searched and found out that it seems like there is different kinds of e12 MC i picked one up and it only has two hard lines outputs. is this the wrong one? if so which one do i need

bump....anyone?

All e12s have 4 piston calipers, meaning all e12s must have 4 outputs. Are you sure thats what its from? In either case, if the bore is right and you don't need the extra lines, it should be fine.

hmmm well i pulled it out of an e12 but it only has two hardline inputs. is there a possiblity that i grabbed one out of a car with ABS?

here are some pics i am talking about

this is the e21 master cylinder
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a222/deejnegro/P4040083.jpg

and the e12 master cylinder
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a222/deejnegro/e12mastercylinderclose.jpg
and the missing hardline imputs
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a222/deejnegro/mastercylinder.jpg

hi

No e12 has ABS. Are you sure you know the difference in a e12 and e28? Definitely looks like an e28 ABS cylinder to me.

my knowlenge of bmw is very limited outside the 3 series so maybe i grabbed one off the wrong car i could have sworn the car i pulled it off of was a 528e which is what i thought was an e12. well if thats the case then i found the problem and now can fix it

528e is a e28. Thats an invalid way to tell the difference anyway since several model names are shared by different body styles. E12's are much more rare. Easiest check: if it doesn't have 4 piston front calipers, it's not an e12. The MC bore should be the same anyway, if you just want to add T's and use it.

ya i may do that so i can use the bigger bore of the e28 MC

and while were on the subject was it not you layne that was talking about fabricating up some brackets to mount e30 rear calipers on the existing rear trailing arms of the e21

I don't believe in 1 piston calipers (ie; e30) but I am going to make some brackets to put Wilwood 2 piston calipers onto the regular trailing arms. A few others on here are working on some custom setups too I think.

which 2 piston calipers are you making fit and would they be able to run with stock rotors and tap into the e brake cable?

i only ask all these questions because i am interested

Wilwood billet dynalites.
I guess you mean 323i stock rotors? I don't know but probably. They are 13x255mm if I recall? Don't they have drum e-brakes inside?
The wilwood calipers have no e-brake provision.

oh i think your talking about the front calipers and i am asking about the rear or are you talking about the rear?

i am trying to find a way to put rear disc brakes on without spending 700 and i know it can be done. someone just needs to build a bracket to fit some calipers onto the trainging arms that will work with the e30 rear calipers and maybe discs. probly the cheapest route i think

on a 323i the parking brake is completely seperate, they use the inside of the rotor "hat" as a drum.

Here's what it looks like once you pull the rotor (and drive flange nut) off:

http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd241/Jester323i/rear%20subframe/2008-03-24/2008-03-29%20nuts%20loose/0909bdf3.jpg


Then using a gear puller to remove the drive flange, you can see the drive flange on the floor next to the rotor in the first pic:

http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd241/Jester323i/rear%20subframe/2008-03-24/2008-03-29%20nuts%20loose/9e337a65.jpg

http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd241/Jester323i/rear%20subframe/2008-03-24/2008-03-29%20nuts%20loose/f440a787.jpg


Here you can see the parking brake assembly removed, just the backing plate still installed, the parking brake cable bracket is located on the backing plate just below the drive shaft:

http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd241/Jester323i/rear%20subframe/2008-03-24/2008-03-29%20nuts%20loose/c1e10820.jpg


Here is the backing plate removed and the parking brake cable laying down to the left:

http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd241/Jester323i/rear%20subframe/2008-03-24/2008-03-29%20nuts%20loose/37b1ac24.jpg



Let me know if you need any measurements. I know that the drive shaft and drive flange are a different part number than those for the 320i. It may be that the offset is different so it may not be as simple as bolting on a 323i rotor to the 320i drive flange.

Thats exactly what I thought. Thats also the same setup an e30 has, so unless you make some separate parking brakes you won't have any by putting on e30 calipers. I think the simplest setup is to use calipers with integral parking brakes like MM does.
So Boomer, unless you make the brackets with your own hands there is no way to have rear disks for under $700.

Also keep in mind that rear disks for the streets are not needed. Don’t think that putting these disks on is going to be a night and day change, you may not even notice this on the streets. The drums do quite a good job for what they are. The bang for the buck factor on a street driven E21 is not worth it IMO. You could do some serious suspension work and engine upgrades for that price that will yield much better results. That’s just my opinion on the matter.

Your better off spending the $250 or so bucks to do the front Girlings. And if you want, just use the stock E21 MC and T the lines at the caliper, they work great for me and for the other guys here who auto-x their cars.

