just curious ... a friend of mine today told me that he thought most of the people driving 335's leased. (and probably a lot of 328's but not quite as much)
that surprised me ... ergo the informal (and unscientific) poll.
i'm wondering if that's true?

Good question, I have been pondering the same issue.

Are you kidding? First year model; overheating problem rumored; First turbo in decades; only $550 per month for 3 years with low down payment - Lease pLease !!!

Too lazy to write monthly checks and if you can't buy a luxury car outright, you should probably be investing the money instead anyways.... hence the term "luxury".

Bought.

Too lazy to write monthly checks and if you can't buy a luxury car outright, you should probably be investing the money instead anyways.... hence the term "luxury".

Bought.

What if you are a small business owner and you are able to earn 15% on your invested capital and you can lease for 4.8%? Have you ever heard of positive leverage? Probably not. I bet you are a wage slave.

This question always gets interesting feedback. I purchased mine. I would think most people lease their cars, regardless of make or model, (particularly if its for business purposes) unless they have a collectors car or something the are restoring etc. Outside of the opportunity cost of capital, I think the residual risk on a BMW is relatively low, so buying or leasing from that perspective shouldn't make a difference.

I leased, and decided I will never buy another car as long as I live, unless I become ridiculously rich and just don't care about money anymore. I get tired of cars too fast, and cars depreciate too fast, so it's a losing investment. With a lease, I know I'm getting a new car in 3 years, and I know I don't have to worry about selling it or getting screwed on a trade in...

Too lazy to write monthly checks and if you can't buy a luxury car outright, you should probably be investing the money instead anyways.... hence the term "luxury".

Bought.

What if you just like to get a new car every 3 years? You ever thought about that one?

What if you are a small business owner and you are able to earn 15% on your invested capital and you can lease for 4.8%? Have you ever heard of positive leverage?

No "what if's" involved here.... except for the earning 15% on the invested capital. What if you lose 15%? ... Then you are down 20%.

What if you just like to get a new car every 3 years? You ever thought about that one?

Buy a different one?

Buy a different one?


Doesn't matter which one you buy. If you buy a new one every 3 years, your going to lose more money by buying.

Just got my 07 328i convertible about two weeks ago. This was a purchase.

Are you kidding? First year model; overheating problem rumored; First turbo in decades; only $550 per month for 3 years with low down payment - Lease pLease !!!

$550 per month, how many miles per year? Sounds like you got a great deal!

Lease, as I typically start getting new car itch in 2-1/2 years. Leased '96 328IS, '99 328I and was pleased. Then bought 2001 MBZ CLK430 and traded for purchase of 2000 AudiS4 in '04 and took a beating on both. Vowed never to buy another car again until absolutely certain I've gotten over wanting a new car every few years. Plus, since I'm a wage slave to corporate sales big brother pays for most of the Lease anyway.

Too lazy to write monthly checks and if you can't buy a luxury car outright, you should probably be investing the money instead anyways.... hence the term "luxury".

Bought.


??? Too lazy to write checks? Sign up for Easy Pay or do a 1-pay lease. If you can write a check to pay for your luxury car (or any car for that mater) - Good for you. But why? I'd rather put my money into something that makes me money and appreciates in value. A good investment should make a higher return after 3 years than that of an average new car... one that depreciates with every mile. Wrong?

Lease.

What if you are a small business owner and you are able to earn 15% on your invested capital and you can lease for 4.8%? Have you ever heard of positive leverage? Probably not. I bet you are a wage slave.

or just a wanker

I lease cars because they depreciate and buy houses because they appreciate.

thanks for the feedback! because i'm not a wiz when it comes to money matters, i've asked a few experts (accountant, money manager, investement person) and all three told me: leasing is fine, but there are very few exceptions - like the small biz owner -where you'll actually come out ahead, financially,or be a good investment. esp. with bmw's, which tend to hold residual value. there's nothing wrong with it, but i was told: lease if the payments would be too high, or if i couldn't see myself keeping the car more than 3 years.
so, i'm buying.

