I've been looking into performing an engine swap in an E46 M3, the engine I would like to use is a LS1. I don't forsee fitment or mechanics to be an issue, however, other knowledgeable people I have asked all point out that eclectronics will be an issue as they have essentially cockblocked other v8 swaps in E46's in the past. It seems the biggest issue has something to do with the ASC / ABS, although there could be others as well. I have heard of some people not being able to rev engines past 5000 rpm postswap. If you have any information, tips, referrals, or any thoughts, I would really appreciate it. Thanks.

Well I will input a thought.

The s54 engine has won an immense amount of awards, it is by far the best engine I have ever owned by the ease and agility of it. No reason whatsoever to exchange this engine for a lower revving domestic v8. That would also probably throw off the near close 49/51 ratio on the car.

Why would an engine swap mess with ACS and ABS, those both have nothing to do with the engine.

If you want more power, try an AA S/C.

Wasnt it hamann that put a V8 in there already?

Well I will input a thought.

The s54 engine has won an immense amount of awards, it is by far the best engine I have ever owned by the ease and agility of it. No reason whatsoever to exchange this engine for a lower revving domestic v8. That would also probably throw off the near close 49/51 ratio on the car.

Why would an engine swap mess with ACS and ABS, those both have nothing to do with the engine.

If you want more power, try an AA S/C.

You are correct....the LS1 is significantly lighter and offers better HP/TQ why bother? :rolleyes

That's why I designated it as thought. Opinionated preferences are a mainstay on this forum. Thanks.

You are correct....the LS1 is significantly lighter and offers better HP/TQ why bother? :rolleyes

Slightly biased there Brendon....coughAStockCorvettecough....;)

Why would an engine swap mess with ACS and ABS, those both have nothing to do with the engine.




UMMM, the wiring harness. :confused

a co-sax player that i know dropped a LS1 into a e36 wide body m3.....however, he ripped EVERYTHING out of the car, pretty much if it had wires, it was gone...and this is also his track car.....as far as everytday driver goes...might be a bit more difficult...

UMMM, the wiring harness. :confused

Pardon my naivety.

Wasnt it hamann that put a V8 in there already?
Hartge did it with the H50...e46 M3 with the e39 M5 v8... Hartge first did it with a regular 3 series coupe then figured the M3 was better suited for the v8 w its wider track, etc... Im sure there are vids on youtube.com of it its a beast

Here you go....

Some one in the Z3 subforum has done it....


http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=609914

:eek: :eek:

Forgive my ignorance, but why the hell would anyone want to put an American GM V8 inside of a BMW. That has got to be the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard.

If you want a car with a Corvette engine why didn't you go with a new GTO or *shock* a Corvette.

Cars: 2000 Trans Am, 2002 M3


maybe his trans am is crashed, and his m3 motor is toast?

makes the most sense i guess-- build 1 working car out of two broken ones? :P

The cost of putting the LS1 into the M3 would be greater than just selling the LS1 and getting a new M3 engine.

the LT1 and LS1 swaps are a common swap because of their weight to power ratio. These are easily boosted motors, and when i say boosted i mean they get big numbers from small mods. Almost every car out there has had someone squeazing an LT1 or LS1 into it.

The Hamann car had a modified BMW V8 from the X5 for it's powerplant. If possible...money no object of course, why not shoot for the M5's V8? The very same that was in the short lived E46 M3 GTR (street).

C.

Yeah but do it to a GM car don't go throughing it in a BMW. That or for the sake of all BMWs around the world take off your roundels.

Forgive my ignorance, but why the hell would anyone want to put an American GM V8 inside of a BMW. That has got to be the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard.

If you want a car with a Corvette engine why didn't you go with a new GTO or *shock* a Corvette.


as my teacher said to me, 'im putting the LS1 in because its lighter, and makes a lot of hp..."

keep in mind he also has the money to do so...

Yeah but do it to a GM car don't go throughing it in a BMW. That or for the sake of all BMWs around the world take off your roundels.

^ Do it to an American car not a European car.

Wouldn't this be called "Redneckin' a BMW?" Kind of oxymoron?

An engine having been on the 10 Best Engine List (of the world) (Top 5) for the last 6 years ought to say something for the engineering/design.

I think when it comes to tracking your car, heavily...money can go pretty quick. Putting in a domestic motor that costs less to maintain and less to modify is not that bad of an idea. The LS1 and LT1 motors can make huge power for little money. The price you pay for an exhaust setup for your e46 M3 to get you roughly 18 whp would translate to an additional 80 whp on the Domestic motors in question for the same money.

So I guess it comes down to what the car is used for. I am a purist and would not put a domestic motor in any of my bimmers. But I know a guy that tracks is e36 M3 like crazy, he first had an S50, blew that, then went to a V8 4.4 out of an e39, blew that, rebuilt it, blew it again and finally went to a newer 4.4 V8 and those 2 BMW V8s cost a ton to get to fit, work, custom exhaust headers, tubes, TEC3, etc. The tranny needed to be replaced, tons of money and it still made a little more power than an S54. The next logical step in my mind was for him to drop an S54 motor into it. I went to see the car a month or so later, and sitting next to it was an LS1 prepped motor. That motor has made his car unstoppable, and when issues come up, they are half the price and fixed in half the time.

So my point is yes, I'd say stick with a bimmer motor if your car is for the street or you want to remain a purist. But after spending money and stressing over multiple blown bimmer motors and how to replace it because you have to make it to nationals and an S54 can cost $18k....give me a vette motor and call it a day.

It's an endless (and pointless) argument. It gets rehashed regularly on Porsche boards - both 911s and 944s have been thusly modified. Some people get all indignant about it from a purist POV. I find it less offensive than some pimpin' cosmetic mods. I personally wouldn't do it, but there are some good reasons for doing it, and that hopped up roadster defininetly gave me a woody! :eek:

Stef

Looks like everyone has an opinion, but no one has given you any useful advice or experience, and neither can I. But my opinion, after owning a ZO6, a small block Chevy, properly tuned, makes any car better. Sure the s54 is a fine motor, but if your goal is to get a lot of hp for the least expense, the LS1will sure do the job. But, that's just comparing the two motors. Getting a nice, streetable conversion accomplished is probably going to cost a ton, and the process will likely involve more problems and frustration than you could ever predict. If it is something you can tackle as a long term hobby, and can afford to spend at least twice your estimated budget, go for it! Just recognize it will be a money pit, and the car may have almost no market value in spite of your accomplishment.

Sorry I was away and couldn't follow the discussion. Ok, here's some reasoning.

The ls1 easily fits in the E36 engine bay which happens to be narrower, so I percieve no problems there. I get 450 hp and around 25 highway mpg out of my current N/A LS1 with under 3 grand put into it. I also love the sound. Physically putting the engine in an E46 is not an issue. I have known two others who have attempted it, but both failed as a result of electronics no longer allowing the engines to rev above 5k rpm!??! There are days I question technology.

As far as the touted 51/49 balance, the LS1 conversion only adds 14 pounds and can be mounted both further back in the engine compartment as well as lower than the current V6 due to it's compact dimensions and mounting points. As a result it more than compensates for any weight it would add to the front end. The reasons variations of this "crappy gm motor" has been in the top ten engines in the world consistantly over the past decade as opposed to BMW and Porsche motors are its incredible light weight, compact size, and high torque and hp #'s as well as time tested reliability. It is an aluminum block V8 and is highly versatile hence why every form of car seems to have had an ls1 dropped in it by an entrepreneurial spirit as some point. Are there tradeoffs between the BMW v6 and the ls1? Yes, I will surely miss the high redline. Will I pull out of corners with improved smoothness due to low end torque and smoke the tires from a 50 mph role with modded 450 hp N/A ls1 like the one in my T/A? For sure. I also appreciate the nasty sound of a smallblock V8. I believe that the build quality of American cars can tend to be inferior in every category but V8 engines, which I feel are vastly superior IMO. The M5 V8 weighs more, has an almost identical redline and gets approximately the same hp while having less torque and costing more money in addition to actually being a larger engine. Gee, where can I stand in line to get my hands on one of those baby's? Not to mention cost of maintainance. I mean, I'm fielding questions from people who ask why an engine swap would affect the ASC / ABS, etc.; while they pretending to have vastly superior reasoning skills on their quest to educate my redneck self from Philadelphia. Some of them should wait until they understand what's going on under their hood before they tell me what to do with what's under mine. I came here seeking some EDUCATED input. Guess I should look elsewhere and leave you guys to your wine coolers.

....and leave you guys to your wine coolers.

:buttrock

Sorry I was away and couldn't follow the discussion. Ok, here's some reasoning.

The ls1 easily fits in the E36 engine bay which happens to be narrower, so I percieve no problems there. I get 450 hp and around 25 highway mpg out of my current N/A LS1 with under 3 grand put into it. I also love the sound. Physically putting the engine in an E46 is not an issue. I have known two others who have attempted it, but both failed as a result of electronics no longer allowing the engines to rev above 5k rpm!??! There are days I question technology.

