Hello all

I've been lurking around the boards for a few years, (thanks for the wealth of info) have posted a few replies but never felt the need to post up a new thread, until now.

The following is a new thread I posted up on M3forum.com, a new thread (the original thread that prompted this response is locked) responding to a 17-year old "e46fanatic09" questions on getting out of speeding tickets.

I will post this up across some other sub-forums as it is a response think is worth repeating, I will post a logical order of the threads at the end of this post.

My response to "e46fantaic09" over at M3forum.com:

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I read your last post and the responses that came with it, your post and attitude left me with a very sick feeling. I have read a very similar post before, not so very long ago, the thread was on 25-26 January of this year

I will give you the short story and were to finds the threads that pertain to this incident

25 January, on “m5board.com” and 18 year old “AmericanM5” posted a thread asking questions about why his cars bangs when he shifts at speed, later in the thread he states that he is up-shifting at 140mph, after that he got (rightfully) raked across the coals

The thread:

m5board.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=111454 (http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=111454)

In his second to last post he writes;

I do sometimes make bad decisions but I am young and I do drive safe and I will not endanger the lives of others..and I hope you are not under the impression that I am the one to brag

Care to guess what happened next?

The first clues are at the end of the thread

This 18 year old, Josh, the fellow that says “I do drive safe and I will not endanger the lives of others, Driving his Daddy’s 500hp M5 launched his car off the end of a private runway at 3:30am, and (literally) shattered it against a Live Oak tree following a party. Maybe he was “rolling” too?

The result is Josh and 4 of his friends are dead, all killed instantly

Your statement, so eerie to Josh’s;

“Contrary to what I know your all thinking, I would never drive in a situation where im not in control”

So says (said) Josh

“I do drive safe and I will not endanger the lives of others”

A follow up thread on the crash:

.m5board.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=111545&highlight=ocala (http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=111545&highlight=ocala)

.. complete with pictures, personally, the only way I can even tell that this pile of scrap is an automobile is by the wheels/tires in the picture

Other people more knowledgeable than me can identify bits of the wreckage as belonging to an M5, I cannot

If that is what the cars look like I will only imagine what happened to their bodies. I retired from the military after 20 years, the polite term for bodies in this condition is

“Remains non-viewable”

If you cannot figure its meaning, simply stated, the condition of the bodies is destroyed beyond any reasonable means for a mortician to put it back together,

closed-coffin funeral

I am an adult, 46 years old, I was 16 once upon a time and certainly had steel balls such as yourself , but when I was that age I drove a 3-speed flatbed Ford pickup. Not that my parents had the means, but they certainly had better sense than to put me in a car like an M3, (something comparable for the era would have been a hemi Chrysler)

I simply cannot understand over-indulgent parents that would deliberately hazard a 16-year old kid by allowing them to drive an M3, or any high-power car for that matter.

My dear young Mr. e46fanatic09, I know this thread will be lost on you and your (typical) 16-year old thick skull

“this is not me” you will say. You are right, it isn’t, but it very easily could become you. I am sure had you asked Josh, the “americanM5” M5 pilot the same question before the 26th of January this year he would have said the same thing, in fact not three hours before he was killed he did state that very thing.

Smarten-up buddy, nobody here wants to read the next tragic thread about a youngster killing himself and others while driving a BMW, we all love our BMW’s and it hits us a little harder when we hear about these things



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Thread order:



e46fanatic09's original thread;

http://www.m3forum.net/m3forum/showthread.php?t=199880

Josh's (americanM5) original thread;

http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=111454

Follow-up thread following the crash;

http://webmail.aol.com/34865/aol/en-us/Suite.aspx

My response to e46fanatic09;

http://www.m3forum.net/m3forum/showthread.php?p=2816008#post2816008

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Peace

Jim

Why did you post this in 6 sections of the forum? :confused

.. because I notice that most people have their favorite forums (I usually read 2), wanted to give it some wide dispersement, A problem?

Problem is mods will remove all threads but one and then probably put you in timeout because you posted across the entire forum and wasted bandwidth for them to cleanup.

thx, sorry to the mods and all others, nothing I can do about it now, sorry to all for wasting space

:embarrasmGoing to write the moderators, hat-in-hand:embarrasm

Appreciate the heads up

I'm sure you'll be fine. Just PM them and explain it, they'll let you pass ..

