I wanna order some new headlights (thinking of going with the 8000K). On the DDM site, they have options for 3 kinds of angel eyes:
Predator Chromium
Predator Orion
DDE Plus
What's the difference (brightness, color), and is there one that is clearly better?

Also, there's an option to upgrade to 55W ballasts...what's this mean, and is it worth it?

Thanks

I wanna order some new headlights (thinking of going with the 8000K). On the DDM site, they have options for 3 kinds of angel eyes:
Predator Chromium
Predator Orion
DDE Plus
What's the difference (brightness, color), and is there one that is clearly better?

Also, there's an option to upgrade to 55W ballasts...what's this mean, and is it worth it?

Thanks

non of them are real, they are all knockoffs of the Geniune products we sell, in essence they are ripping off our names and attaching them to their less expensive generic products making beleive you are buying the real thing.

if you want to be sure you get chromium or orions which are the industry's best product and the yard stick by which all others are measured contact an autorized and approved seller, we can offer you competitive pricing on the top of the line geniune atricle.

So I answer the members questions. Come back to check on the thread and.....
....hmm, it seems my post has been deleted.
Im guessing this one will be deleted as well

well isn't this some b/s. habbie can come in here and bad mouth all he wants. lets email kevlar.

Imagine this: a helpful response!

this should enlighten you
http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=978699

hmm, it seems my post has been deleted.
Im guessing this one will be deleted as well
you were instructed by the administration of the forum you will refrain from using the terms chromium, predator or orion which are all registered names owned by umnitza, any reference to these terms will promptly be removed.

non of them are real, they are all knockoffs of the Geniune products we sell, in essence they are ripping off our names and attaching them to their less expensive generic products making beleive you are buying the real thing.

if you want to be sure you get chromium or orions which are the industry's best product and the yard stick by which all others are measured contact an autorized and approved seller, we can offer you competitive pricing on the top of the line geniune atricle.

I've heard nothing but good things about DDM. Some of us don't have crazy money to spend on lighting. What's the point in spending around $500+ for something that does the same thing as a $150-$200 product? (which is covered under warranty, and can be replaced for cheap, if not for free, if it fails)

As for you GR7, I don't know the difference between them. I'm going to pick up a headlight package from them eventually.

you were instructed by the administration of the forum you will refrain from using the terms chromium, predator or orion which are all registered names owned by umnitza, any reference to these terms will promptly be removed.


someone can't speak of the names, wow, that is over the top. So other than the "tin foil" on the back, what is the difference and why can you come in here and air whatever opinion you want?

habbie, who produces your product? mycarr?

I really like umnitza and their products but I can't justify spending almost a thousand dollars on the headlight setup I've always wanted when I can get it for very cheap, modify it and install TSX projectors and have superior light output.

http://www.forumspile.com/Thread-I_like_where_this_thread_is_going.jpg

hmm I seem to have started an argument. i thank everyone for the links and info, but i am interested in finding out more about the ddm product only, from people not affiliated with any light related companies. thanks.

ps if anyone has any pics of the ddm lights w/ their angel eyes in action that'd be awesome.

I've heard nothing but good things about DDM. Some of us don't have crazy money to spend on lighting. What's the point in spending around $500+ for something that does the same thing as a $150-$200 product? (which is covered under warranty, and can be replaced for cheap, if not for free, if it fails)

As for you GR7, I don't know the difference between them. I'm going to pick up a headlight package from them eventually.

thats all good and dandy but they still cant infringe on other's product and hard work, we invest $$$$ in research and development to stand by and watch others falsely use our names to sell cheaper and inferior product as if it were the same.
all they have to do is sell their product using their name and not ours misleading people into thinking they are getting ours, simple.

I really like umnitza and their products but I can't justify spending almost a thousand dollars on the headlight setup I've always wanted when I can get it for very cheap, modify it and install TSX projectors and have superior light output.

you dont have to, we have the same $100 headlights and we have $1k headlight and everything in between.

habbie, can you please explain to me the "difference" in the two that makes them so inferior. Who manufactures your rings?

hmm I seem to have started an argument. i thank everyone for the links and info, but i am interested in finding out more about the ddm product only, from people not affiliated with any light related companies. thanks.

ps if anyone has any pics of the ddm lights w/ their angel eyes in action that'd be awesome.

I cannot say anything about the DDM angel eyes because I decided against getting angel eyes when I purchased my lights. What I can say is that they have excellent customer service and you WILL be happy with the money you spend.

If you read that link I posted into my last post it would explain the difference between the CCFL and LED versions.

habbie, can you please explain to me the "difference" in the two that makes them so inferior. Who manufactures your rings?
the differences were explained in too many threads, search and you'll find.
ponder this, after 3 years of knocking off chromiums and still not being able to properly do it why else would someone falsely use the term chromium to describe a product they themselves addmited wasn't the same??
hint: it ain't because chromium is cheap and no good..

I cannot say anything about the DDM angel eyes because I decided against getting angel eyes when I purchased my lights. What I can say is that they have excellent customer service and you WILL be happy with the money you spend.

If you read that link I posted into my last post it would explain the difference between the CCFL and LED versions.

Thanks, i read through that (i like the look of LED better). I'd still like to hear form someone who has the DDM angel eyes, and anyone who can point me towards which of the three they offer or at least explain their differences. Thanks very much.


Edit: my mistake, I didn't realize that the link you posted was displaying the brand of angel eyes that DDM is selling with their headlight kits. Thanks a bunch.

the differences were explained in too many threads, search and you'll find.
ponder this, after 3 years of knocking off chromiums and still not being able to properly do it why else would someone falsely use the term chromium to describe a product they themselves addmited wasn't the same??
hint: it ain't because chromium is cheap and no good..

habbie, who manufactures your kit?

hmm I seem to have started an argument. i thank everyone for the links and info, but i am interested in finding out more about the ddm product only, from people not affiliated with any light related companies. thanks.

ps if anyone has any pics of the ddm lights w/ their angel eyes in action that'd be awesome.

sweet habbie...To the OP, there were several threads about these angel eyes and the difference, Im gonna search the forum for a bit and get back to you...you should search a little too.

