I searched all over and I can't find anything...I am looking to find out what each wire is such as 12v+, ignition wire, etc... In the pics below are the wires coming from the switch I am referring to. Thanks!


1st row - Green, Green, Black (Yellow Stripe)
2nd Row - Red, Red, Red
3rd Row - Green, Purple, Green

can you tell me the year? I got tons of stuff on AllData, but I need the year...

can you tell me the year? I got tons of stuff on AllData, but I need the year...

Sorry 96.

If only my stupid laptop didn't fall. :mad

Did you take those pictures there Cash?

I'm remembering that you had made a promise to post "other" pictures.

haha, no I got them from a post on bimmberboard....I still didnt get any batteries for my camera yet.

Oh those pictures...lol, not yet.

haha, no I got them from a post on bimmberboard....I still didnt get any batteries for my camera yet.

http://www.beatcanvas.com/gallery/pics/stop_making_excuses.jpg

hahahahaha

I searched all over and I can't find anything...I am looking to find out what each wire is such as 12v+, ignition wire, etc... In the pics below are the wires coming from the switch I am referring to. Thanks!


1st row - Green, Green, Black (Yellow Stripe)
2nd Row - Red, Red, Red
3rd Row - Green, Purple, Green

The red wires are all direct battery power.
The green wires are ignition power, position 2
The purple wire is accessory power, position 1
The black/yellow wire is for starting. On older cars this wire went directly to the starter, on yours it goes the engine control module.

Is this enough? If you need more, be more specific.:cool

Thank you sir!

Ok, this is what I'm doing....all aftermath of my key cylinder mishap over the weekend.

I am making a push button start.

I need to figure out what wires will go to that. I know I need the 12v+ and I need the ignition starter wire...which you said goes to the engine control module...so would I be able to splice in to that to get the signal when I push the button or no? I have read a lot of write ups about people installing the Z8 push button in their M3 and M5's but I just want to verify the wiring before I splice in to anything.

So basically, I just need to know which 2 wires need to make a momentary connection for the car to start.

So based on what you said above (excluding position 1 and 2) it would be the red (all 3 or only 1????) and the black/yellow wire?

I'm assuming there are 3 red because 1 red goes with position 1, one goes with position 2 and one goes with starting?

Thanks man!

Ok, so technically is it as simple as this? (I know this drawing sucks but I didn't reinstall photoshop yet) :)

I'm not sure if I am going to do position 1 and 2 or just have the one start button.

position 1 = red + purple
position 2 = red + green
Start = Red + Black/Yellow + Ground


So, if this is wrong please let me know! Thanks!

EDIT: There are 4 green...so are they all for position 2?

anyone.................? :-)

Ok, so technically is it as simple as this? (I know this drawing sucks but I didn't reinstall photoshop yet) :)

I'm not sure if I am going to do position 1 and 2 or just have the one start button.

position 1 = red + purple
position 2 = red + green
Start = Red + Black/Yellow + Ground


So, if this is wrong please let me know! Thanks!

EDIT: There are 4 green...so are they all for position 2?

The 4mm red wire connected to pin 5 is used for power to the 2.5mm black/yellow wire attached to pin 8 AND the 2.5mm green wire attached to pin 1. This green wire goes to an unloader relay. You could probably get away with not using it. In case you don't know, the unloader relay opens while cranking to remove power from various consumers so that more powewr is available when starting. What year is your 7? M62 cars have one touch starting already and the momentary connection is pin 5 to pin 8. And you'll still need the key.

Forget the ground in your diagram, any grounds needed are done through the DME and the starter as well as any that are needed for the EWS system.

You could probably just splice the two wires and run them to the start button leaving the others in place. That way if the start button failed you would still be able to use the key.

It's a 96.

Ok. I am not planning on cutting anything, only splicing in to it. The key is in the key cylinder which I have moved back under the dash. I need to find something to be nice and flush and fill the key cylinder area to make it look clean.

I don't need they key to start the car right now....an extra key stays in the cylinder, hidden.

So basically, I can just use 1 red 12v and the black and yellow wire to go to the start push button?? Theoretically, touching those 2 wires should start the car?? I just need to narrow down which wires I need to use for the push button.