As far as the touted 51/49 balance, the LS1 conversion only adds 14 pounds and can be mounted both further back in the engine compartment as well as lower than the current V6 due to it's compact dimensions and mounting points. As a result it more than compensates for any weight it would add to the front end. The reasons variations of this "crappy gm motor" has been in the top ten engines in the world consistantly over the past decade as opposed to BMW and Porsche motors are its incredible light weight, compact size, and high torque and hp #'s as well as time tested reliability. It is an aluminum block V8 and is highly versatile hence why every form of car seems to have had an ls1 dropped in it by an entrepreneurial spirit as some point. Are there tradeoffs between the BMW v6 and the ls1? Yes, I will surely miss the high redline. Will I pull out of corners with improved smoothness due to low end torque and smoke the tires from a 50 mph role with modded 450 hp N/A ls1 like the one in my T/A? For sure. I also appreciate the nasty sound of a smallblock V8. I believe that the build quality of American cars can tend to be inferior in every category but V8 engines, which I feel are vastly superior IMO. The M5 V8 weighs more, has an almost identical redline and gets approximately the same hp while having less torque and costing more money in addition to actually being a larger engine. Gee, where can I stand in line to get my hands on one of those baby's? Not to mention cost of maintainance. I mean, I'm fielding questions from people who ask why an engine swap would affect the ASC / ABS, etc.; while they pretending to have vastly superior reasoning skills on their quest to educate my redneck self from Philadelphia. Some of them should wait until they understand what's going on under their hood before they tell me what to do with what's under mine. I came here seeking some EDUCATED input. Guess I should look elsewhere and leave you guys to your wine coolers.
You sure you own an M3? Because you keep calling it a V6 when it's an inline 6. That's why it's longer than a V8. And again if you want a car with the LS1 in it get a Corvette. They are more than track capable. Oh and I don't drink wine coolers, I drink margaritas. :rolleyes

...Are there tradeoffs between the BMW v6 and the ls1?

Uh...Mr. Wine Cooler. The E46 M3 has an inline 6. And the comments were coming from a purist's point of view. If you could not repsect that, go elsewhere. Comments like yours are not needed here.

You ask a bunch of BMW nuts if they want a GM powerplant in their cars. Honestly...what do you expect? Go ask some of the guys in Corvetteforums if they would like to put a Lotus Twin turbo V8 in their cars....the reaction would likely be the same.

Each to their own.

Personally speaking...I am driving my "BMW v6" until it explodes. When it does, I am dropping a modified V8 from the 5 series / X5 - not M5 (much cheaper BTW). Hell, I might even supercharge her. yep...that's my plan, and I am sticking to it.

Other than that...

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e195/Chadsm3/vote.jpg

My mistake, "v6" slipped out there, other than one misphrasing, in one long paragraph, noone has any other point to refute. Secondly, Anavel0, you were too busy pointing out my mistep to notice your own ignorance. "And again if you want a car with a LS1 in it, get a corvette." Look at my profile, I already have a 2000TA, what do you think that has? Hence my eagerness to spread the LS1 love around the garage. And you guys talk about me not respecting the "purists point of view." I am fine with the purist point of view until I start a thread asking for technical advice about an engine swap and they feel it necessary to hijack it with no mechanical know how and a need to rip on my personal decision to do a simple engine swap. I clearly have already thought it through and I don't need people coming onto a thread I started about a project that is going to happen like it or not and smearing on American v8's, etc. You guys make an engine swap sound like genocide. I just tend not to see the difference between a swapping a BMW V8 into an M3 and a GM V8 in an M3. Both engines foreign to those cars, so in those terms, I figure pick your engine based on preference and go with it. ChadsM3, rather than ripping on this thread, you should be embracing it because if you're actually serious about doing a V8 swap, this thread could be useful to you if people would actually post some suggestions rather than opinions. Take a look at my first post, I never invited this flame war.

Philly..

Read here:

Hartge V8 M3 (http://germancarscene.com/2006/07/28/hartge-supercharged-v8-bmw-m3/)

Swap in a ls1 into a e46m3 please. I hate those cars... their really isnt anything special about them.

Philly does have a point about the LS1. It is a great engine and I dont know about any of you guys but the E92 will be bringing out a V8 and I wouldnt be suprised if we see some similarities between it and the LS1. Granted it is supposed to be identical to the V10 in the new M5 minus 2 cylinders. I wouldnt be suprised if it is also and aluminum engine. Also the benefits to using the LS1 are great. Its easy to fix, lower compression ratio = better for boost, quality motor. I wouldnt say he would be trading down in any way by going to the LS1.
Also If anything a purist is a person who wants the best car and is not biased upon one type of vehicle. I am sorry but if you think BMW is god amongst cars then you need to look at all their vehicles. I mean the X3 has to be the biggest pos ever. Or how about the X5 3.0 also the 2.5 Z4 was a flop.
If he is looking for a great track car than the M3 with a LS1 in it would be mind boggling. I mean the handling properties of the M3 are great and the upgrades are endless. And with the LS1 the power is also endless.

Uh...Mr. Wine Cooler. The E46 M3 has an inline 6. And the comments were coming from a purist's point of view. If you could not repsect that, go elsewhere. Comments like yours are not needed here.

You ask a bunch of BMW nuts if they want a GM powerplant in their cars. Honestly...what do you expect? Go ask some of the guys in Corvetteforums if they would like to put a Lotus Twin turbo V8 in their cars....the reaction would likely be the same.

Each to their own.

Personally speaking...I am driving my "BMW v6" until it explodes. When it does, I am dropping a modified V8 from the 5 series / X5 - not M5 (much cheaper BTW). Hell, I might even supercharge her. yep...that's my plan, and I am sticking to it.

Other than that...

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e195/Chadsm3/vote.jpg
QFT +1

My mistake, "v6" slipped out there, other than one misphrasing, in one long paragraph, noone has any other point to refute. Secondly, Anavel0, you were too busy pointing out my mistep to notice your own ignorance. "And again if you want a car with a LS1 in it, get a corvette." Look at my profile, I already have a 2000TA, what do you think that has? Hence my eagerness to spread the LS1 love around the garage. And you guys talk about me not respecting the "purists point of view." I am fine with the purist point of view until I start a thread asking for technical advice about an engine swap and they feel it necessary to hijack it with no mechanical know how and a need to rip on my personal decision to do a simple engine swap. I clearly have already thought it through and I don't need people coming onto a thread I started about a project that is going to happen like it or not and smearing on American v8's, etc. You guys make an engine swap sound like genocide. I just tend not to see the difference between a swapping a BMW V8 into an M3 and a GM V8 in an M3. Both engines foreign to those cars, so in those terms, I figure pick your engine based on preference and go with it. ChadsM3, rather than ripping on this thread, you should be embracing it because if you're actually serious about doing a V8 swap, this thread could be useful to you if people would actually post some suggestions rather than opinions. Take a look at my first post, I never invited this flame war.
Again if you want to track race get a Corvette, if you want to drag race just keep the Trans Am. Oh and TA is trademarked for Dodge(Dodge Challenger T/A), so you own a Trans Am. But I'm sure you already knew that. Have a nice day! :thumbdown

Egos run amuck; next, we'll be measuring things.

...I dont know about any of you guys but the E92 will be bringing out a V8 and I wouldnt be suprised if we see some similarities between it and the LS1.

I guarantee, it's not a pushrod V8. Any bets? :stickoutt

C.

I can understand your interest in wanting to install an Ls1 in your M3 and think it would bet an excellent swap if it is possible. I really don't understand how the BMW's electronics could prevent it from spinning more than 5k rpm. If your using an LS1 motor, you would be using an LS1 ECU and wiring harness, thus eliminating all of BMW's control over the engine speed. However, I believe the M3 to have a drive by wire throttle setup, so you would have to fab a gas pedal or at least some type of linkage system. I doubt the ASC system would work as it should unless you found a way to replicate what ever signal it currently gets from the DME, but who cares about traction control. With the ABS, you would have to find out whether or not it recieves a signal from the DME (e.g. engine speed, on/off, road speed, etc..). Again, I would just eliminate the ABS system all together and replace it with a bypass block.
I agree that the s54 is an amazing powerplant, but some of us want 10 second pump gas cars. NO ONE is even close to offering that now. The Horse Power Freaks kit is a huge break through, but how many of us want to spend $8 a gallon so we can run 11 pounds all day? And also, you could get a fully programable ECU for the LS1 for ~$1000, and have it tuned anywhere. There are few places in the nation I would trust my $12k S54 setup to be tuned by, and the difficulty in reading codes and fixing MIL problems is ludacris. The difference in parts cost and aftermarket support between the S54 and LS1 is laughable.
I personally desire a 4 seat convertible that feels well crafted, is good looking, and handles well. This eliminates all american cars PERIOD. So what are you left with? The CLK-55 (automatic only=no thanks), SC430 (a good prospect, there are some TT'ed ones making ~700 rw, but again; automatic), and the E46 M3 (which has the most tasteful interior/exterior of ANY car even remotely in its class). I personally just wish it had more power potential, ~500 rwhp on 93, and possibly some positive manifold pressure. Also, not many indy shops have a MoDic unit and having a modified car serviced by the dealership SUCKS!!! It isn't their typical protocal so they have difficulties with diagnostics, charge more in labor, and often ignore customer input unless you speak directly with the tech.
I am 100% in favor of someone in the persuit of more power reqardless of details. The more relible and inexpensive, the better. If someone actually has installed a non-BMW motor in an E46, I would like to see it. My personal interest would be to build a lower comp s54, boost it, and find a different engine mangement system. But if that is much more costly than a boosted LS1 swap, I'll take the latter.

please do not cut the balls off your poor M3.Sell it and buy a 328 because you basically want to take out what makes your car an M3

or why dont you just throw on a AA stage 2 supercharger,They make close to 400 at the wheels and you will prolly spend less money this way.

how much do you want for the engine anyway?

MY bro wants to do an e30 project car

IF you're really serious about dropping a V8 into an M3 than there is only one company in the US I would trut to do it. Fall-Line Motorsports in Chicago (www.fall-linemotorsports.com).