I went through a couple pages and didn't find what i need, but i will get back to it. Thanks very much for looking as well.

ok here is a quick comparison
chromium - reflective backing for less light bleeding
dde plus - standard rings but with no reflective backing
orion - LED's and start right up

IMO the chromium and dde plus are almost the same, i used to have chromiums. the orions are the newest thing out and have no problem starting in the cold.
as for color you can view the link posted by 98dakarm3

as for the 55w ballasts, compared to the 35w ballast, it makes the light brighter. from what i hear its worth the money.

Thanks for the info everyone, I ordered my set..went with 6000k (didn't wanna be too blue) with the chromium angel eyes (the LEDs kinda look too spaced out to me).

i opted for the 35w ballast because i didn't wanna be so overbearingly bright that oncoming traffic is being blasted off the road...am i wrong about this? i know i get really angry at the super bright xenon lights sometimes, i think people have their brights on..

thats all good and dandy but they still cant infringe on other's product and hard work, we invest $$$$ in research and development to stand by and watch others falsely use our names to sell cheaper and inferior product as if it were the same.
all they have to do is sell their product using their name and not ours misleading people into thinking they are getting ours, simple.

OOOOH!!! :eek: Call them cheaper and inferior, but they work the same. So others can call yours overpriced and overrated. Road goes 2 ways. Don't get your panties in a wad. I guess you should also tell this guy ( http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=980547339061120203 ) he's stealing and infringing on your product for showing others how to make some home-made ones. It's capitalism, get over it. I'm pretty sure that the people buying DDM's product know that the products aren't OEM or the "real" thing. But that's why the price is so great!! DDM FTW!!


Thanks for the info everyone, I ordered my set..went with 6000k (didn't wanna be too blue) with the chromium angel eyes (the LEDs kinda look too spaced out to me).

i opted for the 35w ballast because i didn't wanna be so overbearingly bright that oncoming traffic is being blasted off the road...am i wrong about this? i know i get really angry at the super bright xenon lights sometimes, i think people have their brights on..

Of course, post pics and your review of them whenever you get them installed!!!

you were instructed by the administration of the forum you will refrain from using the terms chromium, predator or orion which are all registered names owned by umnitza, any reference to these terms will promptly be removed.

It's not illegal to speak or write registered names or trademarks. If it were, we'd all get sued for writing "BMW".

I am still wanting to know who manufactures habbie's rings.

Of course, post pics and your review of them whenever you get them installed!!!

Will do! Back to my lurking until then..good day sirs.

I am still wanting to know who manufactures habbie's rings.

im sure its on his "things to do list". why dont you go make some useful posts or PM him if you want to further discuss items.

well isn't this some b/s. habbie can come in here and bad mouth all he wants. lets email kevlar.

dont do that....he wont help imo

habbie beats around the subject...its useless trying to keep track of their little wars...
just order from whoever can deliver what you want

i just got a set up P46's from DDM....cause the price was not even close to habbie's..for essentially the same product

I'm tired of this crap. Habbie and umnitza think they fu*king own this forum. I have bought from DDM and they are an awesome sponsor. Not once have I seen them bashing other sponsors, not once have I seen them selling overpriced items, not once have I seen them ripping off the bmw community. I wish I could say the same for the other side of the competition. You KNOW stuff is jacked up when sponsors are deleting other sponsors posts and threads. That is childish and unprofessional. This kind of crap needs to stop or bimmerforums is bound to fail. DDM and Jlevi are two of the most honest sponsors on this site and no one will ever have to question them. Just my .02 cents.

Best regards,

Neil

dont do that....he wont help imo

habbie beats around the subject...its useless trying to keep track of their little wars...
just order from whoever can deliver what you want

i just got a set up P46's from DDM....cause the price was not even close to habbie's..for essentially the same product

oh really? have you ever seen Habbies product? if not, keep your "opinions" to yourself.

I'm tired of this crap. Habbie and umnitza think they fu*king own this forum. I have bought from DDM and they are an awesome sponsor. Not once have I seen them bashing other sponsors, not once have I seen them selling overpriced items, not once have I seen them ripping off the bmw community. I wish I could say the same for the other side of the competition. You KNOW stuff is jacked up when sponsors are deleting other sponsors posts and threads. That is childish and unprofessional. This kind of crap needs to stop or bimmerforums is bound to fail. DDM and Jlevi are two of the most honest sponsors on this site and no one will ever have to question them. Just my .02 cents.

Best regards,

Neil


:lol:lol who do you think Jlevi gets his lighting from? hahahahahaha

im sure its on his "things to do list". why dont you go make some useful posts or PM him if you want to further discuss items.

I just want it to be public. If he is trash talking the other product I would like to know who is manufacturing his product to make it so much better. He started this discussion. Why will he not answer me?

I just want it to be public. If he is trash talking the other product I would like to know who is manufacturing his product to make it so much better. He started this discussion. Why will he not answer me?

thats great, but how does it help this thread? keep your statements on topic please. if you have advice to give to the OP do it and be done.

it is on topic. Manufacturing of the products could be a big difference which is on topic for the OP. If I am off topic, so are Habbie's post.

please, every1 knows you are a DDM supporter.. you arent fooling anyone. give the OP advice or leave.

dude are you habbies new friend?
i think eurotunerwerks statements are VERY on topic

and i'll express my opinions all i want
to me, P46's are P46's no matter how much you try to make one look better

dude are you habbies new friend?
i think eurotunerwerks statements are VERY on topic

and i'll express my opinions all i want
to me, P46's are P46's no matter how much you try to make one look better

:clap want a cookie?