By the way, thanks for all your help. I appreciate it.

Ok, thanks....I somehow skipped where you said "momentary connection is pin 5 to pin 8"...that's what I needed to know.

Don't forget to leave the antenna ring attached to the ignition cylinder!

Don't forget to leave the antenna ring attached to the ignition cylinder!


I left the whole key cylinder in tact. There were 2 wires coming off ot it and I left them attached. I just placed the key cylinder with the key in it under the dash and then put it back togethr. The antenna ring is the black thing behind the plastic housing, correct? The only thing I did was remove the cylinder, but I left it in tact and didnt take it apart....it's just removed from the actual key hole.

I hope that made sense.:rolleyes

That will work. Interested to hear how, where, you're going to install the start button.

That will work. Interested to hear how, where, you're going to install the start button.

I was actually thinking of installing it in the change holder....so you would have to push the change holder and let it open and the button would be installed in the black plastic housing since I can take that out and cut a circular hole in it and then put the button in there nice and flush...I was thinking that location because it's hidden pretty well.

I just need to find something to cover the key cylinder...because now there is a just a hole there.

I hope you have the steering wheel unlocked!!! And can make sure that the wheel can't lock itself while driving. That could be really bad.:D

I hope you have the steering wheel unlocked!!! And can make sure that the wheel can't lock itself while driving. That could be really bad.:D


It's unlocked...and I fixed it permanently so the steering wheel doesn't lock...but I know how to change it so it does...but it takes a little work to do.

Also, preliminary testing this morning. I waxed my car and then I tried testing....I put a wire on red and a wire on 8....nothing happened....hmmm...............I turned the dial inside of the ignition switch (which is how I start and turn off my car and go to position 1 and 2) it it worked fine...but simply touching red and black/yellow didnt do anything.....


I need my camera...darnit.


Ok, I brought the lower half of the ignition inside so I can check it out...I opened it and when I turn the dial to start the car there is a little black piece of plastic with a thin metal strip going around it and a spring sitting under it and on each side of the spring are metal contacts.......when I turn the dial the plastic goes downward and forces the metal to make contact and then it comes back up....so that seems like a momentary connection right there....

This isn't as easy as I thought....but I'm going to figure it out....(with you guys help) :-)

Ok, battery lasted all of 30 seconds. Maybe this might help explain what I'm trying to say better...

So should I just connect the 12v(red) and yellow/black ignition wires together and then the push button start would be the wires running from the gold contacts making the momentary connection instead of using the red and black/yellow for the button???

Whats the production date of your car? I want to make sure I gave you the right information.

Whats the production date of your car? I want to make sure I gave you the right information.

02/96

The wiring at switch info was correct. Everything else was not. You can still probably make this work but how are you going to turn the car off? If it were me I would leave the cylinder in place and use the key to turn the car on but run parallel wiring to the start button. This would be similar to how a Z8 works.

The wiring at switch info was correct. Everything else was not. You can still probably make this work but how are you going to turn the car off? If it were me I would leave the cylinder in place and use the key to turn the car on but run parallel wiring to the start button. This would be similar to how a Z8 works.


What I do now to start my car is turn the dial to start the car, I turn it again to turn it off....same thing I planned to do with the button...so I think it has to be the momentary connection made between the black plastic piece with the 2 contacts touching the 2 gold contacts which is starting the car and turning it off....when I turn the dial to turn the car on or off...the black piece makes a contact with the gold contacts for a split second...I just don't know if the 12v and black yellow are making a connection at the same time...

The key cylinder doesnt work....it still reads the key but the inside of the key cylinder is broke...which I why I just left the key in it and put it in the dash out of sight.

Also, I noticed...when the dial inside the switch is at either the 12 or 6 o' clock position the car is off, when it's at either the 3 or 9 o' clock position the car is on....

I'm going to go outside and do some observing and testing...I'll post my results around 1:00

Good luck!

Hey Cash,

The infamous member "Immaculate" who has?(I still hope) one of the sickest 7's out there, has a z8 push start button installed where his foglight switch was.