18 year old going 140mph in a m5...i've hit a 125 in my gti, and it was on the jersey turnpike when it was dead. I've done that once, and I probably will never do that again. My avg speed on a highway is 70. That was just a purely dumbass young kid with daddy's car.

Oh well

18 year old going 140mph in a m5...i've hit a 125 in my gti, and it was on the jersey turnpike when it was dead. I've done that once, and I probably will never do that again. My avg speed on a highway is 70. That was just a purely dumbass young kid with daddy's car.

Oh well

I'm slightly ashamed to say that I've hit 130 in rush hour traffic, and I won't be doing that again!

I'm 19, I have an M3. Just because were young doesn't mean we are stupid. I can drive, I save it for the track. If parents are going to buy kids hight performance cars they should give them a safe place to drive them fast. I have never gone over 110 on the road with my car. I think age is irrelavant in the situation, maturity is the question.

I'm 19, I have an M3. Just because were young doesn't mean we are stupid. I can drive, I save it for the track. If parents are going to buy kids hight performance cars they should give them a safe place to drive them fast. I have never gone over 110 on the road with my car. I think age is irrelavant in the situation, maturity is the question.

Did your parents buy you your M3?

sad stuff...

Did your parents buy your your M3?

most likely...there are some kids though that work their asses off for the car they want.

I'm almost 20, but i've had a 325is, a e46 323Ci, than I got my GTI, i worked for all of them!

I'm done with my GTI in a few months and in June i'll be buying a e46 M3...an older one obviously though. If I work for it and i'm still living with my parents and I dont really have that many expenses other than my car/insurance/phone/internet, i can afford the M3 without a problem! :buttrock

Did your parents buy your your M3?

yes

most likely...there are some kids though that work their asses off for the car they want.

I'm almost 20, but i've had a 325is, a e46 323Ci, than I got my GTI, i worked for all of them!

I'm done with my GTI in a few months and in June i'll be buying a e46 M3...an older one obviously though. If I work for it and i'm still living with my parents and I dont really have that many expenses other than my car/insurance/phone/internet, i can afford the M3 without a problem! :buttrock

I can afford my M3 without a problem, but were I to move out and live on my own in this area, considering the amount of money I spend on it in addition to the car note, insurance, and gas, I would have to really live frugally. And I don't like doing that.

yes

That's insane. How much was it, $45k? I can't imagine buying my son a car that expensive... Well, I don't even know if I can imagine having a son, period. I'm too self-centered. :buttrock

I can afford my M3 without a problem, but were I to move out and live on my own in this area, considering the amount of money I spend on it in addition to the car note, insurance, and gas, I would have to really live frugally. And I don't like doing that.



That's insane. How much was it, $45k? I can't imagine buying my son a car that expensive... Well, I don't even know if I can imagine having a son, period. I'm too self-centered. :buttrock

We got a good deal. I was going to get an 01' but my dad really wanted to get me one with warranty. The only reason I have that car is becuase we go to the track together. If it wasn't for us doing de's together and me going to all of his races with them it would have never been an option. I feel like a spoiled bitch at times but I'm not a cocky prick so I think most people are fine with it. I try and stay grateful and modest.

We got a good deal. I was going to get an 01' but my dad really wanted to get me one with warranty. The only reason I have that car is becuase we go to the track together. If it wasn't for us doing de's together and me going to all of his races with them it would have never been an option. I feel like a spoiled bitch at times but I'm not a cocky prick so I think most people are fine with it. I try and stay grateful and modest.

Is it really your car, or is it his that you're allowed to drive?

Is it really your car, or is it his that you're allowed to drive?

The title is in his name but I'm in college and its here with me. He calls it mine.

The title is in his name but I'm in college and its here with me. He calls it mine.

Ah... I personally wouldn't want such a nice car at college... students are ruthless when it comes to ingress and egress of cars--not to mention the obligatory barfing and sitting on cars. :mad :rolleyes

I'm 18, but I bought my car myself and it was not nearly as much as yours probably was. I like the feeling of having bought it myself, but I can definitely understand that you wouldn't turn down a car your parents offered you.

The title is in his name but I'm in college and its here with me. He calls it mine.

Which is smart for insurance purposes etc.