$550 per month, how many miles per year? Sounds like you got a great deal!

10K miles per year. That's all I drive.

Too lazy to write monthly checks and if you can't buy a luxury car outright, you should probably be investing the money instead anyways.... hence the term "luxury".

Bought.

You're either too rich for your own good, or don't understand the time value of money, or both.

Leasing has advantages and if you understand them make sense to do (unlike Earl who doesn't understand how to drive at 17....did you ever post a picture of your "new' car")

Leasing is just like buy except you sell the car and buy it on the same day.


Leased mine because I seem to sell the cars I've bought quick which means I'm a leaser.

This is my dream car. I see keeping for at least 8 years (with extended warranty) plus I do not think it will have a bad resale value whenever I decide to sell... so I bought it. I used to lease and after 12 years of leasing 5 cars, I am out over 100K and have 0 to show for it. Plus when you end the lease early or take a car back when it is done and dont release with that company, they can penalize you for everything from dings to scratches on the windshields to whatever they want just to make your life miserable.

I'd rather have pride of ownership and be able to mod with no risk of big brother watching.

Purchased it. :D
According to a rep. for BMW NA, most BMWs are leased.
Drive way too many miles to lease a car (25K/year x over-miles cost is too darn expensive).

What I do is calculate the NPV (net present value) or IRR of the lease vs. the purchase, for the entire stream of payments. Then I compare buying vs. leasing. I have an excel spreadsheet I've used for years for this.

If leasing is less than 1% different (in some cases, it's actually *better*), then I lease, even if I want to buy the car in the end. The "option value" of being able to dump the car if it's a problem (or I don't like it) is worth 1% interest.

In several cases, I've leased a car even though I planned and did buy it out at the end, and it was the most appropriate financial decision.

I leased mine with sports package and automatic for $507/month..Best car ever IMO and certainly the most bank for the buck..Will probably turn it back in 3 years from now and get a 2010 335i..I heard they were going to have VTOL (verticle take off and landing) capabilities by then.<G>

What I do is calculate the NPV (net present value) or IRR of the lease vs. the purchase, for the entire stream of payments. Then I compare buying vs. leasing. I have an excel spreadsheet I've used for years for this.

If leasing is less than 1% different (in some cases, it's actually *better*), then I lease, even if I want to buy the car in the end. The "option value" of being able to dump the car if it's a problem (or I don't like it) is worth 1% interest.

In several cases, I've leased a car even though I planned and did buy it out at the end, and it was the most appropriate financial decision.

+1 Dougman had the first financially sound reply yet. Either option can be better depending on financial terms and personal preference.

Too lazy to write monthly checks and if you can't buy a luxury car outright, you should probably be investing the money instead anyways.... hence the term "luxury".

Bought.


Your parents didn't answer this question:nono You're too lazy, but that may be the reason you never actually buy one, if at your age you have this horrible attitude.

According to a rep. for BMW NA, most BMWs are leased.

this is true

Too lazy to write monthly checks and if you can't buy a luxury car outright, you should probably be investing the money instead anyways.... hence the term "luxury".

Bought.
Let's say a car is $50k. You have $50k. Explain to me why you would spend all of that money on buying a car, instead of paying monthly payments and either A: Gain interest on the rest of the money, or B: Invest in something that gives you a solid 5% to 10% annual return?

Don't work for your money, have your money work for you.



You also get a new car ever couple of years

Let's say a car is $50k. You have $50k. Explain to me why you would spend all of that money on buying a car, instead of paying monthly payments and either A: Gain interest on the rest of the money, or B: Invest in something that gives you a solid 5% to 10% annual return?

Don't work for your money, have your money work for you.



You also get a new car ever couple of years


He's a kid who doesn't understand these things.

He's a kid who doesn't understand these things.
and he has a 335? I do not believe it, and it is not because of his potential age that I do not believe it.