I know Jlevi gets his products from umnitza but I brought him up because I bought suspension from him. Umnitza doesnt even carry good E46 suspension. I am on topic btw, I am informing the OP not to listen to goons like you who are paid by sponsors to advertise for them. If not, that's the way you are presenting yourself... People like you are just digging your own grave IMO.

oh really? and where do you see me mentioning the forum sponsors name anywhere? please stop trolling and move along.

please, every1 knows you are a DDM supporter.. you arent fooling anyone. give the OP advice or leave.


LoL, i guess i am their poster boy now. okay, I will give the OP advise : don't buy Bavtoys/Umnitza products because you can get the same product manufactured by the SAME company for much less and better customer service.

please, every1 knows you are a DDM supporter.. you arent fooling anyone. give the OP advice or leave.

oh god, accusing others of being a vendor supporter

Mpowered95, not to judge or anything but by the way you look in your profile pic, I would not believe a word you have to say. And your attitude and post history of supporting habbie don't help either. The OP just wants a non biased review... And you are not providing him with one. So please go away.

Best regards,

Neil

Mpowered95, not to judge or anything but by the way you look in your profile pic, I would not believe a word you have to say. And your attitude and post history of supporting habbie don't help either. The OP just wants a non biased review... And you are not providing him with one. So please go away.

Best regards,

Neil

:lol and you are? o boy, wait for the axe to come out.

LoL, i guess i am their poster boy now. okay, I will give the OP advise : don't buy Bavtoys/Umnitza products because you can get the same product manufactured by the SAME company for much less and better customer service.

:nono until youve purchased or personally seen these items, please refrain from making these kind of remarks.

:lol and you are? o boy, wait for the axe to come out.



:nono until youve purchased or personally seen these items, please refrain from making these kind of remarks.

this is why i am trying to ask habbie who manufactures his product so that EVERYONE will no and it won't be a question anymore.

what the hell man? I have DDM products my friend bought some umnitza P46s with predator chromiums. I have seen the two products right next to each other and there is no visible difference. There are many other threads on other forums addressing this crap. On E46Fanatics there is a thread comparing Chromiums to MYCARR CCFLs. They are the exact same except for the chrome backing. Which does nothing to increase the forward output of the light. There are about 95% who agree with this side of the argument and then there are the umnitza/bavtoys fanboys or b:tches. Sorry man but its true. There are people in this world that want to make money and there are some people that sincerely try to help the bmw community and that's what sets sponsors apart.

Best regards,

Neil

what the hell man? I have DDM products my friend bought some umnitza P46s with predator chromiums. I have seen the two products right next to each other and there is no visible difference. There are many other threads on other forums addressing this crap. On E46Fanatics there is a thread comparing Chromiums to MYCARR CCFLs. They are the exact same except for the chrome backing. Which does nothing to increase the forward output of the light. There are about 95% who agree with this side of the argument and then there are the umnitza/bavtoys fanboys or b:tches. Sorry man but its true. There are people in this world that want to make money and there are some people that sincerely try to help the bmw community and that's what sets sponsors apart.

Best regards,

Neil

you are obviously a lighting noob. the chrome backing (which is what makes these two items different) doesnt allow the light to escape, hence more light in the angel eye. please go to some homework before you come into someones thread barking all kinds of nonsense.

btw.. The OP just bought from DDM!!! Another umnitza/bavtoys fanboy fails again. He didn't even have to listen to this pathetic argument

I measured the lumen output of both angel eyes and they were the same. So don't call me a noob because you are the only one here that has only presented one side of the argument. The side that you are probably getting paid to vouch for

Not once have I seen them bashing other sponsors, not once have I seen them selling overpriced items, not once have I seen them ripping off the bmw community. you obviously need your eyes examined, not only do they bash they lie all the time, they dont have chromiums, never had never will its an exclusive product, orion is too and ice is as well, you dont see me selling DDM hid or APEXCON lights?? why would i? you only knock off names when they are of certain value and notoriety..
as for pricing i suppose ddm and everyone else was and is ripping the BMW community when the sold their stuff at regular price??

I just want it to be public. If he is trash talking the other product I would like to know who is manufacturing his product to make it so much better. He started this discussion. Why will he not answer me?
i was not thrash taliking, simply pointed out the lie, they dont have any of the 3 name brand [roducts they claim, that is an outright lie no matter how you or any other cheerleader dress it.

we make our own products in our own facilities for some time now, sharing that information with you is probably beyond last on my do to list.

all of our production has moved to a private facility where we can control every detail and avoid knock offs and "almost" or "virtually" the same but not quite being sold to poachers and vultures.
it is on topic. Manufacturing of the products could be a big difference which is on topic for the OP. If I am off topic, so are Habbie's post.
when someone infringes on my rights and my products everything i say is on topic, if you want knock offs fine buy them and sell them but dont use my product name and my products reputation to sell yours when its a FACT acknowleged by all that you do not nor ever had them, simple enough for you to grasp??
LoL, i guess i am their poster boy now. okay, I will give the OP advise : don't buy Bavtoys/Umnitza products because you can get the same product manufactured by the SAME company for much less and better customer service.

since you never bought from us or seen any of my products and you relay strictly on hear say and have no clue about our product, service and cant support any of it from a personal experience stand point other then to incite and push your personal agenda it seems to me they reek of ignorance.

I suggest you guys give this thread a rest and move right along, the mods and admins frown on these types of exchanges and act accordingly.
beating a dead horse time after time will more then likely get you noticed for all the wrong reasons.
if DDm chooses to dispute of the validity of any facts here they can do it themselves without the help of the usual pack of lap dogs and the chorus of cheer leaders, i doubt they can or will.

oh i forgot i came into here to sell. good im glad that he bought himself some cheap chinese goods. i hope when he goes to post in there forum again when his plug and play is backwards that he gets a ton of support from you guys. i could care less what any of you ladies think, and quite frankly i think its funny that you guys are getting so amped up when im not insulting or calling you guys any names. can you can insecure?

