Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 32

Thread: adding vanos to non vanos m50 head

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    SF bay area
    Posts
    2,773
    My Cars
    1998 M3 / 2000 S2000

    adding vanos to non vanos m50 head

    I took a 1991 build e36 m50 non vanos cylinder head

    added:

    S52b32 vanos business with complete cam trays and cams from S52b32

    to create a chimera of:

    dual valvesprings + 7mm valve stems
    +
    s52 cam setup
    +vanos

    for reference:

    nonvanos m50 diagram

    http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts...81&hg=11&fg=15

    Vanos S52 diagram

    http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts...80&hg=11&fg=15

    notice a similarity between the front cover plate and an identical gasket shared between them?

    06Gasket Asbestos Free
    1

    11361740840$7.19
    Last edited by wanganstyle; 03-07-2012 at 03:32 PM.
    Wanganstyle Powertrain
    http://www.wanganstyle.com/

    S54B32 E36 M3 DTA S100 Sedan Street car full swap:
    http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1437471

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    60517
    Posts
    5,195
    My Cars
    94 325i, 95 M3, 1997 325
    The only way you can add s52 cams to that motor is o get a m50 vanos head. m52 might work but non the less you need a vanos head.
    Washedit1 by thedude60526, on Flickr
    11/10's Racing
    94 325i #36/64 TEAM PENISTON OILS/ LARSENS BISCUITS

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    SF bay area
    Posts
    2,773
    My Cars
    1998 M3 / 2000 S2000
    Sorry. You are completely wrong....
    Last edited by wanganstyle; 01-13-2010 at 02:19 PM.
    Wanganstyle Powertrain
    http://www.wanganstyle.com/

    S54B32 E36 M3 DTA S100 Sedan Street car full swap:
    http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1437471

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Charlotte/Raleigh, NC
    Posts
    1,068
    My Cars
    94 325is, 98 528i
    You can do what ever. Heads have the same casting.

    If you are running s52 cams you just need to have s52 trays and lifters.

    Motor I am building is using a NV block with NV head and S50 cams w/ Vanos unit.
    M50 3.1L Stroker - TC Kline D/A

  5. #5
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    CT
    Posts
    6,242
    My Cars
    e28, e30, e36
    I think the head casting is the same. You would need to transfer the lifters, cam trays with the cams. not sure about the valve clearance with those lifters and cams.

    try to get new valve guides.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    SF bay area
    Posts
    2,773
    My Cars
    1998 M3 / 2000 S2000
    Quote Originally Posted by BMWMPow3r View Post
    I think the head casting is the same. You would need to transfer the lifters, cam trays with the cams. not sure about the valve clearance with those lifters and cams.

    try to get new valve guides.

    most def- I will be refreshing the entire head before it goes into my car-

    would i have possible valve to piston clearance issues with the bigger valves? I know if a stock s52 head is decked too much you will have valve/piston contact
    Wanganstyle Powertrain
    http://www.wanganstyle.com/

    S54B32 E36 M3 DTA S100 Sedan Street car full swap:
    http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1437471

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    SF bay area
    Posts
    2,773
    My Cars
    1998 M3 / 2000 S2000

    Re: adding vanos to non vanos m50 head

    Head @ machine shop. Will have it next week or so-


    Are there any speciication difference between the nonvanos and vanos lifters?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Wanganstyle Powertrain
    http://www.wanganstyle.com/

    S54B32 E36 M3 DTA S100 Sedan Street car full swap:
    http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1437471

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    SD
    Posts
    632
    My Cars
    330Ci
    Answer to your first question, yes. I actually just came across someones build, just like your, not too long ago on here. They even had the VANOS unit tucked into the non-VANOS cam gear cover and valve cover. So when it was all buttoned up and going you still didn't know it had VANOS inside it. Don't recall the link to the build though. If I find it I'll get a link for you.
    05 BMW X5 - 09 Yamaha R6 - 04 Ski-Doo mxzX 440 lc race sled - 04 Ford F350 SCrew PSD

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    SF bay area
    Posts
    2,773
    My Cars
    1998 M3 / 2000 S2000
    Quote Originally Posted by mzender View Post
    Answer to your first question, yes. I actually just came across someones build, just like your, not too long ago on here. They even had the VANOS unit tucked into the non-VANOS cam gear cover and valve cover. So when it was all buttoned up and going you still didn't know it had VANOS inside it.
    This dosnt make sense- The vanos unit cannot fit in the nonvanos cam cover, You have to clearance the NV cylinder head casting a slight bit to clear the vanos assembly as it takes up more volume than the non-vanos fron head plate cover. Vanos head castings have more clearance there, it pretty much just profiles the front plate gasket where the NV head has more meat on the intake cam area side (simply didn't need the clearance).