You're either too rich for your own good, or don't understand the time value of money, or both.

Too rich? what about too stupid? Every rich person I know leases, because of tax advantages and not wanting to tie up capital. A lease rate is typically 5%. Any one with a modicum of common sense can earn more than this from investments or their business.

AEarlM, let me give you an example of positive leverage. Richie Rich has $40,000 cash lying around. He can use these funds to buy a new BMW cash or he can invest these funds in his business and purchase more inventory. His company earns 15% per year on equity.

He can lease at $400 a month or invest in his company and earn $600/month and use this business income to pay the lease payment. If he leases he earns an extra $200 per month before tax.

On the other hand, if you work at McDonalds and your Dad bought you the car, then maybe you should buy.

Leasing allows you to invest your capital and gives you flexibility. What if you got a lemon or got in an accident and want to get rid of your car? Leasing gives you the option to turn back the car with no hassle.

Most Bimmer owners make an above average income because they own their own business, or are professional (doctor, lawyer, dentist, accountant, etc.) or they are in a sales job that pays well over 6 figures and they can write off their lease payment.

AEarlM, only foolishness comes out of your mouth. First the transmission debate and then the leasing discussion. You really show your naivety.You are a glutton for punishment. I think you like being flamed becaue if you did not get bad attention, you would not get any attention at all.

What do you do for a living? Is it Wendy's, McDonalds, Burger King, Jack in the Box or Taco Bell?

We had members like this on our Z forum, which is why I'm so hard on him. Kids who didn't own a car that just came to start trouble instead of being part of the community.

We had members like this on our Z forum, which is why I'm so hard on him. Kids who didn't own a car that just came to start trouble instead of being part of the community.

I just read some more of his bantering with you guys on the transmission and agree he's probably a non-owner with nothing better to do. Even if he does have one the asinine comments about if you can't afford to buy you shouldn't have one shows his lack of experience.

I had two 3 series with manuals and switched to auto when I traded the 99 328I for a MBZ CLK 430. I see your point on the manual, but really like the steptronic on my new 335I. Neither of the dealers I would consider doing business with had manuals in stock anyway. :shifty... the paddle shifters will have to do. These cars are so fun to drive with either transmission that I'm perfectly happy, particularly with my lemon interior. :redspot

I bought because I drive well over 20K per year and will most definately modify this car.

wow, this is a hot topic, didn't mean to stir the pot here.
look, leasing is renting, buying is buying. that's the biggest difference.
think about this: if it wasn't advantageous to the car dealer, do you think they'd be pushing leasing as much as they do? they push - because they MAKE MORE MONEY on the deal.

like i said, lease if you want to trade in your car after 3 years, or if you have a tax advantage (which, by the way, most leasers don't not) but don't do it because you've convinced yourself it's a more "flexible" way to invest your money.
it's not.
hey - enjoy your car, okay?

sorry, typo - that's "do not" !

Leasing is not really renting. It's negotiating the trade in at the same time as you buy it. When you lease you have as much stake in the car as if you financed it.

Learning how to take advantage of leases, and taxes is more than just a rental.

Do the math on how much the cost to own is over 3 years of a lease and purchase and things start to make sense. But realize ALL cars aren't good leases.

lease... 3 years 12 k miles... 605/month... 3k down

i negotiated a good deal then paid cash for mine because i am stinking rich :redspot

Leasing is not really renting. It's negotiating the trade in at the same time as you buy it. When you lease you have as much stake in the car as if you financed it.

Learning how to take advantage of leases, and taxes is more than just a rental.

Do the math on how much the cost to own is over 3 years of a lease and purchase and things start to make sense. But realize ALL cars aren't good leases.

Leasing has some tax advantages. Some Bimmer owners are professionals (i.e. doctor, lawyers, dentist, etc.) or have their own business and can use tax advantages of owing a company to make buying a car more economical.

Also, it depends on your opportunity cost of capital an the lease rate. If you have some real estate investments or a stock portfolio that is doing well, you could actually make more money by leasing.