Heres one of his old post and a pic:

the wiring harness for the ignition/parking brake is located under the steering wheel. you need to remove the shroud that covers all that stuff. from there, it would be easiest to use a multimeter or similar tool (the one i used for this purpose was a simple device w/light bulb on a lead and a ground lead where light bulb lights up when current flows).

i proceeded to poke and prod at all of the wires (testing for current) while starting/shutting off the car. i probably started the car 15+ times doing this. when you locate the wire that controls the logic starter, you tap that one into the power for the Z8 starter.

the only other thing i really did that's noteworthy was tap the 3rd wire on the starter to the parking brake so that the starter can't be used without the parking brake engaged. this, of course, is to prevent curious passengers from pressing for fun while i'm cruising on the highway and sending parts flying out of the rear of my car!

the physical install of the button is really up to you, but as you know i replaced my foglight switch rather simply by tapping the foglight power to the parking lights (similar to installing DDEs) and popping the foglight switch out of its bezel and dremelling a bit around the bezel to accomodate the Z8 button. the Z8 button is already almost a PERFECT fit. ironic, isn't it? i then used some flat black spray paint to cover over the foglight indicator lights and voila, all black bezel w/z8 button installed.

all of this took me probably 4 hours with the help of a friend. the hardest part for me was removing the shroud under the steering wheel and removing the dash to access the switch *laughs*

http://7er.aaronliao.com/pictures/04.jpg

his website:http://7er.aaronliao.com/

EDIT: I think I remember that his still uses the key to get power, then push the start button

I hope this works out for you

-Keith

Thanks Blk. I sent him an email...maybe he can help me out.

That's what I need to know...which wire is for the logic starter....Im thinking that along with the 12v should start the car. I keep finding that it's the black/yellow every diagram and bimmerfxr said the same....but why won't it start when the starter wire and 12v make contact??

That looks really good. I just got back home so I am about to start working on it now.

Ok, so this is what I figured out so far...it has to be the wires itself that make the car start...I completely took out the black piece and the spring and I turn the dial and it still starts and I can turn it off....so the black piece making contact with the gold contacts in the picture is elimiated from the equation.

So which wire combination makes the car start?

Question? Does the sequence of Position 1, Position 2, Start matter? I'm wondering because when I connect the lower half of the ignition switch with the dial preset at 12 or 6 o'clock the car will start if I connect the lower half of the switch at 3 or 9 o'clock it is off like it should be...so does the car think it already went through the sequence of the key turning through the positions???

Are you Confused? lol Sorry if it doesnt make sense...

I just need the wires that need to make contact in order for the car to start!!! GRRR GETTING MAD!!! :mad:mad:mad:mad

12v at pin 5 and starter wire (black/yellow) at pin 8 touching doesn't work. The 2 wires are shown below with the red line from pin 5 to 8.

Ok this is getting long and i want to get this thing working so it can be done and over with....this is what I just noticed after looking further in to the switch with it apart and what happens to the switch when the car is in the off position and when it is started.

EDIT: I was going so fast I made some spelling mistakes in the pictures...sorry. :-( I'm flustered now.



EDIT 2: Oh my......................Maybe my problem is that....I have the lower half of the ignition switch off when I was testing....Maybe I should just splice in to the wire with the igntion switch put together and then try it??

:eatpop:


I can add nothing else constructive at this point:)

Alrighty, so I think I know why it wouldnt start now....I have 12v (red), Starter Wire (black/yellow), and I believe I need one for ignition? But what is the difference between Ignition 1 and Ingition 2?

Well, I'll resume trying this tomorrow morning....if anyone knows anything please let me know! Thanks!

Cashmere740IL, i got your email but am traveling for business right now and haven't got access to my e38 files. i will look into this for you when i return.

thx for the referral BlkonBlk99 :) and yea, i've still got the 7...and a few other new interesting toys...

aaron

Thanks, I appreciate it.

Why not get an on off switch to turn the ignition on & then the push button to activate the starter, so when you stop just flick the switch off, I did it on a Rover Stirling without any problems.

Alan

Why not get an on off switch to turn the ignition on & then the push button to activate the starter, so when you stop just flick the switch off, I did it on a Rover Stirling without any problems.