I measured the lumen output of both angel eyes and they were the same. So don't call me a noob because you are the only one here that has only presented one side of the argument. The side that you are probably getting paid to vouch for

care to tell us what tool you used and what the readings were? i'd love to hear that one, do it in the next 5 minutes and stay off google...

so habbie...comparing just the headlights (not angel eyes/hid, ect) what is the difference between your P46 and DDM's P46

both claim they are DEPO

i'm just curious

care to tell us what tool you used and what the readings were? i'd love to hear that one, do it in the next 5 minutes and stay off google...

Your "houlier than thou" attitude really isn't helping to swing my opinion of your company. Thats probably the biggest thing that bugs me about you guys. Thats the reason that I never bought my lights from you a while ago.

I'll pay more for a product/service when I think its worth it, but from talking to you before and watching you act like the big boy on the block now, it just turns me off more. You would be better off not trash talking in threads like this, it would just seem more professional to go about things in a positive way.. :dunno:

If your lighting products are superior and that justifies the price, let the consumers make their own decisions...

so habbie...comparing just the headlights (not angel eyes/hid, ect) what is the difference between your P46 and DDM's P46

both claim they are DEPO

i'm just curious

be happy with what you bought, enjoy them and worry about the important things in life instead of being an e-warrior.
i dont go around pleading with anyone who would listen that my products are the same or as good as__________ mine have earned their keep and reputations on their merit, design and performance over the last 4+ years, its why lesser companies always compare their product to ours but never the other way around....

lol @ how much this thread fails in every single way...

Every person on both sides of the coin are being ridiculous. I personally prefer DDM, but Habbie has a legitimate point when DDM is using their product's names. Past that though, they are extremely identical products and extremely different prices. This thread is simply beating a dead horse on something that has be researched/proven BY UNBIASED MEMBERS over and over and over in about 999 other threads.

/thread

habbie, for a sponsor to come on these forums and post this kind of nonsense is pathetic. I figured you would have already deleted all the posts against you and locked this thread. But since you haven't... let's keep going. All companies have to make profit, but when I meant overpriced you know that I meant and implied way overpriced. Not by how much it is worth at cost to the manufacturer, but the price you jack it up. And I know that all these angel eyes are made in China or Taiwan or Japan or somewhere. And unless you can provide proof that you "make" your own angel eyes. Then nothing you say is legitimate or worthwhile. So for the sake of future consumers, tomorrow I am going to release an in depth review of your products vs. "generic" products. Let's see what others decide...

lol @ how much this thread fails in every single way...

Every person on both sides of the coin are being ridiculous. I personally prefer DDM, but Habbie has a legitimate point when DDM is using their product's names. Past that though, they are extremely identical products and extremely different prices. This thread is simply beating a dead horse on something that has be researched/proven BY UNBIASED MEMBERS over and over and over in about 999 other threads.

/thread

i have been completely un-bias this whole thread, i dont see how you can claim this. and of course Habbie is gonna be bias. lol

Oh yeah I'm also lolling HARD at how the people on both sides are trying to convince the other who's better, when it's clear that each person already has their loyalties set... Just lol guys give it a rest

Your "houlier than thou" attitude really isn't helping to swing my opinion of your company. Thats probably the biggest thing that bugs me about you guys. Thats the reason that I never bought my lights from you a while ago.

I'll pay more for a product/service when I think its worth it, but from talking to you before and watching you act like the big boy on the block now, it just turns me off more. You would be better off not trash talking in threads like this, it would just seem more professional to go about things in a positive way.. :dunno:

If your lighting products are superior and that justifies the price, let the consumers make their own decisions...

+100 ....something like 80% of customers never return because of poor service. Take advice habbie, stop posting threads defending your product. If it's as good as you say it is, then it'll defend itself and it'll outsell if its really worth it to the people.

be happy with what you bought, enjoy them and worry about the important things in life instead of being an e-warrior.
i dont go around pleading with anyone who would listen that my products are the same or as good as__________ mine have earned their keep and reputations on their merit, design and performance over the last 4+ years, its why lesser companies always compare their product to ours but never the other way around....

does that mean they are the same

Your "houlier than thou" attitude really isn't helping to swing my opinion of your company. Thats probably the biggest thing that bugs me about you guys. Thats the reason that I never bought my lights from you a while ago.

I'll pay more for a product/service when I think its worth it, but from talking to you before and watching you act like the big boy on the block now, it just turns me off more. You would be better off not trash talking in threads like this, it would just seem more professional.. :dunno:

If your lighting products are superior and that justifies the price, let the consumers make their own decisions...

i do, everyday and people come back day after day month after month, we must be doing something right..
i dont steal names, i dont compare my products to anyone elses they sell themselves and others wish they had them that they lie and decieve by using our names to peddle their products.
when someone sells theirs as if they are the same as mine i will stand up and point that out, one day when you are in business and others RIP OFF your products and hard work you might get a clue.

habbie, for a sponsor to come on these forums and post this kind of nonsense is pathetic. I figured you would have already deleted all the posts against you and locked this thread. But since you haven't... let's keep going. All companies have to make profit, but when I meant overpriced you know that I meant and implied way overpriced. Not by how much it is worth at cost to the manufacturer, but the price you jack it up. And I know that all these angel eyes are made in China or Taiwan or Japan or somewhere. And unless you can provide proof that you "make" your own angel eyes. Then nothing you say is legitimate or worthwhile. So for the sake of future consumers, tomorrow I am going to release an in depth review of your products vs. "generic" products. Let's see what others decide...

cant back up your claim?? post the name of that tool you used and the readings you got, i would love to see them, since its clear you have no clue about either...

does that mean they are the same

as the saying goes, there can only be one original....

so the DDM projector 46's are fake depos? really

can you just straight up state the difference if any?

i do, everyday and people come back day after day month after month, we must be doing something right..
i dont steal names, i dont compare my products to anyone elses they sell themselves and others wish they had them that they lie and decieve by using our names to peddle their products.
when someone sells theirs as if they are the same as mine i will stand up and point that out, one day when you are in business and others RIP OFF your products and hard work you might get a clue.