Say you had $40,000 and could earn 12% a year or $4,800. On an aftertax basis, that income could pay your lease payment. It is a wash and ypu have the flexablities of leasing.

What if you used that $40,000 to buy a stock that doubled in value to $80,000 after 3 year. Would you have been better off leasing? I like investing in appreaciating assets and renting depreciating assets where the finance rate is low.

i negotiated a good deal then paid cash for mine because i am stinking rich :redspot

Hello "jingle68":

I am not rich nor do I go long periods without bathing. That being said, I do have one of the lowest monthly payments - $0.00. I have seen some good arguments posited for taking a lease, and I can certainly be convinced that I was wrong, but I plan on keeping this vehicle for a long time and I just could not understand the argument for leasing a vehicle that (at my advanced age) I would keep for at least 10 years. So, I wrote a check.

lease deals are awesome for employees. :D :D

Hello "jingle68":

I am not rich nor do I go long periods without bathing. That being said, I do have one of the lowest monthly payments - $0.00. I have seen some good arguments posited for taking a lease, and I can certainly be convinced that I was wrong, but I plan on keeping this vehicle for a long time and I just could not understand the argument for leasing a vehicle that (at my advanced age) I would keep for at least 10 years. So, I wrote a check.

I can understand this strategy. If you are going to keep the car a longtime, you might as well pay yourself the interest costs.

On a 3 series lease in Canada, the interest costs are about $11,000 which is pretty much the tax benefits from the write offs.

If you pay cash, you still get to write off your car by taking depreciation. If you need your car for business you get to write off the gas, insurance and repairs.

If I had a job where I could not write off my car and all the expenses, I would be driving a Honda, and that is the honest truth. My Bimmer is a job perk and the government (i.e. the IRS) paid for a good portion of this car for me.

wow, this is a hot topic, didn't mean to stir the pot here.
look, leasing is renting, buying is buying. that's the biggest difference.
think about this: if it wasn't advantageous to the car dealer, do you think they'd be pushing leasing as much as they do? they push - because they MAKE MORE MONEY on the deal.

like i said, lease if you want to trade in your car after 3 years, or if you have a tax advantage (which, by the way, most leasers don't not) but don't do it because you've convinced yourself it's a more "flexible" way to invest your money.
it's not.
hey - enjoy your car, okay?

Wow. This is a hot topic - sure is fun.

The dealer is going to make the same money on either a purchase or a lease. They profit from the bank if you finance just like if you lease. They wont make as much if you pay cash, because there is no kick-back from a lender. As far as the sale price is concerned, the profit margin is the same all three ways.

Dealers push leasing (why you see it in the papers and in advertising...) because it gives them a way to show a lower payment. If I were a marketing director, I would want my advertising dollars to show the lowest possible payment on my product with the lowest potential down payment from my advertising audience. In the automotive industry, that means to show a lease payment.

Dealers also push leasing because of the potential for higher rate-of sales per customer. If a person leases a car for three years, the dealer knows they will need another car at the end of three years and they have a good shot at leasing them another car. Assuming the dealer did everything right and treated the customer well during the three years, and assuming the person enjoyed the product, why would that person not consider leasing (or buying) from that dealer again? It builds brand loyalty as well as dealership - customer loyalty. There is nothing wrong with that, nor is there anything wrong with a dealer and manufacturer making a profit.

I like leasing because it gives me a chance to have a new car under warranty (manufacturer supplied... not an extended "I had to pay more for it warranty"), and I get the chance to have a car that should require little work to keep it running during that time. Plus, I get a new car more often, which means it has the potential to be faster, safer and better than even the same car I just had (2006 to 2007 3 series for example). Add to it that if I were to buy the car, my payments would likely be double and for much longer.

