I have an ///M Coupe. Look at how little my amp/sub area is! Exciting.

http://www.thelargeglass.com/bmw/rear.jpg

I'm thinking of putting together a small stereo system. The HK Premium Sound isn't. I want to keep the cost down, want it to sound better than what is in there now, want it to be easy to install, don't want to see anything.

1. I'm thinking about cheaping out on the head unit. I will be in iPod 98% of the time, and AM radio 2% of the time. So, really, I barely even need the head unit. I just want it to match the interior orange gauges. Is it true? Can I largely cheap out on the head unit?

2. I plan to spend the money on 4 speakers and an amp. I have not done hardly any research, but every car I've ever owned seems to require shallow speakers. Well, screw that. I'd rather have nice speakers, and would rather do a lil' fab work to make decent speakers fit in the door, and in the roof of the rear hatch area. Also, my car has a "10-speaker" system which is marketing code for straight-up retarded. I assume, I just leave the extra tweeters and stuff in there? Four decent 2 way speakers and I think that will be fine.

3. Ah yes, the subs. Well, my car really limits me. DO NOT LAUGH. I am thinking of putting two 6" Bazooka Subs on that shelf. The things are small and like $89. How plausible an idea is this? Look at my pic, I don't really have too many options. I want to hear bass, but don't need to rattle junk in the trunk.

4. Amp, I assume I can get a good amp that will drive 2 subs and 4 speakers? I do not need serious loud, my ears are all messed up anyhow. I just want decent sound, and sound that I can hear with the windows rolled down. Can I power 2 subs? I plan to blow most of the money on the amp. Don't need big power, just want clean power and the ability to drive 4 speakers and 2 small subs.

5. Wiring. I have not installed a car stereo in a long time. I assume I can use the existing wiring?

There is a housing that covers that shelf. I have an idea on how to totally replace it with speaker fabric. So, the amp and the two subs will be under acoustically transparent fabric.

http://www.thelargeglass.com/bmw/stereo.gif

[edit] Crap, after owning this car for 3 years, I have no idea what speakers I even have in this thing. Looks like I may have speakers behind the seat which is ghey. I might just abandon those as well. Will 4 speakers and 2 subs sounds ok?

The stock fronts are 3 way components, I wouldn't recommend just putting a 2 way coaxial into the kick panel cause it will sound like poop without a high in the door. You can pick up a decent set of 5.25" components for pretty cheap. As far as I know the Coupe's don't have speakers behind the seats and the rear "headliner" speakers can be replaced w/ some 2way 5.25" coaxials. As for the Subs, well that's kinda up to you and your own skills. I built a nice box/ amp rack that takes up a little cargo space, but we never used it anyway. The amp you are looking for does exist but isn't very common and may be a little more expensive. However, in the Coupe w/ a decent headunit you don't really need an amp to run the speakers, so you could just get a smaller one for the subs. I also used the factory wiring for all of my speakers. Some people here may argue that it's a bad idea, but I think my setup sounds great and I don't think all the extra time involved in running wires into the door panels, headliner etc... would have been worth the theoretical gain in sound quality. Using online retailers I was able to purchase everything for less than $700 and it was all Kenwood quality stuff.

MP-728 HU
5.25" components for the front
5.25" 2 ways for the back
10" Excelon sub XW1002DVC
9152-D Amp 900W RMS

I'm planning the same sort of upgrade for this summer. I found that you can pick up a nice set of 5.25" Infinity Kappa components on eBay for around $130 (which would take care of the kick panels and doors). You have different rear speakers than I do, but a matching pair of 5.25" 2 or 3-ways shouldn't be more than $100 on eBay.

As for subs, I think that's really up to you. I'm not partial to Bazooka-type systems because I hate all-in-one deals. One piece fails and the whole thing is junk :(. That said, I think you can rebuild the stock sub to sound better and be louder. I read that the HK speakers in the stock sub are the same as the ones in the kick panels. If that's the case, you could pick up a pair of 5.25" woofers to replace them, and then just give them more power.
When it comes to amps, I prefer the idea of having multiple smaller amps, as opposed to one big one for everything. You could get one 4-channel amp for the front and rear speakers, and then a single or dual-channel for the subs. It might be easier to hide 2 smaller amps than to have to hide one very long one.

I am going to use the stock HU when I do mine to keep the OE look, but I'm going to use a USA Spec dual aux-in converter to hook up my MP3 player and, eventually, a car PC. I think you could do the whole system for $500-$600 with quality parts from eBay.

I think the OEM sub is a powered sub. I don't really think rebuilding it is an option.

