please.

    Mike Fowler
    Mr. Mike36
    This sounds like a very fair analysis to me. Hopefully someone will take off their cats this weekend and go for a ride long enough to get the engine warm and see if it makes a difference...

    I'm also trying to screw with the crank pos. sensor, as I see from some posts this can cause similar issues.

    Someone try the cats though!!

    Dan
    Dan

  12. #362
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    14 inches of snow expected, and a busted VW golf in the garage. I can't try the exhaust trick this weekend

  13. #363
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    Quote Originally Posted by a32guy
    14 inches of snow expected, and a busted VW golf in the garage. I can't try the exhaust trick this weekend
    Gotcha.. expecting 12+ here. And I'm going skiing next weekend, so any fiddling is going to be pushed back until at least next Monday for me too...

    Dan
    Dan

  14. #364
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    Quote Originally Posted by BMDub325is
    I am going to go home tonight, put the wheels back on, and get it off of the jackstands. Will probably take it for a spin this weekend after I charge the batt. So I'll let you guys with the cat theory know if it helps the issue by removing them. Keep in mind that I replaced the Guibo and TM's at the same time though (which could help the issue, due to flexing in the high torque areas).
    I got it off of the jack stands, charged the batt, and fired it up yesterday but it's snowing again and they're laying salt on the roads. So I am going to wait until it's nicer out to drive it. I was surprised that my exhaust note has not changed much at all (from a stand still at least). Maybe I should not have added the high flow resonators into the mix afterall. Seems to rev up a bit quicker but the needle is still taking too long to drop back down.

    I will touch base again after I take it for a spin. Hopefully it helps the hesitation problem.

  15. #365
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    Houston I think we have confirmation....

    I just got off the phone with an experienced exhaust guy that has confirmed our problem without even looking at it. His explanation was backed by many successful installs. He said he has been converting the CAT's to an OBDII system becuse there have been numerous attempts to put an aftermarket OBDI CAT on only to fail testing. He said if its an OBDI with over 150k he guarantees the CAT is worn out as the honeycomb is really sensitive especially in the BMW's. He recently had a guy from SF bring his car in with our symptoms but he couldn't pass smog as a gross polluter. He hooked it up with an OBDII CAT and the SF smog referee said he has never seen a BMW pass with such clean emmissions - actually no detection at all. Now for those who have tested their exhaust pressure. He said a back pressure of 3-5# is about where we need to be...if there is no backpressure there could be many problems associated such as what we have described. I will touch base with my friends at M Service in walnut creek as well as Wolfgangs to see if they confirm but I am pretty sure we have a winner, has anyone had success with replacement yet? We have all talked about it, but I have another two weeks before I can shell out the money. Check around to find an aftermarket on the web because I am seeing them for under $100 bucks. Unlike the $500 plus that we are seeing from the OEM sites and stealers.


    __________________
    Mike Fowler
    East Bay Area, CA
    1992 325i
    1985 318i
    1996 Audi A6 Quatro

  16. #366
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    1)
    2)
    3) I was looking awhile ago for an aftermarket cat, but either I'm retarded or...well, yeah just retarded. Where do you find them?

  17. #367
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.mike36
    Houston I think we have confirmation....

    I just got off the phone with an experienced exhaust guy that has confirmed our problem without even looking at it. His explanation was backed by many successful installs. He said he has been converting the CAT's to an OBDII system becuse there have been numerous attempts to put an aftermarket OBDI CAT on only to fail testing. He said if its an OBDI with over 150k he guarantees the CAT is worn out as the honeycomb is really sensitive especially in the BMW's. He recently had a guy from SF bring his car in with our symptoms but he couldn't pass smog as a gross polluter. He hooked it up with an OBDII CAT and the SF smog referee said he has never seen a BMW pass with such clean emmissions - actually no detection at all. Now for those who have tested their exhaust pressure. He said a back pressure of 3-5# is about where we need to be...if there is no backpressure there could be many problems associated such as what we have described. I will touch base with my friends at M Service in walnut creek as well as Wolfgangs to see if they confirm but I am pretty sure we have a winner, has anyone had success with replacement yet? We have all talked about it, but I have another two weeks before I can shell out the money. Check around to find an aftermarket on the web because I am seeing them for under $100 bucks. Unlike the $500 plus that we are seeing from the OEM sites and stealers.