Alan


That would work too...but the problem I am having now is finding which wires need to go to the switches... Once I figure that out then I'm good to go.

For example: Which wires need to make contact for the car to start? It's not the 12v and starter wire...I tried that so I'm guessing the ignition needs to be hot first? I could easily start splicing and cutting but I only want to do this once and right...so i want to find out before I start doing anything...

If worse comes to worse I can run the same wires from the ignition switch and use the switch and put a dial on it like the fog light switch....turn right to turn the car on and left to turn it off...that's how it's working right now... There's already a dial there but it's inset...I could get the dial from a fog light switch and then mount it somewhere like that...same idea...but I'd rather have the push button.

One way or another....it'll get done. :-)

Is this any help,

12 VOLT CONSTANT RED (+) IGNITION SWITCH HARNESS STARTER BLACK/YELLOW (+) IGNITION SWITCH HARNESS STARTER 2 N/A IGNITION 1 GREEN (+) IGNITION SWITCH HARNESS IGNITION 2 PURPLE (+) IGNITION SWITCH HARNESS IGNITION 3

Alan


N/A

Thanks...I have that info.

There's just something I'm missing...I would think by touching the red 12v and the starter wire the car would start....so maybe ignition 1 or ignition 2 need to be enabled too?

This is for an e46...so maybe I need to do the same thing for the e38.

I can't help you on that, I was trying to copy the whole page off my computer but it didn't come out the way it should,

Alan

thx for the referral BlkonBlk99 :) and yea, i've still got the 7...and a few other new interesting toys...

aaron

Very welcome Aaron, glad to hear you still have your beautiful car!!



Cash,

Do you have the Bentley manual? If you don't I can check mine to see if they have the diagram you need.

I don't know if it's in there but if you can check that would be great, Thanks. I need to get the TIS back on my laptop. I lost everything. :mad

I don't know if it's in there but if you can check that would be great, Thanks. I need to get the TIS back on my laptop. I lost everything. :mad

Photography of loved ones always makes me feel better whenever I lose things on my laptop.

Photography of loved ones always makes me feel better whenever I lose things on my laptop.

Well, I need some AA batteries...I keep forgetting when I go out. :redspot

You really need help. haha

Well, I need some AA batteries...I keep forgetting when I go out.

http://www.bestdesignever.com/osv/lame.jpg

This is the best I could find so far: (I don't understand Spanish, so I can't help translate what it means:D)

http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/1431/m73yi4.jpg

Plik, you're crazy. :eyecrazy

I don't know why I'm giving in to you :rolleyes...but I think you saw this one...I'm looking on cd's from different vacations from the past year.

This is the best I could find so far: (I don't understand Spanish, so I can't help translate what it means:D)

http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/1431/m73yi4.jpg


Now I'm really confused.:confused

Now I'm really confused.:confused

I still don't get what he meant by that little quip about not speaking Spanish.

Yeah, I just figured it was over my head because the words are in English in the pic...but that pic just confused me anyway.

I need something that says green wire does x, purple wire does y, red does z. I have been looking online all day...no luck.

I still don't get what he meant by that little quip about not speaking Spanish.

just my bad attempt at being funny:help

Its in reference to the movie "Anchorman", where Will Ferell is talking to his dog and says " you know I don't understand Spanish".

so whenever there is something I don't understand... I always... oh never mind...its not funny if you have to explain it:)


its what I get for being a terminal wiseass!

Cash - this seems like a very cool mod. My uncle bought a new car few days back which had the keyless go, and I was thinking I wish I had that too. The one in immaculate's car looks really nice and very professionally done. Good luck!

Thanks Matsui...hopefully I'll have it all figured out by this weekend. Yeah Immaculates looks good....I am going to put mine inside of the change holder most likely so it can't be seen.

Did you ever get your HID's?

I called him couple of times, gave him my address and set a time for him to come over but never heard back from him. I never followed up with him either. I'm not in a rush, so when I have an itch again, I might call him.

hmmm....that's crazy....well his loss.