As I read thru this thread, I read of people using spreadsheets, fancy calculators and who knows what to determine which is better. That's fine and all but there is so much more to it. After all the calculations, it all comes down to which one fits YOU the best. Do you drive too much to lease? Then you should buy. Do you want hassle free exchanges of your car every couple years and not have to worry about trading it in and haggling with a dealer on the end value? Then you should lease. Do you want to keep the car and drive it "till the wheels fall off"? I'm thinking you should buy. All said, it's really a matter of which one fits you (and your wallet) the best.

Somebody mentioned that they ding you with all sorts of fees at the end of a lease and charge you whatever they want for damages. So what? When you trade in a purchased car, those same damages will devalue your car an amount equal to whatever the appraiser believes them to be. Six of one, half dozen of the other.

So do whatever makes you feel more comfortable. It's a depreciating asset. It's renting vs buying. It's a matter of what you can afford and how often you want to keep making payments. It's really quite as simple as it is unique to the person considering the choice of the two. Good luck!

>>i negotiated a good deal then paid cash for mine because i am stinking rich


lmao..nice

i thought the thread needed cheering up a bit with some humour :help

>>It's a depreciating asset. It's renting vs buying.

That's the simple truth of the matter right there. A depreciating asset will never make you money. Also, if you ever sell it instead of driving it until it falls apart you lose even more. I think people eventually sell too early and that happens more often than not.

Leasing gives you the advantages of having the latest and greatest (with full warranty) every few years. Who wouldnt want that? If you drive it until the wheels fall off then be glad you didn't lease it. For me at least I will be checking to see what BMW has in store for me in 2010 when my lease comes up. It will be brand spanking new and full of horse power you can bet that.

Man, it's fun to see a few of you fly off the handle... lighten up, you'll live longer. :)

I was being half facetious.... I do think that a BMW is a poor investment whether you are leasing or buying, so insulting a buyer about sound investment strategies while you lease a luxury car is kind of ridiculous. :rolleyes

Man, it's fun to see a few of you fly off the handle... lighten up, you'll live longer. :)

I was being half facetious.... I do think that a BMW is a poor investment whether you are leasing or buying, so insulting a buyer about sound investment strategies while you lease a luxury car is kind of ridiculous. :rolleyes
way to attempt to back step...

way to attempt to back step...

Okay.... you've convinced me... I am going back to the dealer tomorrow and see if I can sell it back and then lease it.

I'm interested as to why more people do not use Owners Choice? Lease payments, but your name on the title and BMW will pay the balloon at the end of the term. Why would anyone lease if this is available? If I want out of the car tomorrow, I can sell it, no questions asked, but a lease costs you a fortune to get out of.

Better than buying or leasing: Buy used. Let someone else take the depreciation hit.

.... I do think that a BMW is a poor investment.... :rolleyes

AEarlM, I do not know what business school you went to, but a BMW in no uncertain terms, is NOT an investment.

This is the definition of an investment as defined by Merriam-Webster:

Main Entry: investment
Function: noun
Etymology: invest
: the outlay of money usually for income or profit :

Please tell me how you can earn an income or profit from buying a BMW. Really, please enlighten me.

I am waiting for you to say one thing intelligent, but you continually disappoint me.

Out of interest, what do you do for a living? I hope it is not brain or heart surgery where patients depend on their doctor's intelligence.

AEarlM, I do not know what business school you went to, but a BMW in no uncertain terms, is NOT an investment.

This is the definition of an investment as defined by Merriam-Webster:

Main Entry: 2investment
Function: noun
Etymology: 2invest
: the outlay of money usually for income or profit :

Please tell me how you can earn an income or profit from buying a BMW. Really, please enlighten me.

I am waiting for you to say one thing intelligent, but you continually disappoint me.

Out of interest, what do you do for a living? I hope it is not brain or heart surgery where patients depend on their doctor's intelligence.

You, in no uncertain terms, are a douche bag.

Your own post states the definition as such:

"the outlay of money usually for income or profit"

Care to post the definition of "usually"? And that is one definition... words can have several definitions, as you may be aware. I also said that it is a poor investment, which would imply I don't think it will successfully meet the desired goal of making money (though certain cars have in fact appreciated in the past).