I wish I had a US spec 320i rear trailing arm assembly laying around. Looking at all of the pics that I have & looking at ETK diagrams, this actually doesn't look too difficult once you break it all the way down like I have. I have a bunch of 323i rear brake parts laying around at the moment & would be happy to line everything up & see what it would take. At very least, if you wanted to use a 323i set up, you would need:

a 323i backing plate, parking cable bracket, and hinges (can't find pics of these ATM)

parking brake hardware kit,
http://www.wallothnesch.com/d/po/018.jpg


parking brake shoes,
http://www.wallothnesch.com/d/photogallerie/a54.jpg


rear brake pads,
http://www.wallothnesch.com/d/photogallerie/a52.jpg


rear brake pad mounting kit,
http://www.wallothnesch.com/d/pm/m5.jpg


rear brake pad wear indicator,
http://www.wallothnesch.com/d/photogallerie/a84.jpg


rotors,
http://www.wallothnesch.com/d/Pbolts/34211119582.JPG


calipers,
http://www.wallothnesch.com/d/ps/s22.JPG


caliper hose lines,
http://www.wallothnesch.com/d/pz/34321120013.JPG


or new stainless set of hoses for 323i,
http://www.wallothnesch.com/d/ph/h15.jpg

and a custom caliper mounting bracket, and possibly wheel spacers. All of this stuff ads up to be a pretty spendy kit if you buy all of the parts new. I'll add that up in a while, gotta run right now. But I know there is a lot of interest in doing this, regardless of the need as CJ illuded to (not that I disagree), and I would be interested in figuring out some of the details and deigning a caliper bracket if someone wanted to send me a 320i rear trailing arm...

i think i am better off trying to find some measurements to build my own bracket i know a guy who has a cnc machine and could possibly stick some calipers on there that have the parking brake integrated in it but for now i think CJ is right i am better off saving my money for now and stickin with finishing my front brakes as they will provide enough stopping power to hopefully offset the rear fading when i go up into the hills

btw way thank you for the pictures they cleared up alot

Boomer, you aren't going to get the rear to fade, and of course if you did better fronts can't make up for it, that would just throw off the balance and send you into the trees. The regular rear brakes, and even the regular front brakes if you get the vented ones are good enough for any public road you will ever encounter, of course that didn't stop me from going all out and spending untold hundreds on the brakes, and it won't stop many others either.
Jester, I have a spare trailing arm I need to measure anyway to make my brackets so we can compare notes when I do that. At a glance though, it appears that the top two holes are the same but the bottom two are closer together on the 323i. The side two of course don't exist at all on a 320i. I might want to integrate some 323 parts for my shoe parking brake. I was just going to make my own backing plates and use e23 shoes (all the shoes may in fact be the same, though). It appears that the 323 e-brake cables go parallel to the C/V axles? Maybe I need those cables, the 320 ones are sort of the wrong way and thats one problem I have to solve.

I like this setup from massive brakes. I think this is an E30 arm that this used on a 2002.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v668/Lee_Vuong/The%20Parts%20Factory/ebrake_1.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v668/Lee_Vuong/The%20Parts%20Factory/P1010319.jpg

I'm all for shameless showboating, but the massive brakes setup is just stupidly large, 320mm if I recall. It's a waste of unsprung weight, but then again if they have aluminum rotor hats it may weigh less than the 280mm e23 rotors I opted to use. They are so heavy I sort of regret not going with aluminum hats. Can always change it later though.

Jeff JDB lightend his up by going with a Dynalite and thinner rotor.

http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=627277&highlight=JDB

so let me ask a dumb question. if i find a 323 could i pull the rear arms and brakes off then bolt them directly on my 320?

so let me ask a dumb question. if i find a 323 could i pull the rear arms and brakes off then bolt them directly on my 320?

Yes but you will need a proportional valve. Read jcrook's write up in the FAQ Thread.

Boomer, you aren't going to get the rear to fade, and of course if you did better fronts can't make up for it, that would just throw off the balance and send you into the trees. The regular rear brakes, and even the regular front brakes if you get the vented ones are good enough for any public road you will ever encounter, of course that didn't stop me from going all out and spending untold hundreds on the brakes, and it won't stop many others either.
Jester, I have a spare trailing arm I need to measure anyway to make my brackets so we can compare notes when I do that. At a glance though, it appears that the top two holes are the same but the bottom two are closer together on the 323i. The side two of course don't exist at all on a 320i. I might want to integrate some 323 parts for my shoe parking brake. I was just going to make my own backing plates and use e23 shoes (all the shoes may in fact be the same, though). It appears that the 323 e-brake cables go parallel to the C/V axles? Maybe I need those cables, the 320 ones are sort of the wrong way and thats one problem I have to solve.

hmm i was sure i was able to get them to fade when i would do heavy hill racing i could feel it. oh and i plan on autocrossing my car so brakes will have a purpose. but if i could find a bracket to mount an mm rear caliper with the e brake built in i would do that so i could fun some rear discs. also its for looks. it looks a little wierd when youve got fron red calipers and rusty drums in the back hah