So.....I just drove to my house in NJ where I can use the garage....I take everything apart and BOOM! I figure it out in all of 10 minutes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm so happy now!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'll post how i figured it out in a little bit, I am going to put everything back together and tape the wires etc.....so simple!!!!! All that trying and trying and then I figure it out in 10 minutes!!!!

So.....I just drove to my house in NJ where I can use the garage....I take everything apart and BOOM! I figure it out in all of 10 minutes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm so happy now!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'll post how i figured it out in a little bit, I am going to put everything back together and tape the wires etc.....so simple!!!!! All that trying and trying and then I figure it out in 10 minutes!!!!

Woo Hoo Cashmere!!!

Congratulations. :)

You know, whenever things like this happen to me I usually celebrate by buying AA batteries.

Hahahaha man you crack me up.

I'm going to get some batteries probably tomorrow. I am about to change my front brake pads in a few minutes. I need to find a nice push button like Immaculate has.

I just grabbed a cheap 4.00 toggle switch from Advanced Auto Parts during testing. I ran the wires from back behind the steering wheel down the side of the radio/mid etc under the shifter in to the change holder...I actually think I might change the location to maybe where Immaculate has his or maybe the small 6" piece of wood trim on the right side of the steering wheel next to the cruise control...I don't know....I'm only drilling a circular hole one time so I need to find the right place. :)

It was so simple to get it started...

I didnt cut any wires from the ignition switch...I just tapped in to the wires.

I opened the switch with the car on....all connections were making contact so I used a tooth pick to push down on each connection seeing when the car cut off, etc...

1.)I found that position 1 and 2 both need to be ON.....I said that somewhere the beginning of this thread. The are are 2 green and 1 purple.

2.)The starter wire (black/yellow) needs to make a momentary contact with the 2 green and 1 purple ignition wires and the 12v+ (red)

3.)There are 3 red 12v connections going to the switch....after fooling around with it I realized I only needed one.

4.)There are several ways to wire this....if you want to still keep position 1, position 2.

Ok, I need to go change my brakes.....If you guys want I can do a write up with pics on how to do this and include the pinouts/colors etc...I don't think many people are interested in a start button though.

Be back later!!!! :buttrock:buttrock:buttrock:buttrock:buttrock:butt rock

Subscribed

Excellent, glad to hear it Cash:redspot

I am really excited to see the write-up on this:)

I'll be doing the write up as soon as I get my new button so I can take pics etc.

It feels weird getting in my car and just pushing a button to start it (well, stupid toggle switch right now)...sometimes when I get out I almost forget to take my keys because I don't have to take them out of the ignition any more.

I like it, I'm glad I did it....No regrets. ;)

I'll be doing the write up as soon as I get my new button so I can take pics etc.

It feels weird getting in my car and just pushing a button to start it (well, stupid toggle switch right now)...sometimes when I get out I almost forget to take my keys because I don't have to take them out of the ignition any more.

I like it, I'm glad I did it....No regrets. ;)

:confused You don't have to take they keys out of the ignition -- how do you turn off the engine?

:confused You don't have to take they keys out of the ignition -- how do you turn off the engine?

Following the write up you will be able to do this my way if you wanted to not use they key for some reason, which is a security issue...but i'm not worried about it myself...or still have to use the key and then push the button.

This was not the intention to not use the key, but with my car in particular since the tab inside of the key cylinder broke off and the key would not do much besides be read by the computer...I removed the key cylinder...it has 2 wires connected to it which go to the antenna, which reads the key. I moved the key cylinder behind the steering wheel/under the dash with a spare key left in it.

It's out of sight and no one would ever know with out disassembling the steering wheel stuff. (except people reading this) :eek:

The only time I have to use my key is for the remote to unlock/lock doors, set alarm, put windows down, trunk etc. Once I open my doors with the remote, I have no use for the keys.

The key only needs to be in the ignition so it can be read, all other functions..position 1, position 2, and start can all be controlled by the switch...you can have a switch to turn the car to position 1 and 2 or just have a switch to start and shut the car off if you never need to use position 1 and 2.

Position 1 and 2 still have to be activated or the car will not start. But you can tie position 1 and 2 in to each other.