If you are going to question someone's intelligence, it usually is a good idea to make sense yourself.

zimmy's post on page 2 is certainly worth a read. an analysis that is well thought out! and zimmy raises many interesting points.

just one tiny quibble: dealers DO make more on a lease. they not only get money off the bank , they get incentives from the company.
(essentially, because they are renting you the car and get it back worth whatever calculated amount is still more than if you'd outright purchased.)

and trust me, it ain't because they can bring customers in (although for many, i agree, it's an incentive). after i told my CA i was buying, he pushed it. and he was not the only one, either. they tried to sell me the lease six ways till sunday.

as for a dinging for whatever dents or problems with the car upon turn in: i've seen people get ripped for an extra few miles and a car that's looked over with a fine toothed comb - and others who are given a pass. so it may depend on the dealer...

zimmy's post on page 2 is certainly worth a read. an analysis that is well thought out! and zimmy raises many interesting points.

just one tiny quibble: dealers DO make more on a lease. they not only get money off the bank , they get incentives from the company.
(essentially, because they are renting you the car and get it back worth whatever calculated amount is still more than if you'd outright purchased.)

and trust me, it ain't because they can bring customers in (although for many, i agree, it's an incentive). after i told my CA i was buying, he pushed it. and he was not the only one, either. they tried to sell me the lease six ways till sunday.

as for a dinging for whatever dents or problems with the car upon turn in: i've seen people get ripped for an extra few miles and a car that's looked over with a fine toothed comb - and others who are given a pass. so it may depend on the dealer...


Thank you for commenting on my post. I don't mean to drag this post on, but a dealer DOES make the same if purchased or leased. If I understand you correctly, you state the dealer makes more when they get the car back. Any dealer who counts on this as extra money is acting foolish and is counting eggs before they hatch. IF a customer brings the car back, the dealer may have a chance to profit off that vehicle again, but only if it is returned to them and they have the first right to purchase it at a reasonable price from the lien holder (ie - BMW Financial).

With the end of lease inspection, it's not up to the dealer to choose the amount charged to a leased vehicle. I believe BMW FS uses an outside company that reviews off lease vehicles and charges for any damages. Anyone who leases thru BMW FS receives a packet close to the end of lease that clearly states what is acceptable and what will slide, as well as a list of things that wont and a chart for estimating repair costs. In addition, anyone who leases a car should know the amount of miles they have paid for during the contract period and if they go over, they should be expected to pay that.

I can certainly understand why somebody would be turned off from leasing, many for reasons I've mentioned. Regardless, it remains to grow as the way most new cars are sold. Much of it might have to do with consumer education on leasing or it might have to do with the higher costs of cars these days. With manufactures offering sub-vented leases, it's no wonder so many are leased these days. I just read that about 70% of all new BMW's sold are leased BTW...

To answer original question - I leased for several reasons. The MF was competitive with equivalent interest rate of 5%.
It also provided we method of conserving cash, so minimal out of pocket initially.
IMO
- negotiate price first, that will effect payments either way
- then determine payments and individual situation, lease or finance

Zimmy1993 has the best post on here. What most people don't understand is that leasing is just another form of financing. Leasing gets a bad rap because it is easy for dealers to make very profitable deals on leases when they get customers who don't understand leasing and only see a lower payment versus traditional financing. However if you understanding how leases are calculated and what fees you should and shouldn't pay then it is just a matter of determining what is the best financing option given your financial situation, how long you plan to own the car, miles you drive, and how you care for a car.

I am sure everybody on this forum takes very good care of their cars so "wear and tear" charges on a lease turn in are a non-issue. The turn ins are inspected by an independent third party and BMW FS is actually very liberal compared to other manufacturers in what they allow. I have turned in three leased BMWs and have paid $0. My last turn in four months ago had a star crack from a stone on a turn signal cover. The charge for this was supposed to be around $35. BMW FS waived the charge.