I never said that you were wrong to protect your legal rights. If there is some sort of copyright infringement going on, IMO, you should work quietly behind the scenes to make things right.

Really, I was so very close to buying from you a while ago, but after trying to talk to you and get some more information, you didn't help me in the least. I know your busy, but it still put a bitter taste in my mouth.

I'm still a business student, I'm not telling you how to run your business, I never questioned the quality of your products, I just think that by trash talking like this, it hurts your image more than it helps.

My minds already made up, I'm sure everyone can tell, but if someone was not biased already, which way do you think they would go?


wtf? i am home. and im pretty sure no one cares about what you have to say. it just shows that you are insecure when you need to start name calling. maybe daddy doesnt show you enough love?


LOL, calling you a troll is hardly name calling. I'm not tryin to E-thug on you dood. Whenever you post, you always have to side with the minority. You just enjoy playing devil's advocate... which is what I would call a troll.

Thanks for bringing my dad into this.. really? grow up

so the DDM projector 46's are fake depos? really

can you just straight up state the difference if any?

the place of manufacturing and quality. but you get what you pay for, so if you order cheap lights, cheap lights is what you will receive.

care to tell us what tool you used and what the readings were? i'd love to hear that one, do it in the next 5 minutes and stay off google...

Wow. You really are one of the most pathetic sponsors here. I measured this crap a while back. I don't even have the readings because I never though a sponsor would be on the forums bashing other sponsors and a consumer would have to step in and defend one or the other. next time I get the tool I'll measure the output. Do you want it in Lumens or Foot Candles sir? My mom is a lighting engineer so I'll have her bring home the tool tomorrow. Sound good?this is ridiculous...

Wow. You really are one of the most pathetic sponsors here. I measured this crap a while back. I don't even have the readings because I never though a sponsor would be on the forums bashing other sponsors and a consumer would have to step in and defend one or the other. next time I get the tool I'll measure the output. Do you want it in Lumens or Foot Candles sir? My mom is a lighting engineer so I'll have her bring home the tool tomorrow. Sound good?this is ridiculous...

i dont think you answered his questions? what are you avoiding?

habbie i undertsnd your point on other vendors using your product names...

but do you think they appreciate you telling people that you are the only seller of REAL depo products? dont be a hipocrite

Even if you were unbiased, what have you contributed to this thread? You're just pissing people off, and you're feeding on it.

if you open your eyes and look, i came in here trying to calm everyone down and thats when i started getting insulted. you can PM eurotunerwerks and ask him, he can back me up. im not here to start fights but when im being insulted for no reason, i will fight back.

I never said that you were wrong to protect your legal rights. If there is some sort of copyright infringement going on, IMO, you should work quietly behind the scenes to make things right.

Really, I was so very close to buying from you a while ago, but after trying to talk to you and get some more information, you didn't help me in the least. I know your busy, but it still put a bitter taste in my mouth.

I'm still a business student, I'm not telling you how to run your business, I never questioned the quality of your products, I just think that by trash talking like this, it hurts your image more than it helps.

My minds already made up, I'm sure everyone can tell, but if someone was not biased already, which way do you think they would go?

in general people can go and choose as they wish, its what's great about competition, people buy Kia's and people buy Ferrari's its usually based on their budget rather then quality or facts, same applies to lighting or anything else, whether you like it or not, whether you believe it or not you do get exactly what you pay for.

i dont run around like a clown convincing anyone that my prolumen hid kit is as good as xyz brand, i dont have to, thats because over the last 4 years it has proved itself to be a stud, same applies to chromium and many other original products we designed and invested tons of money and time to make them the staples they are in the BMW community and the standard by which all others are judged.

it makes me sick to my stomach that others choose to LIE, CHEAT and try to pass their copies for the real thing.
if you dont like that thats too bad but i will do it each and every time both in the open and in the backround.

habbie i undertsnd your point on other vendors using your product names...

but do you think they appreciate you telling people that you are the only seller of REAL depo products? dont be a hipocrite

obviously someone faild to fill you in on what specific products we were talking about.

so? you support your vendor and so do i. the difference is that i do it in a subtle manner while you blab your big mouths.

thats right, im a Yankee.. and who won that war? ok thanks bye

who won what? You are the only person here backing up habbie. Its like 15 against 2. So who won again?

who won what? You are the only person here backing up habbie. Its like 15 against 2. So who won again?

:rolleyes
this isn't a school yard fight, i choose to not have people get involved in these stupid fights, i dont need anyone to back me up and it will be a sad day when i relay on your likes to "defend" me.. after all you made a statement you cant even back up with any sort of proof...
i dont employ or encourage keyboard warriors im not 12 anymore..

Here are you're unbiased opinions:

i have never bought from habbie because honestly i could never afford his prices. i always thought they were completely ridiculously high, but then again im sure they are great quality products and that he has worked on and invested in. im sure he is proud of his products, and believes whole-heartedly that they are worth every penny he asks for them....to him...

i bought an M3 bumper, and fog-lights from DDM about two weeks ago, i paid promptly, and i honestly havent heard from them and havent received my products. a little later that week, i ordered their APEXCONE headlights W/HID for $100...im sorry habbie, you could never EVER beat that, and i am aware that these lights are on backorder until 4-21. thats not a problem. i AM a little aggravated that i havent received a reply to my email about my bumper, but its only been a day and i understand that it IS a business, and i understand that things take time. so im not bashing DDM right now.

I have been in MANY manufacturing plants, and i can assure most of you, as much as people tell you different name brands are made in the same factories and whatnot they are. BUT, they are often NOT built to the same standards. some are, some aren't. as far as DDM ripping off the names of the angel eyes, shame on them cry about it, get over it. habbie, do you have these products and name patented? if not, thats your mistake, and anyone and their momma are completely free to use them, and since you slipped up you have no right to cry about it.