    What you saw possibly was a vanos motor with vanos deleted, nonvanos cams and carriers and sproketry in place with nonvanos valvecover, etc.
    Last edited by wanganstyle; 02-26-2010 at 05:26 PM.
    Wanganstyle Powertrain
    http://www.wanganstyle.com/

    S54B32 E36 M3 DTA S100 Sedan Street car full swap:
    http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1437471

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    SF bay area
    Posts
    2,773
    My Cars
    1998 M3 / 2000 S2000

    Re: adding vanos to non vanos m50 head

    S52 head fresh pulled from my 97m, nonvanos plate pops right on.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Wanganstyle Powertrain
    http://www.wanganstyle.com/

    S54B32 E36 M3 DTA S100 Sedan Street car full swap:
    http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1437471

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    SF bay area
    Posts
    2,773
    My Cars
    1998 M3 / 2000 S2000

    Re: adding vanos to non vanos m50 head

    Nonvanos head back from machine shop
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by wanganstyle; 02-26-2010 at 05:24 PM.
    Wanganstyle Powertrain
    http://www.wanganstyle.com/

    S54B32 E36 M3 DTA S100 Sedan Street car full swap:
    http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1437471

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    SF bay area
    Posts
    2,773
    My Cars
    1998 M3 / 2000 S2000

    Re: adding vanos to non vanos m50 head

    Double valvesprings, 7mm valve stems etc etc
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Wanganstyle Powertrain
    http://www.wanganstyle.com/

    S54B32 E36 M3 DTA S100 Sedan Street car full swap:
    http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1437471

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    SF bay area
    Posts
    2,773
    My Cars
    1998 M3 / 2000 S2000

    Re: adding vanos to non vanos m50 head

    Nonvanos head bolted on s52 block with camtray, lifters, cams and vanos from s52 installed; plug and play. DME fired it up just like a S52 normal, no real big difference.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by wanganstyle; 02-26-2010 at 05:31 PM.
    Wanganstyle Powertrain
    http://www.wanganstyle.com/

    S54B32 E36 M3 DTA S100 Sedan Street car full swap:
    http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1437471

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    baltimore, maryland
    Posts
    435
    My Cars
    E36TRBO,01m3 S/C,others
    I did it all I had to do is switch the front intake cam cap and shave some metal off the front of the head. No rocket science. My dillema if anyone can help is the valve size and compatibility issues. If I have a non- vanos head wil +1mm vanos valves replace the ones in the non vanos, with a little machinist persuasion...


    Im also running 95///l/l3 schricks
    Last edited by crazeetowntatto; 01-12-2011 at 12:14 PM. Reason: forgot to mention cams

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    SF bay area
    Posts
    2,773
    My Cars
    1998 M3 / 2000 S2000
    vanos valves have 6mm stems. non vanos is thicker at 7mm. The valveguides are the only thing that determines this, so if you are changing stem diameter - swap valveguides to match.

    the 6mm valves have less mass and technically a tiny bit more flow, but they are also known to drop heads.
    Wanganstyle Powertrain
    http://www.wanganstyle.com/

    S54B32 E36 M3 DTA S100 Sedan Street car full swap:
    http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1437471

  16. #16
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    457
    My Cars
    E30, E82, F30
    Any updates?

    I recently got a cracked S50 head and will be doing the same thing:

    -Convert to 413 with M3 harness, tooth wheel, all the sensors including cam sync, MAF
    -Install vanos, cams, trays, lifters


    So the end result: S50 head with dual valvesprings!


    Anyone know if compression changes? What about valve relief with the duration changes from Vanos?
    Last edited by Tchao; 01-18-2011 at 02:43 AM.
    Turbo E30s. The New Supercars.
    Quote Originally Posted by mazur
    Sriracha is too hot for me.

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    SF,Seattle,Boise,LA
    Posts
    1,549
    My Cars
    ACS e36, e30, 944
    Quote Originally Posted by wanganstyle View Post
    vanos valves have 6mm stems. non vanos is thicker at 7mm. The valveguides are the only thing that determines this, so if you are changing stem diameter - swap valveguides to match.

    the 6mm valves have less mass and technically a tiny bit more flow, but they are also known to drop heads.
    Nice meeting you and Henry.

    What software and ecu you going to run? Can you keep the 402 NV chip if you did this?
    Too bad I sold my 97 s52.

    Extra bump
    Last edited by NAHSAYN; 01-18-2011 at 06:05 AM.