Im 18 and have a 02 M3 and i've had it since my senior year in high school, My parents didn't buy it for me but I did fall into some money from a drunk driver hitting me years ago, I consider myself a good driver, but I do tend to push my cars limits, Ran from a cop, and have done 155+ on the local high way at night, but I read the story and it has slowed me down a bit when other people are with me. But what I wanted to say was I was at the dealer the other day and the salesman told me he sold matching M3's to a father and son about a year ago, and i just thought that was crazyyy..

I'm 19, I have an M3. Just because were young doesn't mean we are stupid. I can drive, I save it for the track. If parents are going to buy kids hight they should give them a safe place to drive them fast. I have never gone over 110 on the road with my car. I think age is irrelavant in the situation, maturity is the question

(sorry, have not figured out the "quote box thing yet)

Absolutely agree with you here, never intended as a slam on young drivers, response (partial) I posted in reply to a similar response on m3forums.com:

For EM THREE's comments;

I understand that too often the things that come down the pike are/appear to be slams on younger drivers. I am not some crusty old fart crabbing about those "crazy teen drivers" killing themselves again. Trust me; they are most definitely the exception and not the rule.

How many people in their 'teens are on the road today? Any nationally significant teen-tragic-car-crash-deaths today? There are 18-19 year old drivers that can out-skill any of us on their worst day.

I don't have the time to note the ages on the drivers in NASCAR's "big Three", but, The #2 driver in the NASCAR Sprint series is Kyle Busch, just turned 23-years old. He did not jump in his race car yesterday

From an article on raising the min age in NASCAR from 18 to 21;

There's some (italics mine) arrogance in 18-, 19-, 20-year-old kids out there," Wallace said. "Yeah, they're fast. [But] this is a professional series, the Sprint Cup Series is the elite of the elite and you should represent yourself that way. … What's the difference? You're 21 years old and you get a chance to go run a Sprint Cup car, what could be better than that?"

18-20 yoa driving in the premier Motor Sport series in America. They possess incredibility rare driving skills. But if they choose to drive 100mph on a 50mph surface street they are left to the whims of chance like the rest of us

Judgment and critical thinking come with time and maturity. Kyle Busch has this judgment, e46fanatic09 does not.

My post was in no way intended to be a broad-stroke blast at "crazy teen drivers". More of a tap on the shoulder, directed at one person. I wrote out this post because I couldn't let it slide by.

Maybe if someone had written Josh a similar....?

Would he have or will e46fanatic09, toss their arms to the heavens in a blissful epiphany and declare "yes!! YES!!! Jim is right!!! I see the error of my ways!! How could it have been so obvious!?! How could Have I been so stupid and blind!?!"

Doubtful, highly doubtful.

To put it another way.

Would you walk by someone spinning a revolver and playing Russian Roulette, thinking; "meh, he'll kill himself, not my problem"

..or

at least say, "ahh, buddy, I don't think that's a very good idea, you're going to kill yourself if you keep it up" especially if they weren't aware of the danger involved in this "game"?

I chose the latter.

to all:

Much appreciate the discussions, I posted this across numerous threads and have been trying to keep up with it all day

My original post was a very directed and pointed message to one individual and one individual only, and it remains so, I want e46fantaic09 to read what I wrote to him

The side benefit, in a much broader sense, is at a minimum it is generating;

.. "I am 18, but..."
.. "I am 19 and..."
.. "at 16 years old, I did..."
.. "when I was.. I did this...."

Thanks to all the folks who's age starts with "1", and(or) a low 2, if I can catch the attention of a youngster, enough to read my posts, and display enough interest to post any response, then this is good enough for me

I thank you all very sincerely for your attention and interest.

I cross-posted this original thread and thanks to the moderators all but one thread is still going

Also, maybe worth a look, is my original post, the one that kicked this thing off, Nobody has heard from e46fanatic09 at the m3board, hopefully he has read it, considered "caution the better part of valor" and chose to keep his yapper shut:

http://www.m3forum.net/m3forum/showthread.php?t=200035

this thread is gold

Why did you post this in 6 sections of the forum? :confused


because it is that important.

all of the after-bickering following the OP is circling the point. too much power and too little experience...probably exacerbated by recreation.

to each young individual( hey i'm young too) who says they can drive, statistically you probably cant. none of us are really that responsible. it just does not happen.....