They have done several E39 M5 engines swaps into M3's for both street and track use and are currently dropping the M5 V8 into a Z4 M coupe. There is no way I'd even want to attempt an LS1 conversion the cost to get the electronics to work would double the total project costs. The M5 engine is relatively simple in comparison. I've been in their race version of the car and it's ridiculous. (http://www.fall-linemotorsports.com/pictures/E46M3V8-/index.html)

I started the E36 LS1 thread so I obviously support this idea.

Purists hate it, most other reasons for hating is due to ignorance.

The fact is, the LS1 weighs less, puts out more power stock, has many more mods that are cheaper and carb legal (even for cali)....

Swap in a ls1 into a e46m3 please. I hate those cars... their really isnt anything special about them.

you hate e46m3's and there is nothing special?!? sense some Mvy :rolleyes you're an idiot if you think there is nothing special about ANY M car...

to the OP you will spend less probably buying the new turbo kit that is coming out for the e46m3 and it would own a 450hp ls1..but thats what i would do if i had a lot of money to waste on an M3...an ls1 in an m3 would be unique though as im sure thats a huge factor in you doing it..because even though power is easier to come by on the ls1 the amount of money to do the swap plus the cost of mods for hte ls1 is way greater than modding the current s54 into 500 hp monster

e to ignorance.

The fact is, the LS1 weighs less, puts out more power stock, has many more mods that are cheaper and carb legal (even for cali)....

I don't hate it, I just don't see it being a doable project. Ls1 crate engines range from $8000 for 390 hp to $15,000 for 530 HP give or take. Now, you've probably got another $8000 in labor just to drop a motor in. This being a Chevy you have to factor in the cost of figuring out how to make it play nice with the tranny. At $90/hr that could cost god only knows. Once they get the trans to play nice now you've got two separate computer systems that need to be sorted out. The only way I can think of is to go to a completely custom stand alone software solution so you'll be buying a motec and paying someone to write code for it.

The project is easily $50,000 and that could be the low end if anything proves to be a REAL challenge. Why bother with it at all when the 2007 M3 will have a V8?

Hers a little reminder of what your driving

As multi-talented as any M Car is, its heart is always the engine. Under the M3’s domed hood, then, is an engine like none other. In its broad concept, the M3 engine, designated the S54 [2], shares its format with other BMW inline 6-cylinder engines. Virtually all of its engineering details, however, are unique and oriented to the very highest level of performance.

Given that other current BMW “sixes” have an aluminum block with cast-iron cylinder liners, it may be surprising that the S54 M3 engine has a cast-iron block. Why?

Compactness is the primary reason. An inline six is longer than a V-6, and BMW nurtures the inline layout because of its superior smoothness and sound. An aluminum block’s cylinder liners take up space; with liners it would not have been possible to achieve the engine’s 3.2-liter displacement without lengthening the block.

The second reason is strength. Given that this engine develops fully 333 hp from 3.2 liters – significantly over 100 hp per liter – its internal stresses are immense. According to M3 Project Director Siegfried Friedmann, BMW engineers researched a silicon-impregnated aluminum block (as used in BMW V-8 and V-12 engines), which would not require liners. They concluded that a cast-iron block could best sustain the engine’s high cylinder pressures and very high piston speed at maximum rpm. (Current Formula 1 engines reportedly attain piston speeds around 25 meters per second; with 24 m/sec. at its rpm limit of 8000 rpm, the S54 is quite close.)

The block accommodates the engine’s bore and stroke of 87.0 x 91.0 mm, up from the regular-production BMW 3.0-liter six’s 84.0 x 89.6 mm. However, playing much larger roles than increased displacement in the nearly 100-hp increase over the most powerful 3 Series engine are the M3 engine’s induction, combustion and exhaust engineering, together with its execution as a high-rpm engine. The starring role here is played by a cylinder head that could be termed “exotic.”

Tour de force: the cylinder head

Feature-by-feature, the cylinder head (of aluminum) joins exemplifies the tradition of BMW M cylinder heads. Its key features include:

Double VANOS steplessly variable valve timing. The S54 engine has stepless Double VANOS [3], which varies valve timing on the intake and exhaust camshafts. Though Double VANOS is employed in all other current BMW engines, as used in the M3 unit it varies timing over a wider range and contributes in a major way to the engine’s stratospheric power output.

VANOS pressure pump. The M3 VANOS system has its own radial-piston hydraulic pump; in regular-production BMW engines the main oil pump supplies the pressure to operate VANOS. Integral to the exhaust camshaft’s VANOS mechanism, the pump produces up to 120 bar (1740 lb./sq in.) of pressure. Herbert Vögele, who directs engine development at BMW M, explains that this high oil pressure enables the M3’s VANOS to vary valve timing more quickly at the very high rpm it reaches. Thus BMW M refers to the M3’s VANOS system as High-Pressure Double VANOS.

Unique valve mechanism. Regular-production BMW 6-cylinder engines employ bucket-type hydraulic lifters, actuating the valves directly with minimum noise and no periodic adjustment. For an engine with the S54’s rpm potential, BMW M engineers needed less reciprocating mass.

To achieve this, they created a different actuating mechanism, using finger-type rocker arms. Pivoting on their own shafts (one on the intake side, one on the exhaust), these small arms reach out to provide the actuating surface between camshaft and valve. As the entire arm does not move the distance of valve lift, its effective reciprocating mass is less than its actual mass – and it weighs less than the “bucket tappets” in the first place. When all is said and done, the effective mass is 30% less; in turn, this allows lighter valve springs, which further reduce inertia. The system also has less friction.

As there is no hydraulic maintenance of valve clearance, it does have to be inspected periodically. Lead engine engineer Helmut Himmel asserts that it is unlikely that clearance will ever require adjustment, but if so it is done with shims (tiny metal discs of various thickness) without removing the camshafts.

Whereas the “regular” 6-cylinder engines have a simplex (single) primary chain driving the exhaust camshaft and a smaller secondary chain driving the intake camshaft from there, the S54 has a full duplex (double) chain driving both camshafts directly. As usual with BMW engines, the chain is hydraulically tensioned and needs no periodic adjustment or replacement.

Extra-high compression ratio. At 11.5:1, the M3 engine has the highest ratio in current BMW production. (The 760Li’s V-12 engine comes close with 11.3:1.)

Machined surfaces. “Engineering finery”: The combustion chambers and intake ports are completely machined, for smoothness that facilitates airflow. The exhaust ports are partially machined. For durability, the valve seats are of especially hard steel. A 3-layer stainless-steel head gasket ensures effective sealing of the head to the block.

Head casting and sealing. Extreme strength in the cylinder head is achieved by making it a single aluminum casting. Though more difficult to realize than the previous European engine’s 2-piece head casting, this construction also saves a significant 29 lb. And as this weight reduction is at the top of the engine, it helps lower the car’s center of gravity.

Induction system:
BMW M tradition, state-of-the-art technology

The M3 manifests an important BMW M tradition: an individual throttle for each cylinder. Positioned much nearer to the cylinders than a single throttle can be, these bring atmospheric pressure practically right to the cylinder. The “lag time” inherent in airflow into the cylinders is thus greatly reduced and the engine can react more quickly to throttle movements.

In the M3 system of electronically controlled individual throttles, all six throttles operate from a single shaft, each in its own throttle body right at the intake ports. Via the accelerator pedal and its two potentiometers, the driver gives the commands, which in turn are processed by the engine control module and received by a DC servo motor. The motor drives the throttle shaft through a tiny gearbox.

Upstream of the throttle bodies are the six intake trumpets, made of weight-efficient fiberglass-reinforced PA6 thermoplastic; these are laser-welded into the induction plenum of the same material to form a single assembly.

M Dynamic Driving Control provides Normal and Sport settings for throttle response. In Sport, selected via a console switch, the ratio of throttle opening to pedal movement is increased so that apparent engine response is even quicker. Even the transitional response of the electronic engine controls is altered to suit. Drivers tend to find one or the other setting more to their liking, or choose them according to driving conditions or mood. The system always reverts to Normal when the engine is started.

Together with the stepless VANOS, this elaborate induction system adds to the engine’s immense breathing and fuel/air processing capabilities.

Exhaust system:
engineered for free flow

The M engine team led by Messrs. Vögele and Himmel developed one of the freest-flowing exhaust systems ever installed in a production vehicle. After the partially machined exhaust ports, it begins with two elaborately snaking stainless-steel headers serving three cylinders each.

These headers are formed under high pressure with water inside them, which ensures an even distribution of the forming pressure and thus consistent wall thickness. In turn, this process allows stainless-steel walls only 1 mm thick (about 1/25th of an inch), not only helping save weight but also hastening engine warmup as there is less metal to heat up after a cold start.

Each header is a single piece, thus not welded-up as are most headers.

In one of the few differences between the U.S. and European versions of this engine, whereas the Euro model’s converters are under the floorpan, in the U.S. version engine each header also includes the catalytic converter. This puts the catalysts closer to the engine, improving emission control when the engine is started from cold and meeting more stringent U.S. regulations in this regard. Four Lambda (oxygen) sensors are employed; the engine complies with U.S. LEV (Low Emissions Vehicle) limits.

From the catalytic converters rearward, the exhaust system continues as a true dual system through a large, L-shaped muffler/resonator and four polished outlets that speak the authoritative tones of M Power. This elaborate and efficient exhaust system imposes fully 40% less back pressure on the engine than that of its European-version predecessor, and of course this too contributes to the engine’s power output.