One advantage to BMW leases, if BMW wants to move cars they create lease incentives with low money factors or higher residual value percentages. These make the leases cheaper. I don't think I have ever seen cash discounts or rebates, or below market traditional financing interest rates.

I leased mine with sports package and automatic for $507/month..Best car ever IMO and certainly the most bank for the buck..Will probably turn it back in 3 years from now and get a 2010 335i..I heard they were going to have VTOL (verticle take off and landing) capabilities by then.<G>

how much did you put down? final sales price? thanks

I bought mine.

I bought mine (outright).
I know that some of you will argue that paying cash for the car was not a wise choice. However, I consider this to also be a hobby and I do not finance hobbies.
I let my monetary investments work for me and I reward myself accordingly.
I already pay the car manufacturer and dealer a given mark up and I don't think I need to support the families of those that work at the lending institutions also.
If I was a Realestate Agent or a traveling Salesman, leasing would make a great deal of sense to me. But again, in my world this is a hobby that I enjoy everyday.

Al Wise

Let's say a car is $50k. You have $50k. Explain to me why you would spend all of that money on buying a car, instead of paying monthly payments and either A: Gain interest on the rest of the money, or B: Invest in something that gives you a solid 5% to 10% annual return?

Don't work for your money, have your money work for you.



You also get a new car ever couple of years

You don't tie up your money by buying vs leasing per se. You can often finance at better rates, get tax deductible interest from using home equity line of credit, or get a low to 0% intro rate on credit cards. The question is -why would you pay a higher rate to lease? Answer- for the option to not hassle with selling at end of the lease. Otherwise, comes down to the best interest rate. Also recall BMW has fees with leasing that increase leasing cost.

You don't tie up your money by buying vs leasing per se. You can often finance at better rates, get tax deductible interest from using home equity line of credit, or get a low to 0% intro rate on credit cards. The question is -why would you pay a higher rate to lease? Answer- for the option to not hassle with selling at end of the lease. Otherwise, comes down to the best interest rate. Also recall BMW has fees with leasing that increase leasing cost.
But spending that money means that money can't work for you anymore.

I bought mine (outright).
I know that some of you will argue that paying cash for the car was not a wise choice. However, I consider this to also be a hobby and I do not finance hobbies.
I let my monetary investments work for me and I reward myself accordingly.
I already pay the car manufacturer and dealer a given mark up and I don't think I need to support the families of those that work at the lending institutions also.
If I was a Realestate Agent or a traveling Salesman, leasing would make a great deal of sense to me. But again, in my world this is a hobby that I enjoy everyday.

Al Wise

Good answer. It is logical and makes sense. I view my Bimmer as a toy and love playing with it.

Good answer. It is logical and makes sense. I view my Bimmer as a toy and love playing with it.

I concur.

JHunter seems to have said it best. These are just two alternate ways to finance a vehicle. I have both purchased and leased BMWs in the past. They have been great cars for me, but I got a little beat up every time I traded in my last "Dream" car, so for me, for know, leasing works best. Until they find a cure for my never ending desire to drive new cars, I'll probably lease. But thats not to say leasing is for everyone. Those of you who have enough sense to keep a car for a long time should buy.

In the end, we're all nuts. Spending significant amounts of money on cars will never make financial sense. I have, however, been able to convince my wife that the difference in price I pay for my cars, over and above the cost of a Honda Accord, is an entertainment cost, not an investment.

i plan on leasing a 335 vert in a month or 2......

thanks for all the logical advice

You don't tie up your money by buying vs leasing per se. You can often finance at better rates, get tax deductible interest from using home equity line of credit, or get a low to 0% intro rate on credit cards. The question is -why would you pay a higher rate to lease? Answer- for the option to not hassle with selling at end of the lease. Otherwise, comes down to the best interest rate. Also recall BMW has fees with leasing that increase leasing cost.

