Changing hoses on Pentosin housing????

[luknatu2]

Guys, I want to change the hoses on my Pentosin housing. There are about 5 of them and I want to change them all. The big one at the bottom is a b$%@h how do you get it off? I want to know if I can use fuel line hoses to replace them and use regular clamps? I am not sure of the size but I will order 3/8, 1/4, and 5/16 rolls If they can be used. If not what hoses can I use???My 2nd question is once I am done do I need to bleed that system and If I do how do you do it??

[mjrgroup]

The following applies for non-ASC+T cars.

The hose is branded BMW 12x18mm and the inside diameter of the hose measures 11mm unstretched. I bought 10 ft of it (more than enough) from AutoHausAz.com

It is all low-pressure hose going off the canister and you can use regular hose clamps. There are two low pressure hoses that you'll need to purchase new from BMW: one is a rubber hose that's crimped onto a metal pipe that connects the canister to the power steering pump (part #32411137554 for NON-ASC+T cars and part #32411137560 for ASC+T cars: both $41 at the dealer).

There's also a metal pipe/hose crimped piece that goes from the non-asc+t canister to the pressure regulator which you can remove the crimp and use a piece of 5/16" IIRC fuel hose.

At the bottom picture of the brake booster components, there is one more metal pipe/crimped hose piece that goes from the power steering pump to the power steering radiator. You should buy this piece new from BMW.

CHANGE ALL ZINC/COPPER CRUSH WASHERS or you will have leaks!

Only fill with Pentosin 7 or 11.x...whatever your car takes...yours is probably 7 since it's an early one. Flush it out a few times...And change the filter in your housing as well.


New and Old Power Steering Hose (32411137554) by MJR GROUP, on Flickr


Cleaned Power Steering Container with New Hose and Clamp by MJR GROUP, on Flickr


Power Steering Return Pipe (With original crimped rubber) (34321159286) by MJR GROUP, on Flickr


BMW Return Line Crimp Connector Cut (34321159286) by MJR GROUP, on Flickr


BMW Return Line in Pieces (34321159286) Original Hose portion removed by MJR GROUP, on Flickr


Modified BMW Return Line with Modified Fuel Pressure Hose to be connected to Pentosin Container by MJR GROUP, on Flickr


Modified BMW Return Line (34321159286) with Fuel Pressure Hose and Screw-type Clamps by MJR GROUP, on Flickr


Core Brake System Rebuild (see description for details) by MJR GROUP, on Flickr

[Terminator77]

Bleeding the system : fill fluid, start the engine, turn the steering wheel from side to side (all the way), refill . If necessary repeat.

[luknatu2]

The following applies for non-ASC+T cars.

The hose is branded BMW 12x18mm and the inside diameter of the hose measures 11mm unstretched. I bought 10 ft of it (more than enough) from AutoHausAz.com

It is all low-pressure hose going off the canister and you can use regular hose clamps. There are two low pressure hoses that you'll need to purchase new from BMW: one is a rubber hose that's crimped onto a metal pipe that connects the canister to the power steering pump (part #32411137554 for NON-ASC+T cars and part #32411137560 for ASC+T cars: both $41 at the dealer).

There's also a metal pipe/hose crimped piece that goes from the non-asc+t canister to the pressure regulator which you can remove the crimp and use a piece of 5/16" IIRC fuel hose.

At the bottom picture of the brake booster components, there is one more metal pipe/crimped hose piece that goes from the power steering pump to the power steering radiator. You should buy this piece new from BMW.

CHANGE ALL ZINC/COPPER CRUSH WASHERS or you will have leaks!

Only fill with Pentosin 7 or 11.x...whatever your car takes...yours is probably 7 since it's an early one. Flush it out a few times...And change the filter in your housing as well.


New and Old Power Steering Hose (32411137554) by MJR GROUP, on Flickr


Cleaned Power Steering Container with New Hose and Clamp by MJR GROUP, on Flickr


Power Steering Return Pipe (With original crimped rubber) (34321159286) by MJR GROUP, on Flickr


BMW Return Line Crimp Connector Cut (34321159286) by MJR GROUP, on Flickr


BMW Return Line in Pieces (34321159286) Original Hose portion removed by MJR GROUP, on Flickr


Modified BMW Return Line with Modified Fuel Pressure Hose to be connected to Pentosin Container by MJR GROUP, on Flickr


Modified BMW Return Line (34321159286) with Fuel Pressure Hose and Screw-type Clamps by MJR GROUP, on Flickr


Core Brake System Rebuild (see description for details) by MJR GROUP, on Flickr

Can you tell me the other part number of the hose that I need to get from BMW....I have the ASC+T model 850I

[mjrgroup]

#1 Intake manifold (non ASC): 32411137554
#1 Intake manifold (ASC+T): 32411137560
#13 Return pipe: 32411137556

Also order QTY 8 of #4 crush washers. I don't have a part # handy for that by the dealer should be able to dig and find one.