High-performance lubrication and cooling

To help ensure adequate lubrication under the high cornering, acceleration and braking loads the M3 attains, the S54 engine employs a “semi-dry-sump” oiling system. Particularly in hard cornering to the left, it is critical to ensure return of oil to the pan; therefore, integrated into the gear-type pressure pump is a scavenging pump that collects oil from the right side of the small forward oil sump and pumps it back into the main, larger rear sump. This rear sump is almost completely closed off from the rest of the system, and thus able to hold the oil necessary for lubrication throughout the engine. Specific return passages are also incorporated into the intake (left) side of the engine to help ensure ideal oil flow under all operating conditions.

The graphite-coated aluminum pistons are cooled by oil spray, and each valve rocker arm is sprayed with oil just as it is about to be loaded by its camshaft lobe.

A thermal sender monitors oil level and temperature. If the level drops low, a warning appears in the instrument cluster; the tachometer face includes the oil-temperature gauge.

The M3 cylinder head incorporates crossflow cooling; this promotes consistent temperatures from the front to the rear of the head, helping minimize distortion and wear under the extreme heat such a high-performance engine develops when its full power is being exploited.

The high-rpm concept

High engine speeds are essential to achieving such high power from moderate displacement, but they pose challenges; engineers must ensure that durability standards are met and that the engine performs properly at these levels. The M3 engine’s maximum power occurs just below its 8000-rpm limit at 7900 rpm.

To achieve the revving capability, the engineers applied a number of detail measures. A forged, nitro-carbonized steel crankshaft provides great strength in this critical component. Forged-steel “crack” connecting rods eliminate the need for bolt sleeves and thus reduce reciprocating weight.

Demonstrating just how many details can go into realizing the high-rpm concept, a unique water pump plays a role too. The crossflow cooling, essential to the high-speed operation, requires high coolant flow. To achieve this, the engineers developed a pump with 3-dimensionally contoured vanes. Such contours would have been inordinately costly to produce in metal, so BMW M developed a novel pump design. Each vane is a small plastic casting, pressed into an also-plastic rotor and then welded into place. Also adding cooling efficiency is a ring-type thermostat, which imposes less resistance to coolant flow than a conventional plate thermostat.

Electronics play their role too. BMW fully developed the S54’s control module: Manufactured by Siemens and called MS S54, this unit “can do everything, and do it fast,” as Helmut Himmel says. Every 6 degrees of crankshaft rotation, it calculates and adjusts the ignition and fuel injection at each cylinder individually. Ignition takes place through a very small-diameter “pencil” coil at each cylinder.

Spectacular results:
Power, torque, revs, performance, sound

All this major and detail engineering work results in a remarkable, high-performing, great-sounding sports engine. Powered by its 333 hp through the standard 6-speed manual transmission, the M3 coupe sprints from rest to 60 mph in a thrilling 4.8 seconds – same as the M5 – and continues on to an electronically limited maximum of 155 mph. In a March ’03 comparison test, Road & Track that “the M3’s engine possesses an uncannily smooth power delivery. Not only smooth, but also flexible, the M3’s six has a wide, usable powerband. Midrange punch is already good, but once above 4000 rpm, the engine adopts an even more menacing snarl as it pulls strongly right up to the redline.”

Great looks too:
the view under the hood

Following a long BMW M tradition of visually attractive machinery, the S54 engine’s appearance is as beautiful as its engineering. Tubing – for the idle air supply, fuel to the injectors, fuel from the fuel pump – is stainless steel. Housed in cast aluminum, the VANOS mechanism projects prominently forward of the cylinder head. Stainless-steel screws secure the camshaft cover. Chrome rings hold the induction trumpets to the ports. The “M” logo and a special M oil filler cap adorn the front of the camshaft cover.

M3 drivetrain:
getting S54 power to the road

Like every M Car to date, the M3 transmits its power to the road via classic rear-wheel drive [4]; the M3 packs some premium and fascinating engineering into its drivetrain.

6-speed manual transmission. Both M3s come standard with the robust and precise Getrag Type D 6-speed manual transmission, crisply controlled by a shift knob with illuminated shift pattern and M logo.

The transmission housing incorporates NACA air intakes which, together with careful aerodynamic design of the underbody, help keep internal transmission temperatures down; the engineers speak of 30°C (about 55°F) cooler oil than if these measures had not been taken.

Super-sized differential unit. Significant modification in the rear-suspension area, including an all-new subframe, has allowed equipping the M3 with the same heavy-duty differential dimensions as in the 394-hp M5, whose production recently ended. A special high-strength steel alloy, called 18CrNiMo7, is used for the differential gears to achieve superior quietness and durability. A relatively “short” final drive ratio, 3.64:1, exploits the engine’s generous torque and rpm range; the 6th gear keeps it humming moderately at cruising speeds. Here too, targeted airflow under the vehicle helps keep the oil cool, along with a ribbed differential case.

M Variable Differential Lock. Together with the German division of GKN Viscodrive, BMW M engineers developed a special mechanical limited-slip differential for the M3s.

The principal (and principle) difference between a traditional limited-slip “diff” and this M Variable Differential Lock is that the former senses torque, the latter senses wheel speed (rpm). Under dry to not-quite-dry road conditions, the traditional limited-slip has long enhanced the handling of sporty rear-wheel-drive BMWs; however, under slippery conditions, this differential type has limited ability to improve traction. On all current BMW models, electronic traction control addresses this issue.

The M Variable Differential Lock specifically addresses low- and split-traction situations in a way that reinforces sporty handling, imparting to the M3 a slippery-road ability no previous high-performance, rear-wheel-drive sports car ever had.

Any time a speed difference develops between the two rear (driven) wheels, a shear pump, driven solely by this difference, develops pressure in the silicon viscous fluid in which the lock operates. In turn, this pressure is directed to a multi-disc clutch that transfers driving torque to the wheel with the better road grip (“select high”). The greater the speed difference between the two wheels, the more aggressively the clutch engages. As soon as the difference between the two wheels’ speeds begins to diminish, the clutch starts to ease off.

This mechanism is “elegant,” in that it achieves sophisticated action by entirely natural means. There is no external pump, no external source of lubrication or operating fluid. The very motion to be controlled – differences in speed between left and right wheels – generates its locking action. Viscous fluid is so-called because it develops internal force (via an increase in viscosity) whenever it is sheared; this is why the relatively small difference between one wheel speed and the other can generate the necessary action.

Dynamic Stability Control. This electronic traction and stability system, standard on all current BMWs, complements the M Variable Differential Lock.

DSC optimizes traction by electronic means, sensing wheel-speed differences and reducing engine torque and/or applying individual rear-wheel brakes. The crucial difference to the M3 driver between the M Variable Differential Lock and the DSC traction function is that the former in no way impedes power delivery, and is hence suitable for performance driving.

Yet in fact, even DSC’s traction function in the M3 is calibrated to M-specific parameters. In cooperation with Continental Teves, BMW M engineers developed a logic that, in combination with the fast-reacting engine, performance-oriented gearing and M Variable Differential Lock, achieves the desired traction optimization in a more M-compatible way…in other words, without undue interference with M3 performance and the differential lock’s ability to get power to the road.

The DSC stability-enhancing function is essentially unrelated to traction. Sensing differences in wheel speed in a critical cornering or avoidance maneuver, DSC detects any deviation from the normal cornering path (abnormal understeer or oversteer) and gently applies individual wheel brakes to help the driver keep the vehicle on the intended path.

Sequential Manual Gearbox (SMG):
a special way to drive a performance automobile

Given the M3’s performance nature, it does not seem logical to offer an automatic transmission as such; no matter how good – and BMW’s 5- and 6-speed automatics are among the best – an automatic transmission incurs some performance loss relative to a well handled manual gearbox. On the other hand, given today’s capabilities in electronics and hydraulics, it does make great sense to enhance the M3’s 6-speed manual transmission with some automated operation. This is accomplished with the optional Sequential Manual Gearbox (SMG).

In conceptual terms, the SMG system consists of –

• The same 6-speed manual transmission as is standard in M3 models.

• An electrohydraulic mechanism that does the actual gearshifting and clutch actuation.

• Electronic controls that regulate the electrohydraulic mechanism.

• The driver interface, which includes a shift lever on the console and shift “paddles” on the steering wheel.

There is no clutch pedal. On the console is a short, sporty shift lever with R (Reverse), N (Neutral) and S/A (Sequential/Automated) positions, plus “–” and “+” directions. The shift pattern appears on the shift knob and in an instrument-cluster display. Behind the shift lever is a program selector, with which the driver may select –

• In the Sequential mode, 6 programs ranging from “softest and slowest” shifts to “firmest and quickest” shifts; i.e. from most leisurely to sportiest.

• In the Automated mode, 5 programs of similar gradation.

In the dash display, the selected program is shown in a bar graph that repeats the graphic of the program selector switch. The gear currently engaged is shown as a numeral at the left of the indicator; in A, an “A” appears next to the gear indication. At the right side of the shift pattern, “S” is shown if the automated mode is currently engaged, and vice versa; this indicates which mode will be obtained if the lever is moved in that direction.

The vehicle may be parked in R or S/A, not N. To start the engine, the selector must be in N and the brake pedal applied. This accomplished, the driver then selects R or S/A (again with the brakes applied). When moving off from rest in A, the system automatically selects 1st gear, and shifts up through the gears to 6th as road speed increases. In this sense, the A mode resembles the operation of an automatic transmission – but only resembles, not duplicates, it.

Sequential (S) mode. In this mode, the driver has full control over shifting. Pulling the shift lever rearward in the “+” direction, or actuating the right-hand “paddle” on the steering wheel, effects upshifts; pushing the shifter forward (“–”) or actuating the left-hand paddle effects downshifts. It’s that simple:

• S1-5: Selected by the console switch and indicated in the instrument-cluster display, the programs range from “softest” to “firmest” – that is, in 1 the shifting is accomplished at a relatively leisurely pace, in 5 much more quickly. The driver’s criterion here is how sportily he or she wants to drive; in any of the programs, the higher the engine speed the quicker the shift.

• S6: To select this most race-like program, the driver must switch off the Dynamic Stability Control system. Minimum shift time in S6 is 80 milliseconds; under equal conditions, the “slowest” shift program (1) takes 2-4 times as long to complete a shift.

The word “sequential” signifies the basic concept of “one gear at a time” – each tip of the shift lever or shift paddle moves the transmission up or down one gear. However, the driver can skip gears by simply hitting more than one shift in quick succession. Whenever and however the driver calls for a shift, the response of SMG is immediate and satisfying.

Automated (A) mode. Though automated, this DRIVELOGIC mode is not meant as a substitute for a conventional automatic transmission. Here there are five programs. As with S, the higher the program number the faster the shift; in A, however, the speeds at which shifts occur (both up- and downshifts) also increase. For example, in A1 with 35% throttle opening, the upshift to 6th gear will occur about 40 mph; in A5, not until about 80 mph. Decelerating at 5 m/sec/sec, DRIVELOGIC would shift down two gears from 6th to 4th at around 30 mph in A1, or from 6th to 5th at about 106 mph in A5. A2 through A4 effect shifts at points in between.

Additional capabilities and safeguards. Careful development of DRIVELOGIC has resulted in many fine points of the system’s operation:

• 1st-gear start in S: As the vehicle comes to a stop in the S mode, DRIVELOGIC automatically selects 1st gear for starting off again; the driver will then effect upshifts as desired.

• 2nd-gear start: A1 can be used as a winter-driving program; it starts the vehicle from rest in 2nd gear to move off gently. (Dynamic Stability Control’s traction function also guards against wheelspin.)

• Overspeed protection: If the driver calls for a downshift (S mode) that would overspeed the engine, the command to downshift is ignored.

• In any A program, a floored accelerator can get one or two downshifts depending on conditions, and pleasingly quickly.

• Slip detection: In both S and A modes, this safeguard helps keep the vehicle stable during downshifts, particularly when traction is low. Every 10 milliseconds, the rear wheels are checked by the DSC for slippage. If there is too much decelerative torque on the wheels, clutch engagement and engine speed are automatically adjusted to prevent too abrupt a downshift.

• Double-clutching. Also in both modes, DRIVELOGIC coordinates clutch disengagement, shifting, engine speed and clutch engagement to accomplish smooth downshifts – just as a skilled driver would.

• Hill detection: Depending on gradient, down- or uphill, the A shift programs are modified to ensure optimum gear selection. In S mode, shift times are shortened so that the engine is always “on point” for best acceleration uphill, or engine braking downhill.

• Intuitive shifts: In the A mode under certain circumstances, DRIVELOGIC modifies downshifts. In cornering, uphill driving or braking, for instance, a downshift will occur sooner than if the car were simply being driven steadily on level ground. This feature can seem almost supernatural in vigorous driving on a winding, hilly road: SMG seems to read the driver’s mind, magically getting into the right gear before accelerating out of a corner.

• Grade assist: A “hillholder” function, active in both S and A modes. When stopped facing uphill, the driver actuates the left shift paddle. DRIVELOGIC “revs” the engine to about 1500 rpm and slips the clutch so that the vehicle does not roll back. This is available for brief periods only.

• Illuminated upshift indicator: The same orange LEDs that adjust the tachometer warning zone according to engine temperature help indicate to the driver when to upshift. Illuminating in 500-rpm segments, they light progressively as the engine approaches its redline (8000 rpm); given the M3’s catapult-like acceleration, this can be an appreciated assistance.

Since the introduction of the BMW M SMG system with DRIVELOGIC, BMW has introduced a less elaborate SMG version, with only two selectable shift programs within each of its automated and sequential modes; this system is now available in the 3, 5, and Z4 Series and will also be available in the upcoming 6 Series.

Chronicle of an SMG shift. To those versed in driving with a manual transmission, shifting comes naturally – one is hardly aware of letting up on the accelerator, depressing the clutch pedal, moving the shift lever, giving gas again and letting up on the clutch – all in coordinated sequence. SMG does all of this for the driver – and under hard-and-fast driving conditions does it more quickly than even the most skillful driver is likely to do. Here’s the operating sequence:

1. Via a position sensor, the control system always “knows” which gear is currently engaged.

2. When the driver signals a shift, the system selects the appropriate valves.

3. Hydraulic fluid at high pressure (1200 psi or more) disengages the clutch.

4. The M3’s six individual, electronically controlled throttles are closed.

5. Hydraulic cylinders move the transmission’s gearsets into the next gear.

6. If it’s a downshift, the engine is “revved” to the speed it will reach when the selected lower gear is engaged (the “double-clutch” function).

6. The clutch is re-engaged.

7. The throttles are opened again.

All this occurs – perfectly choreographed and calibrated to the vehicle speed, what the driver is doing with the accelerator pedal, the shift program selected and other factors mentioned earlier – in an interval that may be leisurely or a mere blink of the eye. The driver keeps a firm foot on the accelerator; SMG and DRIVELOGIC do all the work. Many enthusiastic drivers are fascinated by the way SMG works.

“Those same track enthusiasts,” noted Road & Track of drivers who enjoy driving on a race track in a March ’03 comparison test, “might also like the lightning-quick shifts of the SMG transmission. With paddle-actuated shifts performed faster than any human could do, the Formula 1-derived system takes some of the thinking out of driving fast. Do-it-yourself stalwarts may still prefer the satisfaction of performing their own gearchanges, but there’s no denying the system’s speed and convenience at the track."

To the op:

Ignore these purist guys, seriously.

I love my M3. Brand new, custom ordered from the factory. I've done four autocross events, four track events, and it just keeps getting better and better.

But honestly, as much of a fan of it as I am, the engineering background in me would love to see someone do succesful LS1 -> E46 M3 swaps. Why the hell not? This purist crap is just GARBAGE!!!

If it was easy enough to do I would investigate the swap in a few years, but I'd almost surely lose SMG which is one of my favorite things about the car.

"no, I dont want a motor that is going to be inexpensive and provide lots of power! thats not for me!"

Give me a break! These purists are the same idiots who would trash the C6 Z06, meanwhile it would be lapping them at the track.

If someone wants to make their M3 a BETTER M3 -- more power to them!

The reason I own a BMW isnt because I am a "BMW nut".

I own a BMW because they're the only manufacturer that makes the M3.

To the op:

Ignore these purist morons dude. Seriously.

I love my M3. Brand new, custom ordered from the factory. I've done four autocross events, four track events, and it just keeps getting better and better.

But honestly, as much of a fan of it as I am, the engineering background in me would love to see someone do succesful LS1 -> E46 M3 swaps. Why the hell not? This purist crap is just GARBAGE!!!

If it was easy enough to do I would investigate the swap in a few years, but I'd almost surely lose SMG which is one of my favorite things about the car.

"no, I dont want a motor that is going to be inexpensive and provide lots of power! thats not for me!"

Give me a break! Ignore the purists. These purists are the same idiots who would trash the C6 Z06, meanwhile it would be lapping them at the track.

The reason I own a BMW isnt because I am a "BMW nut".

I own a BMW because they're the only manufacturer that makes the M3.

If someone wants to make their M3 a BETTER M3 -- more power to them!

the thing you're not paying attention to is ITS NOT A CHEAP swap...its a cheap engine to mod when its already in a car hence a fbody/vette etc etc...if you think its cheap to throw it in an e46m3 and make it work with everything id venture to say you're far off...unless if he is doing everything himself in his garage or has a friend with a shop willing to help out with the cost of labor. I stick by the fact that it woudl be cheaper to keep original engine in and throw the upcoming turbo kit on it and it would stomp a bolt on LS1...so that eliminates the "its cheap" aspect...now you're just left with the shock and awe factor..which if all you want to do is be original and impress a few people then by all means its the right thing to do...but its not the thing to do if you're looking for a cheap means to have a powerful M3. To me having one of the few turbo M3's would be much cooler...but to each his own

To the op:

Ignore these purist guys, seriously.

I love my M3. Brand new, custom ordered from the factory. I've done four autocross events, four track events, and it just keeps getting better and better.

But honestly, as much of a fan of it as I am, the engineering background in me would love to see someone do succesful LS1 -> E46 M3 swaps. Why the hell not? This purist crap is just GARBAGE!!!

If it was easy enough to do I would investigate the swap in a few years, but I'd almost surely lose SMG which is one of my favorite things about the car.

"no, I dont want a motor that is going to be inexpensive and provide lots of power! thats not for me!"

Give me a break! These purists are the same idiots who would trash the C6 Z06, meanwhile it would be lapping them at the track.

If someone wants to make their M3 a BETTER M3 -- more power to them!

The reason I own a BMW isnt because I am a "BMW nut".

I own a BMW because they're the only manufacturer that makes the M3.

find a purist that trash talks a zo6 :nono

I have no problems with a ls1 swap in a e46.My issue is doing it to an M3

why would you pay for an m3 and take whats makes it an M3 out :eyecrazy

for the money you would spen on an ls1 swap you could have a 500whp "real" M3

A modded S54, built to 500hp is not in the same league as an LSx motor of course. AN FI'd hi-compression motor will have a questionable (and unproven) life-span, be horrible for track, due to heat-soak, detonation, and god-knows what else.....I say go for it.
Why start with an M3? Well, I dont know...they do look better, have the flares, bigger brakes, etc. If you find one that has been money shifted, thrown rod, etc...then why not?

A modded S54, built to 500hp is not in the same league as an LSx motor of course. AN FI'd hi-compression motor will have a questionable (and unproven) life-span, be horrible for track, due to heat-soak, detonation, and god-knows what else.....I say go for it.
Why start with an M3? Well, I dont know...they do look better, have the flares, bigger brakes, etc. If you find one that has been money shifted, thrown rod, etc...then why not?

ok why not drop a v10 M5 engine...you will prolly keep the smg and have it smog legal....prolly cost about the same

ok why not drop a v10 M5 engine...you will prolly keep the smg and have it smog legal....prolly cost about the same

I have no problem with that.... (though I think the V10's are quite expensive).

Of course, this thread has really gone off on a tangent.....now back to the topic at hand: who here digs wine coolers?...and who really makes the bast....California Coolers or Bartles and James?

A modded S54, built to 500hp is not in the same league as an LSx motor of course. AN FI'd hi-compression motor will have a questionable (and unproven) life-span, be horrible for track, due to heat-soak, detonation, and god-knows what else.....I say go for it.
Why start with an M3? Well, I dont know...they do look better, have the flares, bigger brakes, etc. If you find one that has been money shifted, thrown rod, etc...then why not?

he already owns an m3 and said nothing of a ruined motor....also try talkign to the guy that tracks his AA s/c m3 about it being horrible for the track :rolleyes So far the s54 has proven to be a very reliable motor under boost..its not like people havent been boosting them up to 500+ hp already..have you checked the turbo thread thats in this section?

once again if he wants to do this because of originality than its an awesome idea...but dont spew things about being better for the track or cheaper to mod etc etc when the initial cost to do the swap will be astronomical. How about a full N/A work over then since you're against FI..you can easily get a lot more hp out of the s54 for the amount of money that it would cost for the swap. Yeah it wont have 450rwhp but it would end up having more than enough to walk most cars @ the track...get a stroker kit/cams/full bolt ons whatever and it would be a huge beast

he already owns an m3 and said nothing of a ruined motor....also try talkign to the guy that tracks his AA s/c m3 about it being horrible for the track :rolleyes So far the s54 has proven to be a very reliable motor under boost..its not like people havent been boosting them up to 500+ hp already..have you checked the turbo thread thats in this section?

once again if he wants to do this because of originality than its an awesome idea...but dont spew things about being better for the track or cheaper to mod etc etc when the initial cost to do the swap will be astronomical. How about a full N/A work over then since you're against FI..you can easily get a lot more hp out of the s54 for the amount of money that it would cost for the swap. Yeah it wont have 450rwhp but it would end up having more than enough to walk most cars @ the track...get a stroker kit/cams/full bolt ons whatever and it would be a huge beast

I am not "spewing" anything about cost...of course it will be expensive. I will say that an understressed V8 will probably make a more reliable track motor than a near-maxed out 6.
I dont know his reasons, and I am not really attatched either way. I think it would be cool...so I say go for it.

You know I was thinking about it and the only reason that I can think of that it hits only like 5k. It could be the secondary rev limiter. Something in the ecu is telling it that the front wheels arent spinning possibly.

Check this out, hopefully it wasn't already posted:

http://www.vorshlag.com/ls1bmw0.php

They are bimmerforums vendors too.......group buy eventually? :)

All the purists in this thread need their posting privileges revoked until they've had a ride in an LS1 powered BMW. Then and only then may they post their opinions.

All the purists in this thread need their posting privileges revoked until they've had a ride in an LS1 powered BMW. Then and only then may they post their opinions.

/thread

All the purists in this thread need their posting privileges revoked until they've had a ride in an LS1 powered BMW. Then and only then may they post their opinions.

go test drive a bone stock e46 m3 and come back to us.

If I wanted to spend 60 grand on a muscle car it would def not be an M3

call me crazzy but the though about tearing an M3 apart and taking what makes it an M power is freaking retarded.

go test drive a bone stock e46 m3 and come back to us.

If I wanted to spend 60 grand on a muscle car it would def not be an M3

call me crazzy but the though about tearing an M3 apart and taking what makes it an M power is freaking retarded.

I've driven stock and modded E46 M3. I've driven E36 M3. I've driven M Roady....I've driven many non-M BMW's (wife owns e46 323). I own a 1996 Z3, it was supercharged, it now has a mildly modded LS1 with T56 6spd under the hood.

And now....I call you crazy

I've driven stock and modded E46 M3. I've driven E36 M3. I've driven M Roady....I've driven many non-M BMW's (wife owns e46 323). I own a 1996 Z3, it was supercharged, it now has a mildly modded LS1 with T56 6spd under the hood.

And now....I call you crazy

I have no problems with doing the swap in a car like a z3 or a regular 3 series that you can pick up pretty cheap.The reason people pay for the M powers are not just for looks.

I can pick up a z3 for 5k and do this and keep it under 15k totall.The thought about doing this to a 40+k car is rediculus.

If you want an ls1 then why buy the M3 in the first place.you could easliy have gotton a Z06 (c5) and for the amount of money spending on the swap and an e46 you could of bought a new Z06 or a used stage 2 996 tt

I can pick up a z3 for 5k and do this and keep it under 15k totall.

:biglaughb

Wouldn't a OBD I, LT1 (pre 1996) be a lot easier? A lot less electronics to figure out and easy to program the PCU yourself with LT1 Edit..

Wouldn't a OBD I, LT1 (pre 1996) be a lot easier? A lot less electronics to figure out and easy to program the PCU yourself with LT1 Edit..

LT1 is significantly heavier than LS motors. Not to mention the legalities of putting an OBDI motor in an OBDII car.

The bottom line is do whatever will satisfy you needs! Yes, it is going against the true BMW way, but the things I have seen people do to these cars it can't be that bad. I myself have a very quick S54 making strong numbers, but I want more power! I have been debating the S62 M5 swap for over 2 years now. Doing it myself having all the right equiptment I still just can't get over the financial aspect of it. I think doing projects like these always end up costing too much time and money. Then the disappointment if you don't like the finished product. In the end sometimes it is worth it and sometimes it's easier to get a different car for your needs. Just my opinion not always the case.

The bottom line is do whatever will satisfy you needs! Yes, it is going against the true BMW way, but the things I have seen people do to these cars it can't be that bad. I myself have a very quick S54 making strong numbers, but I want more power! I have been debating the S62 M5 swap for over 2 years now. Doing it myself having all the right equiptment I still just can't get over the financial aspect of it. I think doing projects like these always end up costing too much time and money. Then the disappointment if you don't like the finished product. In the end sometimes it is worth it and sometimes it's easier to get a different car for your needs. Just my opinion not always the case.

check this out
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/BMW-M3-GTR-Dinan-M5-engine-500HP-Factory-spec_W0QQitemZ180052796097QQihZ008QQcategoryZ98064 QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

go test drive a bone stock e46 m3 and come back to us.

If I wanted to spend 60 grand on a muscle car it would def not be an M3

call me crazzy but the though about tearing an M3 apart and taking what makes it an M power is freaking retarded.

60 grand on a muscle car hmmm?

what about the E46 M3 GTR with it's v8? That one is OK because BMW made it, right?

:rolleyes

60 grand on a muscle car hmmm?

what about the E46 M3 GTR with it's v8? That one is OK because BMW made it, right?

:rolleyes

ya its making over 100hp/l and is one of the fastests cars ever to lap the ring....way faster than an a csl and cough couch muscle car :rolleyes

the point of that gtr was to show what you could build for the money you would spend on an ls1 swap

wich one would you buy?

ya its making over 100hp/l and is one of the fastests cars ever to lap the ring....way faster than an a csl and cough couch muscle car

the point of that gtr was to show what you could build for the money you would spend on an ls1 swap

wich one would you buy?

1.6 liter Hondas were making 100hp/L in 1989....
That is nothing to brag about.

Its obvious you love the M3, great, but you have to understand, not everyone is programmmed just like you.....

1.6 liter Hondas were making 100hp/L in 1989....
That is nothing to brag about.

Its obvious you love the M3, great, but you have to understand, not everyone is programmmed just like you.....

ya and theres more torque in my lug nuts and electric powed lawn mower.

go ahead and tear apart a 50k dollar flag ship M3 and throw in an Ls1 :buttrock

I cant wait to see people droping small blocks in the next M power...:rolleyes

ya and theres more torque in my lug nuts and electric powed lawn mower.



So? You were the one that used the 100hp/L, my point was it means nothing.

Doesn't the new M3 have a small V8?

I did not read all this thread, however, I do have some insight.

We can build you an AEM system that will run the car and give you a full wiring harness and ABS harness solution. The TC can be enabled, but will have to be tuned on the street/track.

I am a BMW purist, but the crate motors make some impressive power to weight #'s for sure!

Thanks
Brad

i vote hemi with a confederate flag painted on the roof for the finishing touch. german engineering is sooo overrated.

Wouldn't you like to see a section on Bimmerforums for Conversions & Hybrids? If so, please follow the link and answer "Yes" to the poll!

This idea needs ALL of our support to be accepted, approved and executed by the Bimmerforum staff!

Click here!
Conversions & Hybrids Poll- Yes or no? (http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=647928)

QFT +1


Again if you want to track race get a Corvette, if you want to drag race just keep the Trans Am. Oh and TA is trademarked for Dodge(Dodge Challenger T/A), so you own a Trans Am. But I'm sure you already knew that. Have a nice day! :thumbdown

What an Idiot....

I part out F-body's, Y-body's and BMW's in Houston....I have had many vettes and Bmw's....right now I have a 3 series, 5 series and 7 series as daily drivers. The E38 will be getting a transplant as the engine it has in it is tired. I will not get the engine rebuilt because I have LS1's available for a quarter of the cost as to get the original rebuilt.

Anavel0....You are such a purist with your 318....I send a bunch of LS1's and T-56's to Frankfurt for the gear heads over there to stuff in any BMW or porsche they can get a hold of....they should be turning their noses up to the idea but it's cheaper for them to buy from me and pay another $550 to get a vette engine shipped to germany than to rebuild their engines.

It cracks me up that the man asked for technical advice and this kid with his vast knowledge of automobiles only response is, "if you want to race, get a vette".

Quit hijacking the mans thread. Sheesh...this board is no different than any other forum.

The new LS7 would be nice, but I just cannot image hacking my car up. My views changed from before I bought the car. Now that I have it I understand a lot more the value of the S54. Would I love to have a titanium rod LS7? Yes, but I think the hassle of making it work in MY E46 is more than I would want. I will wait and see how the HPF turbo thing works out.

I am no purist. I just love the sound and feel of a straight 6 over a v8. I grew up on 240zs.

Just an opinion...

I personally haven't ridden in an LS1 swapped BMW, however... I've got friends the LS1s and a lot of the mods they do are considerably cheaper than anything I've seen done to an M3. Of course, on the other hand... it's all still a lot of money... it always adds up... either way you choose.. good luck and hope you're happy with your decision.

stupid. buy a corvette. dont reck an m3.

stupid. buy a corvette. dont reck an m3.

Exactly why we need an engine conversion/swap forum. Posts like this create long threads with only a handful of useful posts, many of which will get overlooked because of nonsense such as what was posted by hnoppenberger

Don't disrespect the LS motor by putting it in an overpriced snob sled. Lord knows you would have to do a LOT of chassie work to keep it from twisting...I have seen comlpete running engins (heads , block, ecu, headers, and running gear) on craigslist for under $900. The hardest part would be finding a bell housing to fit the tranny and enging togeather. Next would just be finding how to mount it in and ordering a custom drive shaft. I'll bet the company that did the E36 swap would be able to point you in the right direction.

Wouldn't a OBD I, LT1 (pre 1996) be a lot easier? A lot less electronics to figure out and easy to program the PCU yourself with LT1 Edit..

Heavy? The aftermarket for LSx is huge if not bigger then LTx. You can make a streetable with good power band 500hp n/a no issue. You can not beat that for everyday drivability. Also has huge torque at bottom end.





Also every one else. Why not start with M3? It looks good, has better the famous M-diff, already handles great from the factory. The guy just wants more power but with the grunt of v8 with low end power.

Its a very good chance a 500hp ls1/6 powered e46 m3 could be a 500hp supercharged e46 m3 on a race track.

reading this thread made my brain hurt.

I think the swap would be a great idea, although I dont agree putting it into a M car I would buy a clean E46 and drop it in there in a heartbeat.....

I wonder if I could drop my 351w into something ;)

I'm a BMW fan and also a Chevy fan. I have a Camaro in my garage right beside my M3. I think it would be an awesome idea to put a modded LS1 into an E46 BMW. The S54, although wonderful, is completely maxed out already and parts are very expensive.... about 5 times higher on average for internals that a Chevy.

But I agree with some that I wouldn't do it to an M3, only because you are going to have to change so much stuff that the only thing that will remain is the chassis and suspension. I know from experience on what is involved because I put a 454cid big block in my 1997 Camaro and there are things that you never even thought of that you will have to change. For instance, the transmission will probably have to be a Borg Warner T-56 or maybe a ZF 6 speed from an C4 LT-1 Corvette. The ZF is very expensive to rebuild and the T-56 is a dime a dozen, and doesn't have the lock-up issues that the ZF does. But the T-56 shifter is forward of the ZF's which is why the LT-1 vette guys don't normally put a T-56 into a 'vette.

Will the new transmission's shifter fit right in the BMW?

Will the larger radiator that you will probably need fit right?

With no BMW engine ECU, your instrument panel will not work. Will you be able to fit an aftermarket gauge package into the BMW without hacking up the dashboard too much? (if you care about that, maybe you don't for a track car)

Also, the fuel pump may not be able to supply enough fuel of the right pressure. Will it? Will the security system allow the fuel pump to turn on with no engine ECU?

With the wider V8 the custom accessory bracket you will have to make may not allow all the accessories to fit right.

Will the BMW's differential and rear suspension pieces be able to handle the torque of the V8? Probably not since a moderate running LS1 puts out more that 400 ftlbs.

Will the CHASSIS be able to handle the torque of the V8 since it's well documented that the E46 chassis are failing with just the 260ft lbs of the S54.

I'm just trying to remind you of all the stuff you're going to have to think about...plus there is many more things I cannot think of now. But one thing is for sure...by the time you're done, to have a reliable track car, most of that M3 is going to have to be replaced.... all you will have left is the front suspension, body, and a badge.

That is the reason if it were me I'd start with the cheapest E46 I could find, and build it up from there.

But if you succeed it will be cool.

-Dave

PS: One last word of advice. If you're just doing it for the extra cubes, don't. I learned that with my 454 swap. Alot of money, sweat, and time for a car that was as fast naturally aspirated as a supercharged small block. If you want big power, buy a motor that already fits in an E46 chassis (such as a regular 330i engine), and build it up for a turbo or supercharger, and build it right the first time. Treat it nice and don't go overboard on power, and it'll be much cheaper, and easier to live with in the long run.

Will the new transmission's shifter fit right in the BMW?


T56 fits nicely in my Z3, however watch out for 1999/2000 units from the f-body. Mine pops out of 3rd sometimes, there is a service bulletin for it...I'm going to upgrade to something from RPM Transmissions


Will the larger radiator that you will probably need fit right?


Custom radiator here :buttrock


With no BMW engine ECU, your instrument panel will not work. Will you be able to fit an aftermarket gauge package into the BMW without hacking up the dashboard too much? (if you care about that, maybe you don't for a track car)


Speartech harness that I'm using came with seperate fuel pump relay which is coming off the LS1 PCM, works just fine.


Also, the fuel pump may not be able to supply enough fuel of the right pressure. Will it? Will the security system allow the fuel pump to turn on with no engine ECU?


Walbro has some nice upgrades


With the wider V8 the custom accessory bracket you will have to make may not allow all the accessories to fit right.


All fbody accessories fit in the Z3 w/o mods


Will the BMW's differential and rear suspension pieces be able to handle the torque of the V8? Probably not since a moderate running LS1 puts out more that 400 ftlbs.


Mr. Forbes kit to the rescue for me


Will the CHASSIS be able to handle the torque of the V8 since it's well documented that the E46 chassis are failing with just the 260ft lbs of the S54.

Nothing a few $$'s to the local chassis fabricator can't take care of :cool

I am really close to having us do a LS1 or LS7 conversion to my M3 cab street car this spring/summer then selling a kit to do the conversion. All the issues brought up in the recent post are easy to overcome (we have to overcome these in the race cars already).

Thanks
Brad

T56 fits nicely in my Z3, however watch out for 1999/2000 units from the f-body. Mine pops out of 3rd sometimes, there is a service bulletin for it...I'm going to upgrade to something from RPM Transmissions



Custom radiator here



Speartech harness that I'm using came with seperate fuel pump relay which is coming off the LS1 PCM, works just fine.



Walbro has some nice upgrades



All fbody accessories fit in the Z3 w/o mods



Mr. Forbes kit to the rescue for me



Nothing a few $$'s to the local chassis fabricator can't take care of

Well, then it's like I said.

You're replacing so much of that M3 that you might as well start with a regular 325i coupe.

It's the same between a C5 corvette and BMW 3-series. If you want to buy a car, drive it right off the showroom and onto the track, then buy a Z06 or M3. If you want to buy the car, upgrade all the suspension and engine stuff, and then put it on the track, start with a regular corvette coupe or 3-series coupe. It'll probably outperform a stock Z06 or M3 after you're done, anyways.

Once you replace all the suspension and engine on a car, the only thing left of the original car is the badge (in a matter of speaking).

One more way of putting it...

If you take a Corvette coupe and a Z06, and replace the suspension and engine with the same aftermarket engine and suspension, you end up with the SAME car.... except one looks like a Z06 and one looks like a coupe. The performance is the same.

It's the same with the BMW's.

Of course, if you already own an M3 outright, then that's a good reason to start with an M3. :smile:

I part out F-body's, Y-body's and BMW's in Houston....I have had many vettes and Bmw's....right now I have a 3 series, 5 series and 7 series as daily drivers. The E38 will be getting a transplant as the engine it has in it is tired. I will not get the engine rebuilt because I have LS1's available for a quarter of the cost as to get the original rebuilt.

LS1 in an E38 would be nice, keep me posted.

I tell you what, I almost want to do this swap for no other reason than to piss people off. I'm stunned at the amount of rage being displayed over what someone would do with his own property. I'm stunned, and them I'm amused. I think I would fall over laughing at anyone who would actually get mad over such a thing.

we are on the fence about making an e46 KIT to do this with LS1/6/7 motors.

If I could get 5-10 people to be IN, then I would do it to my car first, then offer the first group a killer deal, then market it to the rest.

I am just not sure I want to invest the money and my engineer's time unless there are buyers.

Thanks
Brad

ive always dreamed of a bmw rumbling down the block with a ls6 motor but was thinking about doing it to a e36...would love to see it in my e46 m3 but i just dont think its praticle. i would love to see it though :)

Slightly biased there Brendon....coughAStockCorvettecough....;)

No bias here, I've never owned a GM product.