There are 3 red wires (12v) which are always hot...but I only used 1. Position 1 has a 12v position 2 has a 12v and starter wire has a 12v (momentary)

Since the Starter wire only make a momentary connection with the 12v to start the car...pushing the button initiates the connection, pushing it again ends the connection and turns the car off.

I learned ALOT about the whole ignition system and wiring all because my key cylinder messed up. I'm actually glad it did because if not, I would have never known what I do now...How to bypass the steering wheel lock, shifter lock, which wires going to the ignition switch control what function etc.

The write up will be coming soon with pics which will make everything much clearer.

Cash,
instead of a push button, you coud get a few of these, and make like a retro race car or fighter cockpit...(if your into that sort of thing):D

http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/2135/ignitionswitchoffuq1.jpg

They actually had those at the auto store...I was laughing because all I could think of was some type of fighter jet using those. I saw a video on you tube with someone who had it set up like that. haha

By the way, the switch is located in the change holder. (still deciding where to put it permanently) So, technically if for some unknown reason, I left my car unlocked and the windows down and someone jumped in...they would be confused because there is no where to insert a key and no visible start button.

Ahh, while typing this I just thought of another place which is secure...

You know how the armrest slides forward/backwards right? There is the small piece of plastic cover that comes off under it...I could place the switch in there too. Slide armrest forward, press button, car starts, slide armrest back and button is concealed. No one would ever think to even look there.

I'm trying to really weigh the options of:

Do I want people to see this for the cool factor vs. have the button but have it concealed. I valet my car a lot when I travel so I would have to tell them...but of course someone is bound to forget and people change shifts.

or make a peice to fit in the ashtray, push down, lid folds back and the button appears. Very James Bond-like! but would be easier to discover.

or make a peice to fit in the ashtray, push down, lid folds back and the button appears. Very James Bond-like! but would be easier to discover.


Oh...is that what that is? :cool The Astray, haha. I have always called it the change holder since that's what I use it for, even though the cigarette lighter is right there too. That's where the button is now.

What about one of these for the ashtray ...

http://www.asianwolf.com/caraccess2003/starterkillcombosmall.jpg

Now that's slick...I wouldn't mind having one of those. Put in the security code and the car starts...interesting. I'm going to have to research those.

I think a push button where the ignition key goes is where you should put it. The one immaculate has looks VERY cool and I can't get it out of my mind ever since I saw it. If you are concerned about safety, maybe you can have a separate switch at a hidden location below the steering wheel to activate the push button. That way if you are doing valet, you can leave that button activated just so they don't screw up.

I think a push button where the ignition key goes is where you should put it. The one immaculate has looks VERY cool and I can't get it out of my mind ever since I saw it. If you are concerned about safety, maybe you can have a separate switch at a hidden location below the steering wheel to activate the push button. That way if you are doing valet, you can leave that button activated just so they don't screw up.

That was an idea I had earlier in this thread...I completely forgot about that too. I think that is where I might put it and wire a toggle switch under the steering wheel that wouldnt be seen and yes, I could leave it on when I valet and then flip that switch when I start the car. I would just make the toggle switch the 12v (red) and then run a wire from that to the push button. I got the idea in my head already! Thanks Matsui!!! :buttrock

This is what I use ...

http://www.bestdesignever.com/osv/lock.jpg

HAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAH AH

MAN YOU HAVE SOME SERIOUS ISSUES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol

I can't stop laughing. Only you.

It's even funnier when I actually picture some one putting in a combination.

how did you guys handle the steering wheel lock? I want to totally remove the need for a key.

Very slick, Cashmere!

how did you guys handle the steering wheel lock? I want to totally remove the need for a key.

You have to turn the spline thing that unlocks the steering wheel. With the key cylinder removed you can push your finger against it if your finger is long enough if not, use a screw driver or anything that will reach in it and push it and then with the ignition switch removed you will see the end of it. Just turn it by hand to the unlock position and put everything back together.

As soon as it warms up I'll do the write up with the many different options you have to do this. This 20 degree weather is just terrible.

Very slick, Cashmere!

Thanks man, I can't wait until it's finally done with the new button.

:needpics