Click on the image below and it will link you to RealOEM.com which has part numbers and diagrams for everything in your car.

You are welcome, BTW.

[luknatu2]

#1 Intake manifold (non ASC): 32411137554
#1 Intake manifold (ASC+T): 32411137560
#13 Return pipe: 32411137556

Also order QTY 8 of #4 crush washers. I don't have a part # handy for that by the dealer should be able to dig and find one.

Click on the image below and it will link you to RealOEM.com which has part numbers and diagrams for everything in your car.

You are welcome, BTW.

I really do APPRECIATE your help. Thanks for sure!!!!!!

[luknatu2]

Thanks Terminator!!!

[luknatu2]

Thanks to Terminator and MJR for there help and I now have one last question. There are 2 hoses one goes into the bottom of the pentosin container and leads over by the firewall of the car under the Brake booster and there is another hose that is plugged into the side of the pentosin container that leads to the same area. They seem to be the same size im guessing 1/4 inch but I am not sure. Can someone tell me what the diameter of the hose is including the inner diamter. I want to order new hoses because those where the 2 that where causing my leak. I could just turn the hose and the connector would turn also.

[smc850ci]

Do you mean #22 and #23 here? They show as 12mm and 10mm.

[luknatu2]

Yes those are the ones. Those 2 is where my leak was coming from. I don't want to use those cables. Can I cut off the crimp and replace the hoses with a high pressue hose and regular clamps. I was told from the BMW dealer that these where high pressure hoses because of the clamps.

[luknatu2]

[QUOTE=luknatu2;26833334]Yes those are the ones. Those 2 is where my leak was coming from. I don't want to use those cables. Can I cut off the crimp and replace the hoses with a high pressue hose and regular clamps. I was told from the BMW dealer that these where high pressure hoses because of the clamps.[/QUOTEI have finally completed this job and everything is working great....no Leaks!!!. Thanks to everyone for you help and advice

[e31bev]

How do you tell if the fluid is still good? I'm planning on doing a flush this weekend as lately the steering has been a little stubborn especially during parking. From what I've researched, to flush the system I need to depress the brake pedal approx 20 times untill it stiffens and then the old fluid should fill up inside the reservoir. Then use a Turkey baster to suck up all the old fluid and refill the reservoir with fresh fluid. Then repeat the same steps 2 more times in addition to turning the steering wheel left and right a few times, and by then all the old fluid should be out. Also, how much fluid should I buy? I've heard 2 liters and then someone else said 4 liters, which is it?

[shogun]

[QUOTE=luknatu2;26902252]

I don't want to use those cables. Can I cut off the crimp and replace the hoses with a high pressue hose and regular clamps. I was told from the BMW dealer that these where high pressure hoses because of the clamp

E36 drivers do replace the LOW pressure hoses = which are crimped on one side and the other side has a hose clamp originally with high pressure hydraulic hoses with hose clamps. I have done that on my E36 M3 too, that are the return line from the pump to the container and the feed line to the pump. No more leaks since 2 years.
So basically what you do is:
remove the crimped metal sleeve, be careful when doing that. Buy a new hose and fix that on the metal pipe with the hose clamp, I even used 2 hose clamps.
Here some pics
Special note: the above was for the LOW pressure hoses, when I replaced the crimped parts with clamped hydraulic hoses, for HIGH pressure hoses you need OEM crimped parts

As for LOW pressure lines, here pics, what I found on the net, leaking old hoses and DIY replacement with hoses and hose clamps, maybe they help when you want to DIY

http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/f..._3302Large.jpg
You should also try to get into the habit of getting hose clamps with rolled edges, instead of the flat band style. It will help in avoiding deformation of hoses.
(Overtightened, but you can see what is meant in this example)

https://www.tyrolsport.com/images/cu...tyrol/hose.jpg

http://photos.motoiq.com/MotoIQ/Tech...P1050066-M.jpg

http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/f..._3297Large.jpg

http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/f..._3296Large.jpg

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y28...4/IMG_3727.jpg

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y28...4/IMG_3730.jpg

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y28...4/IMG_3734.jpg

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y28...4/IMG_3745.jpg

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y28...4/IMG_3743.jpg

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y28...4/IMG_3738.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3367/...b0e80cde_b.jpg
These show the dimensions of the original hoses

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images...surehoses.jpg/

replacement hoses 300 psi

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6.../BMW/Hoses.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...MW/Diagram.jpg

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images...ssurehose.jpg/
http://img202.imageshack.us/img202/9...ssurehose1.jpg

http://home.comcast.net/~blake.caldw...o/IMG_0659.JPG
http://www.benhirsch.net/images/temp/powersteering.jpg
http://www.chrispitude.net/view.php?...cindex=6&user=

Here is a long thread about 20 pages long
http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...e-leak-problem