The Bazooka type things are $90 unpowered. About $180 powered.

I was hoping to put two unpowered ones back there. 18-3/8"L x 8-1/4"H x 6-7/8"W

They would only be 6" and they are rated to 39Hz, so, they are not gonna loosen paint regardless.

They are small and self-contained, so, I could just put them in the trash if/when they fail. At $90, not a huge loss. If they truly suck I could revist the idea.

http://www.thelargeglass.com/bmw/bazooka.jpeg

How hard would it be to stick two small amps back there? Maybe two 40 watt amps or somthing? One for the subs, one for the speakers? How do you wire something like that?

I don't think an amplified head unit will be enough for the cabin speakers. I don't need much more than that though. They are just not clean enough.

I think the OEM sub is a powered sub. I don't really think rebuilding it is an option.

The Bazooka type things are $90 unpowered. About $180 powered.

I was hoping to put two unpowered ones back there. 18-3/8"L x 8-1/4"H x 6-7/8"W

They would only be 6" and they are rated to 39Hz, so, they are not gonna loosen paint regardless.

They are small and self-contained, so, I could just put them in the trash if/when they fail. At $90, not a huge loss. If they truly suck I could revist the idea.

http://www.thelargeglass.com/bmw/bazooka.jpeg

How hard would it be to stick two small amps back there? Maybe two 40 watt amps or somthing? One for the subs, one for the speakers? How do you wire something like that?

I don't think an amplified head unit will be enough for the cabin speakers. I don't need much more than that though. They are just not clean enough.

Here's what I would do...

If you want a basic HU with good iPod integration, I would look at the new Alpine 9856. It has a white display and blue buttons (this can probably be physically converted to amber, if you wish) but it should have typically good Alpine SQ and reliability, the best iPod interface on the market, and Crutchfield will have it in stock shortly for $199.

Speakers... I would look at either the DLS MS-5 set (130mm magnesium woofer, 28mm silk tweeter) or the CDT Audio EF-51 set (130mm paper-cone woofer, 25mm silk tweeter). Both are excellent and should be available for around $200/set; AIM Don Smith (djdilliodon) for the CDTs or PM el.Duderino for the DLS.

I would only worry about running speakers in the front of the car; abandon everything else, as it is unnecessary (especially in a small car like the MZ3 coupe w/ no back seat) and it will just complicate your system.

As for mounting, if you want the stealthiest install possible, go with the DLS speakers and mount the tweeters in the factory door panel locations. If you want the best install possible from an SQ standpoint, go with either the CDTs or the DLS and mount the tweets on the A-pillars, facing each other.

As for subwoofers, I would get a single, high-quality 8-inch sub and mount it in an appropriately-sized plywood box. The perfect sub would be an Alumapro Alusonic EX8, which is affordable and has excellent SQ. It is also very efficient and will work well with modest power.

Finally, the amp... For the system specified so far, I would look at a DLS RA40. Again, contact el.Duderino on the forum. The RA40 is a 4-channel, 70W @ 4-ohm amp. Run channels 1 & 2 to the front stage, and bridge channels 3 & 4 for 220W @ 4-ohms to the subwoofer. This amp is also fairly compact and will save space over trying to run either 1) powered sub boxes or 2) a pair of amps.

My guess is that you can pick up all this for $750-$800. Budget another $100 or so for wiring, install accessories, etc. Not the cheapest route, but certainly not super-expensive and, IMO, a good deal for the kind of sound-quality it will deliver.

Good luck!

The stock sub for the roadies and coupes is a pair of drivers in a small enclosure, and then powered by the same amp that powers everything else. What the hell was BMW thinking using that dinky amp to push 10 speakers? No wonder it's overdriven and sounds like crap.

Anyhow, the drivers in the OEM sub can be removed and replaced. I haven't read of many people doing this, since it's harder to find speakers for it, but I read of one guy using the woofers from a set of 5.25" components in that enclosure. If you are going to buy a set of components for the front anyhow, you might consider trying the woofers in the sub enclosure and see how you like it. If it sounds good, you would end up spending less on subs by buying a second component set (~$130) and just using the woofers, as opposed to spending $180 on bazooka tubes that you can't hide.

Either way, you'll need an amp. I don't have a coupe (unfortunately), so I don't know what kind of places you have to stash amps, but I think that 2 smaller amps would be easier to hide than one big one. I plan on removing the passenger-side tool tray in my roady and mounting an amp or 2 there (seeing as how the M doesn't get a friggan jack anyhow).

If you don't feel like playing guinea pig on your stereo, I will be doing my stereo upgrade this summer, so you can wait until I do mine to see how it turns out.