  18. #18
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    457
    My Cars
    E30, E82, F30
    bump?
    Turbo E30s. The New Supercars.
    Quote Originally Posted by mazur
    Sriracha is too hot for me.

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    SF bay area
    Posts
    2,773
    My Cars
    1998 M3 / 2000 S2000
    Quote Originally Posted by NAHSAYN View Post
    Nice meeting you and Henry.

    What software and ecu you going to run? Can you keep the 402 NV chip if you did this?
    Too bad I sold my 97 s52.

    Extra bump
    you could easily use a s52 bottom end or put a s52 crank in your m50NV to make it a 3.0 liter.

    then it woud be very easy for you to use a 325i 93 vanos wiring harness to pug and play a 413 vanos ecu and add chip for whatever engine displacement and cam setup you would like.

    basically using a M50NV as base for build up:

    you would + s52/m54 crankshaft or S52 shortblock for 3000cc or 3200cc
    add s50/s52 cams / cam carriers+ lifters+ headers+ vanos+valvecover (or s50/m50vanos valve cover so you can keep the 4 bolt coil packs.

    the head has slight difference in bowl shape, my machine shop examined them side to side after pressure testing my old s52 head and doing a valve job and seal replacement on my M50NV head, they said it wouldn't be much of difference, decking the head would do more impact.

    Quote Originally Posted by NAHSAYN View Post
    Nice meeting you and Henry.

    What software and ecu you going to run? Can you keep the 402 NV chip if you did this?
    Too bad I sold my 97 s52.

    Extra bump
    402 ecu cannot run vanos.

    but you could run double M50nv intake cams to have hotter cam setup and keep the non vanos setup, unless you really feel your application needs the vanos-

    Quote Originally Posted by Tchao View Post
    Any updates?

    I recently got a cracked S50 head and will be doing the same thing:

    -Convert to 413 with M3 harness, tooth wheel, all the sensors including cam sync, MAF
    -Install vanos, cams, trays, lifters


    So the end result: S50 head with dual valvesprings!


    Anyone know if compression changes? What about valve relief with the duration changes from Vanos?

    between s50/52 and m50nv all Valves are same diameter, only valve stems are different diameter.

    you would do same as I did with my S52
    Last edited by wanganstyle; 01-31-2011 at 02:17 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
    Wanganstyle Powertrain
    http://www.wanganstyle.com/

    S54B32 E36 M3 DTA S100 Sedan Street car full swap:
    http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1437471

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Posts
    1,548
    My Cars
    '97 M3, '95 M3, '93 325i
    Whatever happened with this thread? What are you revving your s52 w/ NV valve springs to 7500RPM?

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    SF bay area
    Posts
    2,773
    My Cars
    1998 M3 / 2000 S2000
    Quote Originally Posted by Talperian View Post
    Whatever happened with this thread? What are you revving your s52 w/ NV valve springs to 7500RPM?
    I installed s52 vanos and s52 trays+ cams into the non vanos head; I drove the car a month- rev limit stayed the same as I was using stock s52 cams and dme.

    Then I removed the s52 and installed a complete s54b32 engine from e46 m3. That one rev'ed to 8400rpm and was more worth the effort

    Nowadays the cool thing to do is install dual vanos setup from m54b30 into s52 longmotor so one can spool up a larger turbo with dual vanos. The iron block is also stronger and takes heat stress better than the aluminum m54 block; 200cc additional displacement is also nice
    Wanganstyle Powertrain
    http://www.wanganstyle.com/

    S54B32 E36 M3 DTA S100 Sedan Street car full swap:
    http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1437471

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Dayton, OH, United States
    Posts
    0
    My Cars
    2009 bmw m3
    DME fired it up just like a S52 normal, no real big difference.
    Last edited by daviomaron; 01-19-2013 at 09:34 PM.

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Central Texas
    Posts
    932
    My Cars
    e93 and e89
    Doing a m50nv with s50 cams and adding a m52 vanos (1996 328i) with an 413 dme and e36 harness. Afterr much reading should be a straight bolt on. I'm not taking the head offf and therefore valves of 7mm will stay. My question is in regards of a chip to tune it. Which chip will be best on a small budget for a DD sleeper? I heard the TMS chip but would like more input.

    finalyy this will need to be BAR as a 1992 engine

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    South Carolina
    Posts
    31,073
    My Cars
    2004 330 vert 2004 X5
    Bar?

  25. #25
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Central Texas
    Posts
    932
    My Cars
    e93 and e89
    California BAR
    http://www.bar.ca.gov/

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •