For an E36 M3, 3200lbs, stock brakes & 350+ hp, coilover 2.5" race springs & shocks. I want a track pad only for DE with 30 minute run groups, with minimal dust or will easily wash off if left on the car for a few weeks. I hated my Hawk Blacks because they needed a professional detailer to get the brake dust off & they made my wheels look like sht. It rains a lot here & I wont have a chance to wash the car right after a track day.

I had good luck with Porterfield R4 pads. No problems with the dust. They don't stop as good as the Hawk HT-10s I've been using though. I haven't had much problem with the HT-10 dust either. Seems to wash off pretty well.

Just bedded in a set of HT-14s for the front. Can't wait to get them on track. They seem better than the HT-10s.

Jay

Carbotech XP work well for me. Depending on your level xp10 will work well for advanced HPDE and xp12 for race speed advance with your weight. Be sure to run proper fluid as these pads can handle very high temps and will cook all but the best fluid. ATE super blue or better. This assumes you are using DOT-R or better tires. These pads will likely over heat a street tire as they will far out perform a street rubber compound.

Yes, I'll be on DOT R tires.

don't want to steal the thread, but would HP plus pads out perform street tires?

hey wes, i'm skeptical about finding a track pad that can last 30 min sessions whose dust will easily wash off after sitting a few wks =).

my exp w/ street tires (kumho mx) and hp+ and blue 9012 (both in front):
they can fade on a stu (~255 bhp, suspension) m3 so i now run hawk dtc in front

I was able to destroy HP+ with 20 min sessions on a 2600lb 325is with 250hp or so. They are great if you don't drive the car tooo hard, probably just fine for your first track event (or first few).

Been running HT10's on my M3 and 325is and have been happy with them. If you do not bed them in properly you WILL get deposits and a nasty vibration. Heck, they aren't even THAT bad on the street if you are lazy like me and dont change them out.

I have had no problems getting the HT-10s to wash off after a few weeks, including rain excursions. The HT-14s seem to be just as easy on the wheels and paint as the HT-10s.

As you notice from many folks' comments on the track forum, HT-10s are a well loved pad for general HPDE/open track use for the stock E36 M3 brake system. You will be hard pressed to find an E36 M3 owner that has a lot of bad things to say about these pads.

I would excerise caution recommending Carbotechs and our stock brake systems though. I ran their race compounds on the track for several years, finally ending with either their XP9 or Xp10 pads, can't remember now which one. The torque curve just wasn't there for me compared with HT-10s and I was experiencing fade 15-20 min into a hard session when ambient temps were above 85 deg, even with full ducting and only 235 width front tires.

For my money, HT-10s were a better pad than the Carbotechs so I stopped buying the Carbotechs. Of course now a few years later, they continue to evolve their racing compounds, so I can't speak for the XP12's. On the positive side, the carbotechs were a better street pad getting the car to and from the track while towing my tire trailer vs the HT-10s :cool

If you are going to trailer the car or change pads at the track then Hawks are the way to go. If you want to drive back an forth then it is Carbotech for sure. I have had both and while the Hawk 10s are better brake pads you will kill them and your rotors quickly if you drive back and forth on them cold. I would wear more pad in the back and forth than at the track. The Carbotechs are probably 9/10ths the pad a hawk is with a significantly lower initial bite. But you can drive back and forth with them all day long and not see any cold wear of the pad or rotor. Since I still drive back and forth I use the Carbotechs. The XP10s do just fine at CMP in SC which is a notorious hard braking track then I can stuff everything back in the car and drive home. I run an E36 sedan that is a JP level car(less cams) with E46 330 brakes and ducts. I am an extremely late and hard braker and I trail a lot.

Overall just depends on your needs.

Yea I wanna drive with the race pads back & forth to the track. And they may get driven on the street for up to a week before I swap them out in my garage. That was the problem with the Hawk blacks, when driven on the street they ate my rotors in no time.

So maybe I should be considering the Carbotech XP12. Where's the best prices for them others have found?

Yea I wanna drive with the race pads back & forth to the track. And they may get driven on the street for up to a week before I swap them out in my garage. That was the problem with the Hawk blacks, when driven on the street they ate my rotors in no time.

So maybe I should be considering the Carbotech XP12. Where's the best prices for them others have found?

www.brakeswap.com :buttrock

I had good luck with Porterfield R4 pads. No problems with the dust. They don't stop as good as the Hawk HT-10s I've been using though. I haven't had much problem with the HT-10 dust either. Seems to wash off pretty well.

Just bedded in a set of HT-14s for the front. Can't wait to get them on track. They seem better than the HT-10s.

Jay

I had huge problems with the porterfield's.

The Carbotechs are generally pretty good on dust. They now have a XP16 compound, however, you should probably only be using Rcomps with them.

I had huge problems with the porterfield's.

Ditto!!! They're okay to start out on, but I've gone back and tried them again and completely despised them.

The Cobalt SpecVRs were the ultimate pad for leaving on the car, IMHO. Worked perfectly when cold and didn't dust much. Worked great on track too! I have no experience with the new compounds they've phased in, however.

Yea I wanna drive with the race pads back & forth to the track. And they may get driven on the street for up to a week before I swap them out in my garage. That was the problem with the Hawk blacks, when driven on the street they ate my rotors in no time.

So maybe I should be considering the Carbotech XP12. Where's the best prices for them others have found?

Both my wife and I still drive our dedicated track cars to events and neither of us have had a big problem driving HT-10s on the street back and forth from the track, even with me towing my tire trailer. But our track cars are not street cars and so the only street time they see is to and from the track. HT-10s are too harsh cold to keep them on a dual duty car for a week of street use. As stated before, you will be throwing a lot of money away on wasted pad and rotor life with extended street use, not recommended.

i use to get my pads from directly from carbotech. They used to give a BMWCCA racer discount if you asked for it.

I drive to DE's on my HT-10s without any issue. I did get brake dust deposits on my wheels after using the HT-10s. It rained on the way home and I negelected to wash my wheels until a week after the event. I will need to get my wheels detailed to get the deposits off. Now I make sure to wash the wheels once I get home. Only takes a few minutes.

PFC01's... dust washes right off (unlike the 97's which are a PITA to get the dust off especially if it's gotten wet).

I have had great luck with the Pagid ceremic compounds (RS-14, RS-15, & RS-19). The dust cleans off as easy as an EBC pad and some of the more aggressive compounds are similar to the HT-10s but maybe not as much initial bite. I did find the Pagids to be FAR more sensitive to bedding than either Hawk Blues or HT-10s.

From what I have read it seems that if I am driving to and from the track, and want a good capable pad I need to look at the either the HT-10 or the Carbotech XP10. For those that are running those pads, do you use the same ones all around or do you put something less aggressive in the rear? It seems the only concerns are street driving when cold because they are too harsh, is that correct? I have a 97 M3 that is basically stock. It is not my daily driver, it is used mainly for track stuff.

For an E36 M3, 3200lbs, stock brakes & 350+ hp, coilover 2.5" race springs & shocks. I want a track pad only for DE with 30 minute run groups, with minimal dust or will easily wash off if left on the car for a few weeks. I hated my Hawk Blacks because they needed a professional detailer to get the brake dust off & they made my wheels look like sht. It rains a lot here & I wont have a chance to wash the car right after a track day.

I think the Pagid Orange would work great for this. They are a medium aggressive track pad and still somewhat streetable. They do dust a decent amount but it washes right off. Let me know if we can help you out.

Carbotech XP10's on a 3000# E46 M3

CMP moderately hard on brakes 4 days HPDE
Roebling Road HPDE 4 days easy on brakes

Finally need new pads. Great street pads as well so they are dual purpose. Easy on Rotors and dust washes off.

Peter

From what I have read it seems that if I am driving to and from the track, and want a good capable pad I need to look at the either the HT-10 or the Carbotech XP10. For those that are running those pads, do you use the same ones all around or do you put something less aggressive in the rear? It seems the only concerns are street driving when cold because they are too harsh, is that correct? I have a 97 M3 that is basically stock. It is not my daily driver, it is used mainly for track stuff.
XP10 on front blend well with XP8 in back. If you find you are smearing the 8 then go to 10 but very unlikely the 8s in back will give you a problem.

I'm confident this will work well for your needs.

BTW. ducting some air to the front rotors will add hours to the track life of the pad. Ducts can be found for not too bad of a price and you will return your investment quickly by reducing how often you replace pads. The ducts will also improves performace. Block off the ducts on the street if you use the Carbo pad there.