The stock sub for the roadies and coupes is a pair of drivers in a small enclosure, and then powered by the same amp that powers everything else. What the hell was BMW thinking using that dinky amp to push 10 speakers? No wonder it's overdriven and sounds like crap.

Anyhow, the drivers in the OEM sub can be removed and replaced. I haven't read of many people doing this, since it's harder to find speakers for it, but I read of one guy using the woofers from a set of 5.25" components in that enclosure. If you are going to buy a set of components for the front anyhow, you might consider trying the woofers in the sub enclosure and see how you like it. If it sounds good, you would end up spending less on subs by buying a second component set (~$130) and just using the woofers, as opposed to spending $180 on bazooka tubes that you can't hide.

Either way, you'll need an amp. I don't have a coupe (unfortunately), so I don't know what kind of places you have to stash amps, but I think that 2 smaller amps would be easier to hide than one big one. I plan on removing the passenger-side tool tray in my roady and mounting an amp or 2 there (seeing as how the M doesn't get a friggan jack anyhow).

If you don't feel like playing guinea pig on your stereo, I will be doing my stereo upgrade this summer, so you can wait until I do mine to see how it turns out.

I see no reason to attempt to resuse the factory enclosure... It is a plastic box and it is ported and it is designed for very specific driver parameters. Unless you could find a driver that nearly exactly matched those parameters, I think it would be a recipe for wasted money and disappointment.

I single 8-inch sub should be plenty for the small cabin of the M coupe, and the fact that it is in the listening chamber is an added benefit. You could easily build a shallow box (~ 6-inches) that is a tall as the partition behind the seats and as wide as the cabin. Figure out what percentage of that box you need to get the required volume (my guess is half or less) and use the remainder as an amplifier/crossover rack. Do a 'beauty board' or something to hide the wiring.

Where the amp and the sub are in my pic, that whole shelf is available to me. It has a hard plastic enclosure thing, but I think I can figure out a way to make a new housing.

I don't think an 8" is gonna fit though.

It really looks like a perfect fit for a small amp, or two, if I build a small stack rack, and 1 or 2 small tube subs.

Thanks for the feedback. I need to get in there and see what I really have to work with.

I'd still like to do 4 speakers. The roof speakers seem like a pretty easy swap, and are going to be a good way to get 2 more round speakers in there.

So, I do have door tweeters, and they do seem to work.

Where the amp and the sub are in my pic, that whole shelf is available to me. It has a hard plastic enclosure thing, but I think I can figure out a way to make a new housing.

I don't think an 8" is gonna fit though.

It really looks like a perfect fit for a small amp, or two, if I build a small stack rack, and 1 or 2 small tube subs.

Thanks for the feedback. I need to get in there and see what I really have to work with.

If I was you, I would totally forget about trying to mount anything to that plastic shelf. IMO, it makes more sense to just remove the factory sub/enclosure, amp, and whatever else is mounted to the "shelf." Then, just build yourself a new box tall enough to sit on the floor and fit snuggly under the shelf, and then you can use the shelf as an anchor point for the box.

This has a few advantages, namely that you won't be hacking up a bunch of factory pieces (something to consider if you plan on selling the car down the road at some point) and I think the whole thing will look much neater and cleaner. Plus, you won't have to compromise on your sub and you can get whatever you like (although one 8-inch in a hatchback is going to be plenty, I think.

I'd still like to do 4 speakers. The roof speakers seem like a pretty easy swap, and are going to be a good way to get 2 more round speakers in there.

So, I do have door tweeters, and they do seem to work.

Why? You don't NEED any other speakers in there. A front stage only system will sound objectively better than running those speakers in the headliner. Rear speakers add complexity, they add power requirements, and they add cost. Plus, they detract from stereo imaging and soundstaging and make the sound not as good.

And you want to leave the HK tweeters in place in the doors?

You would best served to...

-Replace the headunit
-Replace the front woofers/tweeters
-Ditch all other speakers/amps/etc.
-Install an 8-inch sealed sub in the back
-Power all of this with a 4-channel amp

The Frankensystem that you are proposing is not going to be a recipe for hi-fi.

Remember, you asked for opinions. I am telling you that what you are proposing is not going to work very well. Of course, it seems like you pretty much have your mind already made up...

oh god no, my mind is anything but made up...I do want opinions, and I appreciate it.

I just noticed that I have door tweeters and they do work, I was listening to what comes from where today. No frankenstein system, I'll prolly pull all of it out.