Mpowered95, you have dont absolutely nothing constructive in this thread. you are a fucking troll simply trying to glorify yourself while digging a nice hole up habbie's ass. you are seriously acting like your on his damned payroll. stop brown-nosing please...i just read this entire thread and i almost seriously want to fly to NY and slap your head in about 5 circles...as far as the guys sticking up for DDM, i understand you're blown away with loyalty as far as the price goes...but where is this customer service you keep talking about? i want my freaking bumper.

anyways...almost everyone in this thread is kind of acting like a 7th grader, and its kinda of pathetic and sickening...and habbie, im sorry, but i think having a LIGHTING VENDOR in charge of the LIGHTING FORUM is kind of a HUGE mistake on Kevlar's part, because it pretty much gave you your own section to glorify your products. if you have it, seems like every other vendor should have their own forums to advertise and talk up their own products.


but thats just my $0.02
:dunno




*anxiously awaits pointless flaming*

all the posts containing personal attacks, insults and the other varieties of pleasantries have been moved pending admin review, i strongly suggest you guys stop the verbal jabs at each and the personal attacks as they are certain to land you in some sort of trouble you may not enjoy.
if you cant post without attacking someone DON'T POST, if you have nothing further to contribute to this thread other then jabs and insults DON'T POST.
friendly reminder to all.

See I knew that the famous "anti bavtoys post removal by habbie" would come. Although I don't agree with some of the things said by ducky328i, he is completely right. It was a huge mistake making habbie the moderator for his own forum. By removing posts against him it is not only very unethical and unprofessional but wrong and childish.

Best regards,

Neil

ahem...thats my wife in t3h avy btw...I R NOT A SHE...:shifty

ahem...thats my wife in t3h avy btw...I R NOT A SHE...:shifty

:lol





This thread is going to get locked so hard. The OP had no idea what he was getting into by not searching enough. Lol

this is making me sick. Habbie has already deleted half of the posts. Kevlar should do something about this. Oh well...

See I knew that the famous "anti bavtoys post removal by habbie" would come. Although I don't agree with some of the things said by ducky328i, he is completely right. It was a huge mistake making habbie the moderator for his own forum. By removing posts against him it is not only very unethical and unprofessional but wrong and childish.

Best regards,

Neil
he has locked/deleted a lot of shit that is not in favor of him, specifically a thread of mine containing comments in the vendor comments section:shifty:lol

this forum is pathetic. The moderators have every right to say whatever they want then delete posts against them and then finally report our posts to the admin even though we did no more than the moderator themselves.

See I knew that the famous "anti bavtoys post removal by habbie" would come. Although I don't agree with some of the things said by ducky328i, she is completely right. It was a huge mistake making habbie the moderator for his own forum. By removing posts against him it is not only very unethical and unprofessional but wrong and childish.

Best regards,

Neil

personal attacks and insults are of no value to this or any other thread, this is not your or anyone's private playground to attack, flame and generally act a fool.
although im sure would have loved it nothing has been deleted, it has moved so the admins can take a look and decide what if any actions are needed.

if you feel like bashing go hang out in OT, you are not in the right place.
we encourage intelligent and cohesive discussion, childish tantrums and outbursts are not.

this is making me sick. Habbie has already deleted half of the posts. Kevlar should do something about this. Oh well...

you can bank on that.

obviously someone faild to fill you in on what specific products we were talking about.

can you answer my question?
be honest

btw habbie, why does you sig say bbs?

personal attacks and insults are of no value to this or any other thread, this is not your or anyone's private playground to attack, flame and generally act a fool.
although im sure would have loved it nothing has been deleted, it has moved so the admins can take a look and decide what if any actions are needed.

if you feel like bashing go hang out in OT, you are not in the right place.
we encourage intelligent and cohesive discussion, childish tantrums and outbursts are not.

I voted for it to be moved to OT in one of my posts. AND I also asked GR7 to post pics once they were installed. It's just forum arguing. It's all over any forum. DDM and habbie both have good products. But the name wasn't registered and copyrighted, was it? It's free to use.

Habbie, YOU SUPPORTED YOURSELF, WE SUPPORTED DDM. That doesnt mean you have the right to delete the posts made against you. Or delete posts made by us against your fanboy "Mpowered95". It is outright wrong that you delete posts that are against you. Or to cover up what you've said. That is wrong and you should be responsible for your actions. Something has to be done

to the op:
my experiences on both ddm and habbie. I bought an m3 bumper from habbie about 6 months ago i was happy with the quality but the service was not up to my standard. i placed an order for overnight shipping. the next day i contact the post office and they told me (in a written invoice) the error was on the shippers side. i was upset and asked habbie to resolve it and i got "dont know what happened" got the bumper 1 week later granted still being charged for overnight shipping ,put it on and forgot about the ordeal. (bumper cracked 2 months later)

A buddy of mine ordered the same style m3 bumper from ddm, The quality was the same and looked identical to my previous bumper. AT the time of my order HAbbie did provide great prices on the market. I have also seen in PERSON depo 4 from both vendors with angels eyes and have noticed almost zero difference.
Habbie offered great products and great prices at one time but with the introduction of a new vendor and new prices i have personally found the same quality (if not the same product) and cheaper prices.

Habbie, YOU SUPPORTED YOURSELF, WE SUPPORTED DDM. That doesnt mean you have the right to delete the posts made against you. Or delete posts made by us against your fanboy "Mpowered95". It is outright wrong that you delete posts that are against you. Or to cover up what you've said. That is wrong and you should be responsible for your actions. Something has to be done

while you wait go read the forum rules, you really need to along with some others.
SUPPORTING does not mean attacking or bashing others, if its the only way you know how to express yourself do it elsewhere.
posts "against" anyone that are of personal nature have no place here, this is not an e-boxing ring or a e-battle field, you will comply with the forum rules and be respectful towards others.

since this escapes you or you seem to not grasp the concept, nothing has been deleted, its all there pending review, the admins will decide how to proceed with the posts that were moved and will take the necessary actions.
if you did nothing wrong your posts will be put back, if you did you i suspect you will hear from one of them.

so for saying "dumb Yankee", I'm going to be banned? What the heck? I have the freedom of speech. I should be able to post things like that without having to worry about people like you trying to glorify yourselves, getting in the way.