Here is even a write up on BMWCCA: E36 power steering hose failures

Over the past couple driving seasons we have seen a number of on-track failures of the power-steering-return hose on E36 '92-99 series, including M3. The failures we have seen were all the same; the return hose pulled off of the power steering cooler, right at the factory-crimped connection. This failure results in the fluid content of the power-steering system being disgorged in a few seconds, creating quite a hazard on the track surface for the afflicted car and following vehicles. Of course, power steering assist is also lost as well. Why these failures did not commence earlier in the E36 life cycle remains somewhat a mystery. Please note, that we have seen a new, OE hose assemblies fail on their first track session, so replacing the power-steering cooler/return hose assy with stock parts has been shown to be ineffective in addressing the problem.
Although there is not a complete consensus within the BMW repair community as to the cause of these failures, many feel that the primary problem is that the return hose should be longer, and that engine movement (probably more severe in the on-track environment) exaberates the problem. Deteriorated engine and / or transmission mounts can allow increased engine movement, and some feel that high temperatures may be an extenuating factor.
In preparing your E36 for a track event, it is imperative that you carefully check your engine and transmission mounts for deterioration, separation and for excessive motion of the engine and / or the transmission. This inspection is facilitated by the use of a long pry bar.

You should also seriously consider replacing the power steering return hose with a suitable piece of hose a few centimeters longer. BMW hose # 32411131524 (12 mm ID (inside diameter), cut to length) is known to work in this application. You will also need two hose clamps # 11151727509 (15-18mm). Some claim success with aftermarket high-temperature hose of 1/2 inch ID, but be advised that the BMW hose fits the nipple on the steering cooler more tightly than do some nominal 1/2 inch ID hoses. The ferrule is where the failure occurs.

Replacing the return hose is a straightforward operation. After the car has been secured on jack stands or a lift and allowed to cool, begin by cutting the return hose and allowing the contents of the system to drain into a pan.
Note that the return hose is the SMALLER of the 2 hoses attached to the power steering fluid reservoir. Then, CAREFULLY slit and remove the ferrule/hose from the power steering cooler outlet. An abrasive wheel can be used, but a cutting pliers will suffice. Ensure that the hose nipple under the ferrule is not damaged by slitting operation. If it is damaged, you will need to procure a new cooler return hose assy.
When the ferrule and hose have been removed from the cooler outlet, you should see the hose nipple.
Continue by removing the other end of the return hose from the power steering fluid reservoir, then cut the new hose to the appropriate length and install to the cooler and reservoir with two hose clamps. You may find that your removed hose contains a restriction orifice located about 10 cm from the reservoir. You can remove this orifice and push it into your new hose, securing the orifice with a third hose clamp. Refill the system with Dexron ATF or other suitable fluid and bleed the system. Check for leaks and you should be done. Copyright 2011-New Yersey Chapter, BMWCCA,Inc.
-----------------------------------
Power Steering Hose 12 X 18 mm (Per Meter) 32411131524 list price $36.87
hose clamp (actually for cooling system # 11151727509 (15-18mm) $1.30/piece
www.njbmwcca.org/util/get_file.php?file_id=261

Important!!!!!
This is LOW pressure hose = where one side is originally fitted with a banjo bolt and the other side with a hose clamp. High pressure = 130-140 bar are the hoses which are bolted on with banjo bolts on both sides and the hydraulic hose in between is crimp pressed.

[clockwork]

damn, to replace with factory hoses at a fortune, compared to making your own usable hoses.... its a debate, but not one worth a life or more

[legoman67]

damn, to replace with factory hoses at a fortune, compared to making your own usable hoses.... its a debate, but not one worth a life or more

you can make all the low pressures yourself without a worry. its only the high pressures you should buy new. There arent that many high pressures(#8 and #12 are the only high pressures in the skematic above)... i think i spent around $3-400 on all the high pressure lines

[clockwork]

you can make all the low pressures yourself without a worry. its only the high pressures you should buy new. There arent that many high pressures(#8 and #12 are the only high pressures in the skematic above)... i think i spent around $3-400 on all the high pressure lines

many thanks for the re-assurance, I'm guess I'm good then. I'm assuming #8 is coming of the back end (closest side to firewall) of the hydro unit and that I know is leaking on my car, so I'll have to buy that too. and well I may as well buy # 12 then I know all hoses for the pentosin are new. thanks for everything.

Actually can you just look at a hose and determine if its a high pressure line?

[legoman67]

If any hose has a hose clamp at either end(normal hose clamp, or the bmw one time use ones(IE https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/i...51ZLC7U9C1Xt7p)), its not a high pressure hose. If its got crimped connections on both ends, odds are it is high pressure.

[clockwork]

Legoman, thanks again!!! time to order some hoses.

[mjrgroup]

The two hoses I modified are low pressure hoses. I'm going on year three now with zero leaks using regular fuel hose (not fuel injection hose)!

#8 and #12 are the only high pressure hoses in the system, AFAIK.