There is a cover that goes over that shelf. I would love everything to fit under that. I was actually just going to remove it whole, and then fab a complete cover for it... it's not that big, and I don't want anything exposed anyhow. The hatch is where my dog lives.

oh god no, my mind is anything but made up...I do want opinions, and I appreciate it.

I just noticed that I have door tweeters and they do work, I was listening to what comes from where today. No frankenstein system, I'll prolly pull all of it out.

There is a cover that goes over that shelf. I would love everything to fit under that. I was actually just going to remove it whole, and then fab a complete cover for it... it's not that big, and I don't want anything exposed anyhow. The hatch is where my dog lives.

Help me understand what kind of space you have back there (I am not familiar with the hatch of an M coupe.) The cover that you are referring to... I assume it clips/screws to the shelf and then screws to those metal brackets that appear to be sticking out of the trim carpet about, oh 8-12 inches above the hatch floor? Is this correct?

Also, how deep is the space beneath the shelf? Finally, how deep is the entire hatch (from the closed hatch to the bulkhead?)

Envision this... take all of the stuff that is mounted under the shelk (amp, sub/enclosure, etc.) out of the car and replace it with a sub box/amp rack that would basically fill that space. The sub box should not need to be more than about 6-inches deep. So, at most, you are losing six inches of FLOOR space, but nothing when get up to the point where the factory cover piece would normally attach. Abandon the factory cover piece and design the top of the box to mimic it. Then with the tonneau cover in place (I assume M coupes come with a tonneau cover) the car would look almost totally stock. Plus, you'd hardly sacrifice any space for the pooch, although he/she'd have a subwoofer to rock out with.

Here is what I plan on doing to my coupe when I eventually get around to upgrading the audio.

For the headunit I have a 9855 but you can substiture the 9847 with the KCA 420i, it will match the interior well, light up amber, and offer you ipod integration. It should be a little under 200 for the headunit and a little under 100 for the adapter, so 300 total for the headunit and ipod adapter.

http://caraudiosecurity.com/shop/images/var/ALPINE-9847R-WITH-KCA420I.jpg

Next, I would tear out the sub box, stock amp, and cd changer. You can mount the kca 420i box where the stock CD Changer is located. For the speakers, I would recommend against running 2 sets of speakers, spend your money on one good set of components. I plan on picking up a set of Image dynamics Cx54 or 52, depending on what the amp can handle. Right now, I think they're around 300 shipped from www.sounddomain.com .

http://images.cardomain.net/products/ids/IDSCXS54_1.jpg

For the amp, I would look to get something that can fit where the stock sub box is, that way you'll never see it. I was looking at the Zapco REF1000.4. Assuming you can bridge the rear channels, I think you can but I would confirm, it will do 150 x 2 @ 4 ohms for the components and 500 x 1 @ 4 ohms for the sub. It is a pricey item though so you might want to find something else that will fit. It can be bought for $650 here: http://www.woofersetc.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=product.display&Product_ID=2379

http://www.woofersetc.com/images/products/2379.jpg

The dimensions of the amp are 23"L x 7.5"W x 2"H. I forgot to measure the area though under the cover when I had the car taken apart so thats just a guesstimate as to rather or not it will fit.

For the substage, I would go with a single 10" sub. When I do it, I'm going to put it in a fiberglass box in front of the left rear tail light, it should look clean, pretty stealth once its carpeted, and take up almost no usable space.. You have tons of choices for the sub, some good companies are Image Dynamics, Soundsplinter, Alumapro, Elemental Designs, DLS, RE, Adire, etc. When I do it though, I'll pry just end up going with an 11Ov.2 from Ed.

http://edesignaudio.com/Products/11Ov2Subwoofer/Gallery/DSCF0108.jpg

I hope this helps, any questions you have feel free to ask.

I just noticed that I have door tweeters and they do work

Yeah, we actually have 2 speakers in each door. A 1" tweeter and a 2" "midrange". You may as well replace the 1", since a component set will come with them, but the 2" probably isn't worth the extra wiring. I thought it might be cool to modify the speaker grill so I could mount something in that extra spot, but I can't think of anything that would make sense to mount there.

http://www.thelargeglass.com/bmw/rear.jpg
http://www.thelargeglass.com/bmw/hatch.jpg

That's a $2 bill.

I'm thinking about removing that whole plastic thing, and fabbing some sort of new shroud.

Or, maybe I should just steal this guys idea: link (http://www.368s.com/review.php?ArticleID=26)

some trans am guy on here had an m/z coupe setup for sale that was decent, and a new one he made that was really nice.

maybe search here and the f/s section will turn it up?

well, that guy did a great job I can say. And I think it's the best idea for you to do the same if don't want to use more trunk space.