I see that Mpowered95 went back and edited his posts that had previously contained negative comments. Was that before or after you decided to remove all the posts made by DDM supporters? I can't change how this forum is run but I can definitely do other things :hehe:

I see that Mpowered95 went back and edited his posts that had previously contained negative comments. Was that before or after you decided to remove all the posts made by DDM supporters? I can't change how this forum is run but I can definitely do other things :hehe:
whatever you or anyone else edited will also be looked at im sure, dont worry about that.
so for saying "dumb Yankee", I'm going to be banned? What the heck? I have the freedom of speech. I should be able to post things like that without having to worry about people like you trying to glorify yourselves, getting in the way.

that is not is not my decision to make only the admins can.

in case you missed it this forum is privatly owned and we have no rights here, we are all GIVEN the privilage of using it by the owners at their pleasure and by their rules only.

if you dont like what i or anyone else posts DONT READ IT, if you dont like this sub forum then MOVE ON, stiring trouble and breaking the rules are the wrong way to go about it.

Habbie, you know whats breaking the rules? When a sponsor is a moderator on his own forum. That's messed up. That's a conflict of interests. Now I know why people say you are shady... You just "delete" whatever is in your way or if its against you or bavtoys.

Wow! It seems as though everytime I see a thread regarding lights or angel eyes, the DDM feud begins. So here I am throwing in my unbiased view on the whole matter and hope that everyone can understand the simplicity of the situation.

First things first, welcome to North America where capitalism and competitive markets exist. It seems as though Umnitza and Bavtoys are taking a big hit due to DDM's pricing. What do they do? They start bashing and taking the product's quality into consideration in order to deter fellow consumers from purchasing DDM products. It seems like a game of dirty politics, which, in the long run, hurts Umnitza and Bavtoys. It's a complete act of unprofessionalism and I honestly don't think it should be tolerated.

As far as DDM using these industry names such as predator chromium, orion, etc. It doesn't seem as though these names have been patented (I'm not even sure if these names can be pantented) so nothing can really be done on the matter.

Lastly, I have been shopping around for projectors and angel eyes for a few months now. I have seen prices ranging from $450-$1000. I personally cannot bring myself to spending $450 just on headlights and then adding the respective goodies (angel eyes, HID's, 55w upgrade, etc.), with further impending costs. Then I heard about DDM and finally decided to order the kit which they offer. I'll admit, I was a bit skeptical (It's in my nature) and did not know what to expect. I mean the deals really seem too good to be true. Well, I cannot tell you how impressed I am with the quality and look of this product. I have friends with setups from BAVTOYS and UMNITZA and side by side, they look the same and in some cases, the DDM's look better!

I've included a few pictures of my lighting setup. I would recommend DDM for the following reasons:
- absolutely amazing prices
- great customer service
- great products
- fast shipping (I live in Toronto and got my order in 2 days from when it left DDM)

My setup is as follows: DEPO Gen IV's, Predator Chromium AE's, 8k HID's w/ 55w upgrade.

http://photos-629.ll.facebook.com/photos-ll-sf2p/v235/8/86/48905629/n48905629_40353661_3041.jpg

http://photos-629.ll.facebook.com/photos-ll-sf2p/v235/8/86/48905629/n48905629_40353662_3368.jpg

http://photos-629.ll.facebook.com/photos-ll-sf2p/v235/8/86/48905629/n48905629_40353663_3705.jpg

http://photos-629.ll.facebook.com/photos-ll-sf2p/v235/8/86/48905629/n48905629_40353664_4035.jpg

http://photos-629.ll.facebook.com/photos-ll-sf2p/v235/8/86/48905629/n48905629_40353668_5418.jpg

A truly awesome post by IL CAPO. Unbiased and realistic. Now take a picture of it before habbie deletes it...

....

Thank you for attempting to help the OP like I originally did on the first page!

I am a little frustrated that we couldn't help out this poor guy out who is trying to wade through all the choices we have out there as Bf.c members..

I - like him- was faced with all these decisions a couple months ago. I decided I would order from BOTH DDM and Bavtoys @ the same time. And you know what?? I was pleased with both of them!!

habbie does come off as a little bit of an ass when you first go to him for help. But then I realized how frustrating it must be to get the same questions day in and day out and all the resources I already needed were posted on the internet. But he still was really helpful he just isn't overly friendly. I would buy from him again in a heartbeat!

All that being said, I think it is time for bf.c to rethink how they manage the lighting section. Unnecessary threads like this are taking away from the usefulness of this forum. Since the purpose of bf.com should be to keep the best interest of the forums members in mind, I would see it wise for vendors to not be forum moderators. Just as a regular user cannot host a group buy or manipulate threads, vendors should be limited to the vendor areas. Also it allows for the potential of one vendor to have an unfair advantage over another. Regardless of the accusations against said vendor aside, I would not be very happy as a vendor if another could POTENTIALLY delete or manipulate threads comparing products

Again this is post is nothing against anyone in particular and is not accusing anyone of anything, I think bf.com should do the right thing here in the best interest of their members.

Thank you for attempting to help the OP like I originally did on the first page!

I am a little frustrated that we couldn't help out this poor guy out who is trying to wade through all the choices we have out there as Bf.c members..