When you lease, you are essentially paying for 30% of the car. I have NEVER seen a finance that gives you 70% off the vehicle. $40,000+ vehicle would be A LOT more a month than the $469 I pay right now. No matter what finance deal I got, unless I put down a HUGE chunk...

I have, however, been able to convince my wife that the difference in price I pay for my cars, over and above the cost of a Honda Accord, is an entertainment cost, not an investment.
+1
And my wife says I need to do what makes me happy since I live in the car 10-12 hours a week - the 335i is a welcome enjoyment.

interesting points made. I have also heard that you lease your daily driver and buy your garage queen...

I work out of my house and dont rack up many miles, I'll just skip over the economic chest-beating portion of this thread and say that I also dont know what I will want to do in 3 years so at the end of my lease I may buy it out or may be happy to give it back - I'll know then, I dont know now.

Again, why is it that no one uses OC? I'm baffled after reading some of these pro lease, pro buy arguments. Why not use OC and get the best of both?

At the end of the day, there are probably too many points to take into consideration between leasing and buying. Most people will (correctly) tell you never to buy anything that depreciates if you have the option to lease/rent it. However, the lifestyle choices have to be considered too -- will you modify the car, is it hobby, will you drive too much or too little each year, etc.

I decided to lease the 335i -- largely because it made financial sense (money will make more elsewhere), and because it's a brand new car with no track record for reliability on the TT engine.

But remember, as people have been pointing out, a lease is simply a pre-negotiated sale in 3 years. You're gambling against the bank when you choose to buy as to what your car will be worth with a given amount of mileage in the same time-frame. If you believe you can forecast better odds (meaning, you believe the car will be worth more than they do), then you buy.

I think the only thing we've seen in common here is the general rule to pay over time when available -- either leasing or financing will do the job. Never put large chunks of money in someone else's bank account when it can be in yours. You can put your money in a savings account or CD these days and beat the interest rate on a lease (5%), no less if you do some homework or put it in general market funds -- the market averages 8% - 10% per year returns.

paid $43500 for my 328i, all options so loaded. Paid $2000K down and $600 mo for 36 mo, may 12K mi/yr.
I have never leased and swore I never would. But to have this nice of car for that, and know I can trade it in or purchase it at lease end, just figured I'd lease and decide later what to do. That's alot of car for $600 mo for just 3 yrs

Again, why is it that no one uses OC? I'm baffled after reading some of these pro lease, pro buy arguments. Why not use OC and get the best of both?

Socrates, is Owners Choice (OC) an synonym for BWM Select, you know, the balloon payment plan? My very rudimentary understanding is that those types of plans are more advantageous in states like Texas where you get taxed and the lease payments and the cost of the overall cost of the vehicle (did I say my understanding is rudimentary- correct me if I'm wrong). Anyway, I live in Florida where we only get taxed on the monthly payments in a lease. I've asked two dealers here about the BMW Select plan. The first flat out lied to me and told me it was only available in Texas. The second looked at me like I had trees growing out my head and asked, "why would you want to do that? It doesn't make sense." He also said that his dealership had never sold a car using that plan. He then ran some numbers and explained that I would have to pay taxes on either the monthly payments or the downpayment (don't recall which). At the end of the terms I would be REQUIRED to buy the car and pay taxes on the new purchase price. He might have been blowing smoke up my you know what but it didn't make sense. If you know where I or anyone else on this forum can get more educated on that option please point us in that direction.

The other thing to consider is that I've recently become educated on things like MF and residual values. This has helped me understand how these things affect your overall cost of a lease. I don't know what factors into the cost of the BMW Select plan.

FWIW, I've always bought my cars (finance). This time I was going to put about 15k-20k down and finance the rest. However, as I run the numbers and understand I no longer want to keep my cars for 10 years, I've decided to lease. But if I'm able to get educated on the BMW Select/OC plan I'll go that route with perhaps a downpayment as much as 20k if that makes sense.