No reason whatsoever to exchange this engine for a lower revving domestic v8. That would also probably throw off the near close 49/51 ratio on the car.

A domestic V8 that's superior in almost every way. And the engine weighs LESS, so it'd actually make the car MORE rear heavy, which is what it desperately needs.

Forgive my ignorance, but why the hell would anyone want to put an American GM V8 inside of a BMW. That has got to be the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard.

Here's a few reasons:
The LSx motors are:
--more powerful
--more torque
--superior torque curve
--lighter
--smaller dimensions
--significantly less expensive to buy and maintain
--easier to mod
--can accept higher levels of power on stock internals (stronger)
--more fuel efficient

If you want a car with a Corvette engine why didn't you go with a new GTO or *shock* a Corvette.

He obviously doesn't like the rest of those cars . . .

That all said, it's going to cost a lot more than just the motor and the resale on the car will be rubbish afterwards. Troubleshooting all the needlessly complicated electrical circuits will be a pain, too. If you're purely into performance and you don't plan on selling the car, I'd do it. But otherwise, you would probably be better off with a C6. The car is overall faster (even outside of straight line speed) anyways.

I own a 1996 Z3 1.9 Supercharged with a blown motor and I am about to pull a JoeZ on my car. After seeing his swap done on his site and listening to it on you tube, my car will have a LS1 in it no matter what. :)

I say do what makes you happy OP, thats why you worked hard to make the money, so you can do what makes you smile. :)

m3 makes sense due to suspension, brakes and the body (wider tires). You can also sell the s54 and trans to recoop the higher initial cost.

An e36 might be more cost effective, unless you absolutely love the e46.

An e36 might be more cost effective, unless you absolutely love the e46.

+1, the E46 and E36 with LS1's would be the exact same car. The only advantage of the E46 is wider tires, and weight/steering feel for the E36.

+1, the E46 and E36 with LS1's would be the exact same car. The only advantage of the E46 is wider tires, and weight/steering feel for the E36.

For the money and effort in shoe horning a LS1 engine and trannie in, I don't see it being much more of a strech to flare the fenders for big meats.

the e46 chassis is SO much better then the e46. You cannot duplicate the chassis, the suspension, etc in the e36.

We race these cars, and there IS a real difference.

if you are just looking for straight line speed on the cheap, sure an e36 might be better, but the ONLY advantage it has is price.

Thanks
Brad

lamest idea ever, i dont see how any true BMW enthusiast could do this and sleep at night

Boy, your not judgmental at all, huh?

I own 8 BMW's, race them and have owned BMW's all my life. I started an entire business around these cars. There is nobody that is more of an enthusiast for the make then I, but I think that this is a worthy idea and could be a really fun project.

BTW, being a BMW enthusiast does not mean blindly drinking the "cool-aid" and thinking that every aspect of every BMW is perfect. There are always things to do better (of course this is subjective to each owner) or different.

Thanks
Brad

Cars: 2000 Trans Am, 2002 M3


maybe his trans am is crashed, and his m3 motor is toast?

makes the most sense i guess-- build 1 working car out of two broken ones?

I imagine he likes the looks/feel/quality of the M3, but likes the avialability of mods for his LS1, not to mention the price difference. Spend 10k on an S54 for an added 200hp.... you imagine what you could get out of an LS1 if you spent 10k? heh....

Boy, your not judgmental at all, huh?

I own 8 BMW's, race them and have owned BMW's all my life. I started an entire business around these cars. There is nobody that is more of an enthusiast for the make then I, but I think that this is a worthy idea and could be a really fun project.

BTW, being a BMW enthusiast does not mean blindly drinking the "cool-aid" and thinking that every aspect of every BMW is perfect. There are always things to do better (of course this is subjective to each owner) or different.

Thanks
Brad

I don't really remember saying every BMW was perfect in every way because I know they are not perfect by a long shot. I just don't understand why someone would want to put a different (non BMW) engine in an M3. If you dont like it's performance than get something else that you like better instead of driving a corvette disgusied as an M3. But its his time and money and a free country. I just wouldn't do it.

and wtf does drinking cool aid have to do with anything and how do you have so many cars

In all great honesty, dropping a ls1 into a E46 M3 is not advisable at the moment. I don't base that statement on the purists argument but rather on the following reasons.

1.The e46 M3 is still valuable and will continue being so for some years to come. A ls1 swap would greatly diminish its value now and in the future as well.
2.You can achieve better results if you start with a base e46 coupe.Hell you can pick one up with a blown engine or trans for cheap.
3.It would be more fun to have a ls1 coupe that slaughters M3s.

That said, dropping the ls1 into a e46 should be easy from a mechanical stand point. The headers would the most time consuming and costly part to fabricate.

The electronics, as has been mentioned before will be tricky but not impossible. The ls1 ECU is almost a stand alone system. Hook up a few sensors, give it gas and power and it will run. There is no reason why it would not rev past 5k in a e46.

Unlike the e36 the e46 has quite a lot of data relayed on the CAN bus which would be a problem once the DME is eliminated. However the only issues I see arising are the tach signal, ti signal (for fuel consumption gauge), a/c compressor control and ASC/DSC. The ABS will work just fine. all it needs are the wheel speed sensor signals and power.

For the a/c have a separate switch to activate the compressor and the BMW IHKA will take care of the rest.

The tach and ti signals are sent via CAN from the DME hence there is no way around that unless you can come up with some sought of convector that will convert the LS1 tach signal into a BMW CAN signal that the IKE will understand.

The speedo signal is also sent to the cluster via CAN however it originates from the ABS module hence it will not be affected by the swap.The speedo will work.

ASC/DSC become lost because the DME has to be present to cut spark or adjust the throttle position for traction control to occur, but last time I checked everyone is trying to figure a way to get rid of them.

There is still alot else that you have to tinker with electronically to make the engine work. e.g fuel pump, emissions valve control,starter,alt and batt light....etc. those are the easy things.

Its only a matter of time before someone does this swap.....thats if it has not been done yet.

I agree with your assessment and would like to add ‘maybe he is like me and tired of broken or otherwise malfunctioning getrag transmissions cluttering the garage floor’. Again (like myself) maybe building a car that outperforms the generic out of the box add on Beemers stuff is also appealing.

OK, with all of the jesting out of the way this is where I am at on the Chevy swap thing. First off my 733i is nice but hardly a collector so I am not destroying a peace of history; however, if it was a M-3 I would still do it. The easiest early iron swap would most likely be of the 5.0 Ford verities. The front oil sump and narrower V-8 configuration makes this swap idea much more friendly. For reasons all my own I want to transplant a standard Chevy small-block (1955 to 1990 whatever).
The Chevy rear oil sump has been addressed by a guy doing this swap in 325i’s. He uses an exaggerated rear sump from JTR Chevy S-10 swaps >>>NO URL’s <<<
I lost the 325i guys E-addy and will post when I find it again (while looking for that thread, I found this discussion). In the case of my E-36, it looks to me like that I may need a pan I found that adapts small block Chevys into 1962 to 1967 Novas. This pan is shaped like a question mark in order to clear the Novas stock rear steer suspension. I just found a local parts dealer that will allow me to order and return aftermarket oil pans if they don’t work. The low performance 305 (no Z-28/IROC) tucks in tighter and that’s the manifold I am going to attempt first hoping to avoid contact with the steering box.
Dry sumps are spenddddy and I have omitted them for this reason alone (for now).

This colorful guy is performing an LS-2 swap into a 535i. Good or bad he’s doing it also...LOL. (old geezers garage)
Here’s an 1996 Z-3 LS ....ON YOU TUBE.....sorry thread wont post urls

Good luck with the swap; I am a poor student so this swap may take some time...

P.S the V-8 sits further back than the M-30 enhancing the balance, I don’t expect my 733i’s handling to be adversely affected and with the battery relocated into the trunk and lighter aftermarket seats replacing those 100 pound apiece, electric, buffalo hide 745i monsters...... well enough said.


Chase

I just finished an engine swap for my E46 M3. I dropped an LS2 into it! Here is a picture of the car after the swap.
http://img464.imageshack.us/img464/4821/gtogc9.jpg
1. Used 2006 Pontiac GTO LS2 with 5000 miles, $24,000
2. Aftermarket coilovers to tighten up the suspension, $800
3. The look on the E46 M3 drivers face when you put 3 car lengths on him,,,,,,,,,,,,Priceless.
For $45,000, there's the BMW M3, for everything else, there's GTO.

I just finished an engine swap for my E46 M3. I dropped an LS2 into it! Here is a picture of the car after the swap.
http://img464.imageshack.us/img464/4821/gtogc9.jpg
1. Used 2006 Pontiac GTO LS2 with 5000 miles, $24,000
2. Aftermarket coilovers to tighten up the suspension, $800
3. The look on the E46 M3 drivers face when you put 3 car lengths on him,,,,,,,,,,,,Priceless.
For $45,000, there's the BMW M3, for everything else, there's GTO.

Look on the GTO drivers face when your M3 which weighs like 400lbs less brakes so late going into a turn he ends up putting a football field on you as you just start to hit the apex:

priceless as well.

:D

sell your e46 m3 and buy another one that has no/or damaged engine

Did i miss something, why use the LS1 over the LS2? Cost? or size and weight?

Also i would prefer the Ls2 over the Ls6 as well....look at the Caddie CTS-V. It switched over from ls6 to ls2. The ls7 is a completely other story :-)

lsn't the ls2 a iron block used in trucks and suv's?

lsn't the ls2 a iron block used in trucks and suv's?
Nope, it's an Al block. And yes, I'd use the LS2. You can find them pretty cheap now.