I - like him- was faced with all these decisions a couple months ago. I decided I would order from BOTH DDM and Bavtoys @ the same time. And you know what?? I was pleased with both of them!!

habbie does come off as a little bit of an ass when you first go to him for help. But then I realized how frustrating it must be to get the same questions day in and day out and all the resources I already needed were posted on the internet. But he still was really helpful he just isn't overly friendly. I would buy from him again in a heartbeat!

All that being said, I think it is time for bf.c to rethink how they manage the lighting section. Unnecessary threads like this are taking away from the usefulness of this forum. Since the purpose of bf.com should be to keep the best interest of the forums members in mind, I would see it wise for vendors to not be forum moderators. Just as a regular user cannot host a group buy or manipulate threads, vendors should be limited to the vendor areas. Also it allows for the potential of one vendor to have an unfair advantage over another. Regardless if the accusations against said vendor aside, I would not be very happy as a vendor if another could POTENTIALLY delete or manipulate threads comparing products

Again this is post is nothing against anyone in particular and is not accusing anyone of anything, I think bf.com should do the right thing here in the best interest of their members.

couldnt be more true

[/b]

couldnt be more true

It really is not an issue of one vendor is better then another in my mind. Cuz I really like both Habbie (bavtoys) and DDM, I just think bf.c has tried to make this vendor and moderator thing work but it isn't...

Wow! It seems as though everytime I see a thread regarding lights or angel eyes, the DDM feud begins. So here I am throwing in my unbiased view on the whole matter and hope that everyone can understand the simplicity of the situation.

First things first, welcome to North America where capitalism and competitive markets exist. It seems as though Umnitza and Bavtoys are taking a big hit due to DDM's pricing. What do they do? They start bashing and taking the product's quality into consideration in order to deter fellow consumers from purchasing DDM products. It seems like a game of dirty politics, which, in the long run, hurts Umnitza and Bavtoys. It's a complete act of unprofessionalism and I honestly don't think it should be tolerated.

As far as DDM using these industry names such as predator chromium, orion, etc. It doesn't seem as though these names have been patented (I'm not even sure if these names can be pantented) so nothing can really be done on the matter.

Lastly, I have been shopping around for projectors and angel eyes for a few months now. I have seen prices ranging from $450-$1000. I personally cannot bring myself to spending $450 just on headlights and then adding the respective goodies (angel eyes, HID's, 55w upgrade, etc.), with further impending costs. Then I heard about DDM and finally decided to order the kit which they offer. I'll admit, I was a bit skeptical (It's in my nature) and did not know what to expect. I mean the deals really seem too good to be true. Well, I cannot tell you how impressed I am with the quality and look of this product. I have friends with setups from BAVTOYS and UMNITZA and side by side, they look the same and in some cases, the DDM's look better!

I've included a few pictures of my lighting setup. I would recommend DDM for the following reasons:
- absolutely amazing prices
- great customer service
- great products
- fast shipping (I live in Toronto and got my order in 2 days from when it left DDM)

My setup is as follows: DEPO Gen IV's, Predator Chromium AE's, 8k HID's w/ 55w upgrade.

http://photos-629.ll.facebook.com/photos-ll-sf2p/v235/8/86/48905629/n48905629_40353661_3041.jpg

http://photos-629.ll.facebook.com/photos-ll-sf2p/v235/8/86/48905629/n48905629_40353662_3368.jpg

http://photos-629.ll.facebook.com/photos-ll-sf2p/v235/8/86/48905629/n48905629_40353663_3705.jpg

http://photos-629.ll.facebook.com/photos-ll-sf2p/v235/8/86/48905629/n48905629_40353664_4035.jpg

http://photos-629.ll.facebook.com/photos-ll-sf2p/v235/8/86/48905629/n48905629_40353668_5418.jpg


Your car looks great!! :buttrock Good choice on your lighting setup through DDM.

I believe the predator name isn't patented (i don't believe you patent a name...) but rather trademarked. at least it appears so on the umnitza website. and yes, you can trademark a name, as long as it's not a common name. For example - if you were to open up a fabric store and call it "CHEAP FABRICS" that won't fly. However, if you look at major brands, you'll see that they come up with less common names. Yahoo, Google, Microsoft, Oracle to name a few. Before the word google came along, people would probably look at you weird if you said it out loud. I'm sure the name "google" is now trademarked and cannot be used without consent by Google themselves.

I'm not sure if I'm allowed to link a thread in the group buy forum, but it basically shows benchmark tests (same camera, same lighting, products side by side) of the the angel eyes being discussed in this thread. Of course, take it with a grain of salt as it's posted by a supporting vendor who carries a certain product.

Mods - let me know if the link needs to be removed and I can edit it. Or I'm sure someone will edit it for me anyways.

http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=971367

I think pictures like those (biased or not) give a good sense of exactly what you're getting.

Ninja edit: forgot about this post too over at e46fanatics.

http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=551664

That thread also presents an "unbiased" look at the two.

It's okay, Umnitza's customer service still blows. I've dealt with both companies, and DDM far surpasses Umnitza's service. I felt like I paid a premium to be treated like an unworthy customer with Umnitza, and it's been evident with EVERY encounter I've had with them. I honestly hope your company quickly fades away in today's market because customers deserve to be treated right, premium price or not, "genuine" products or not.

That's enough folks. This thread has gotten totally counterproductive and has become a cat fight.

If a business has trademarked certain words/names, they must protect themselves from it becoming part of the daily vocabulary. This is the case with "kleenex" and several other names. Thus, if Habbie and Umnitza does not protect the usage of "Predator", "Chromium", "Orion"... the name loses its significance. Don't forget that DDM also has their own line called "Demon Eyes". I'm sure if someone portrayed their product as "Demon Eyes", DDM would take action. After all, it is a prudent business practice. Even if both products are made side by side at the same factory at the same time, the other is not permitted to use the trademarked name as it not their property.

Similar situations that we encounter everyday are fake designer goods. You see fake Louis Vuitton, Chanel, Gucci, Prada....goods all the time. LVMH and other companies spend million$ on enforcement of their trademarked names.