    __________________
    Mike Fowler
    East Bay Area, CA
    1992 325i
    1985 318i
    1996 Audi A6 Quatro

    Damn, man, I hope you're right! I want to do a OBDII cat though. Might as well take advantage of the better pipes.

    Can you ask the exhaust guy how he's fitting the OBDII cats on there? If I recall correctly we need to do the headers too, since on OBDII the O2 sensor is in the header.

    Let's get this done!

    Dan
    Dan

  18. #368
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    Also - maybe someone could take off their cats and give it a run to see if this really is the problem. I'd like to get this fixed real soon, but I don't want to go buying anything else until I know what the problem is for sure...

    Dan
    Dan

  19. #369
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    What's different about the OBDII cats? Do they just weld over the 2nd O2 sensor bung, or is there some way to add a second one?

  20. #370
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spood
    What's different about the OBDII cats? Do they just weld over the 2nd O2 sensor bung, or is there some way to add a second one?
    Actually, IIRC, there are no O2 sensor holes in the OBDII cats, at least before the cats. There are 2 holes in the headers, and 2 after the cats if my memory serves...

    Dan
    Dan

  21. #371
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    Quote Originally Posted by dmurray14
    Actually, IIRC, there are no O2 sensor holes in the OBDII cats, at least before the cats. There are 2 holes in the headers, and 2 after the cats if my memory serves...

    Dan
    So there are 4 O2 sensors? Madness!

    Are the OBDII cats more robust or something?

  22. #372
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    Guys I agree with Mr. Mike and I also think it was my cats. I have since upgraded my exhaust manifold to obd II ( plugged up the 2 O2 sensors in the manifolds, welded the air injection ports closed) and upgraded the midsection to an obd II mid from a 1998 M3 (its stainlesd steel), plugged up the post cat O2 sensor holes, welded in a new OBD I sensor nut and installed a new O2 sensor. The OBD II cats have larger diameter downpipes, and have a true dual setup without any Y piping like the OBDI. Also from 1996 an on the exhausts are all stainless steel. I installed it today, and the car seems to have 30 more hp at the top end, and at least as much torque everywhere in the whole rpm range. I also installed all new gaskets I got from pelican parts. Finally I think my car is running like it should. Oh also, for the first time I can actually hear a roar from the rear (still stock 325ic) muffler. I definitely think exhaust airflow has improved and was the culprit in my bogging issue.

  23. #373
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    For everyone active in this thread...how many miles on your cars? I have about 161k.

  24. #374
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    Quote Originally Posted by calves2997
    Guys I agree with Mr. Mike and I also think it was my cats. I have since upgraded my exhaust manifold to obd II ( plugged up the 2 O2 sensors in the manifolds, welded the air injection ports closed) and upgraded the midsection to an obd II mid from a 1998 M3 (its stainlesd steel), plugged up the post cat O2 sensor holes, welded in a new OBD I sensor nut and installed a new O2 sensor. The OBD II cats have larger diameter downpipes, and have a true dual setup without any Y piping like the OBDI. Also from 1996 an on the exhausts are all stainless steel. I installed it today, and the car seems to have 30 more hp at the top end, and at least as much torque everywhere in the whole rpm range. I also installed all new gaskets I got from pelican parts. Finally I think my car is running like it should. Oh also, for the first time I can actually hear a roar from the rear (still stock 325ic) muffler. I definitely think exhaust airflow has improved and was the culprit in my bogging issue.
    So is it safe to say it solved your bogging issue then....as in it's completely gone?

    Also, do you think you might be able to provide a write up on the OBDII cat conversion?

    Thanks a lot..

    Dan
    Dan

  25. #375
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    Sounds great! How is the power down low? I definately think its CATs. Looks like I know what I'll be replacing next. Thanks very much for the info!!

    -Chris

    ps-- 130k miles here.

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