Tonight I hung out with a friend from martial arts class. He's 65 years old and owns a BMW/MB/Mini mechanic shop. His car is the most awesome incarnation on 4 wheels I have ever ridden in. I wish I had taken some pictures. His car will be featured in some BMW magazine soon.

He had an S52 from a 1997 M3 in there, with OBD-1 electronics. Cams, CAI, 24# injectors, Lightened flywheel, some less restrictive cats (I guess from a 98 M3?), 6 spd gearbox, chip, Supersprint exhaust, and I'm sure I'm forgetting something. He said his motor was just under 250rwhp which is pretty good for a NA S52 motor as far as I'm concerned.

For suspension, he had some kind of coilovers which I forgot. Sparco seats. 17" rims with RA-1's. Some kind of Short shift kit. Shorter differential. Brakes from a Corvette C5. Sound system tuned to the Smooth Jazz radio station.

The best thing about this guy is that his car is not pristine. His car is for driving. It's not some baby that he pays someone else to work on, either. He assembled the entire thing himself through trial and error. He picked up the S52 motor because he found one at a good price that had been in a flood. He ended up building the entire motor and transmission over again before putting it into the car.

If any of you know San Francisco, you will have an appreciation for how old-school this guy is. We weaved out of the downtown area onto the highway (280 near the train station) and right away he let it open up. 1st, 2nd, and 3rd gear went by so fast I was so surprised. And sliding of hte rear end at every shift. This car was rock solid. The seats held me tight and as he punched the gas it actually hurt my lumbar area because the seat didn't conform to my back. We accelerated onto the freeway almost as fast as my motorcycle (VFR800) can do it. He knows the streets like the back of his hand, and he can go on for hours just talking about cars! He also has a very gentle philosophy on life but a violent/aggressive expectation from his cars. :)

Then there was an exit (Mariposa St) which is a 25mph exit. He takes it at 75mph and blips while braking down to 50 and then the car rails around the turn. Stop at a stop sign and let some other cars by, then we end up beneath an overpass with a straight shot heading back down the freeway (280S). He punches it and I literally feel scared. The car roared and revved so BEAUTIFULLY and so quickly. Before we're at the freeway merge, we're going about 100mph from what I can tell, but I'm too scared to really pay attention. The whole time he's talking to me about how he loves this car and he bought it to drive it, not to park it like a trophy. But it looks like a trophy in my eyes.

Anyway, we exit further down the freeway and he turns it around and takes us back to his shop. We hop into my car (E36 M3) and he drives it. It's so quiet, smooth, and refined. The sound is all coming from my intake and you can hear the motor working. The acceleration was not even close to his, although he said I had a strong motor!

His car was RAW. I loved it. This past week has been an adventure in car enthusiasm for me. I was able to ride in a lot of cool cars and drive a few: M Coupe, S2000, E30 M3, and IS350. I have decided that I love PURE, RAW cars. Who cares if they're loud, bumpy, and guzzle gas? I'm a new BMW owner. In fact, the reason I visited my friend was because my Check Engine light came on and I had no idea how to read it without a code reader. He hooked up his diagnostic machine and told me I had an Oxygen sensor that was responding slowly. He reset the fault and it went away. Free of charge.

Anyway, I had a great day and I guess I'm writing this in your forum because I wanted to document my great experience (my first ride) in an E30 M3... the original and best looking M3. :):buttrock

Man! That sounds absolutely awesome, I would love to ride in one of those beasts one day stock, I couldn't even imagine how crazy it must have been in that machine!

Yea, I hear you about the RAW cars, todays sport cars are really tailored to comfort as well, and it takes away from the whole experience, which is one reason why the E30 M3 is the lord of the rings. My friend has a funny philosophy for cars:
"If it's a rectangle with wheels, you can expect it to kick a lot of ass."
He basically means that well, old school cars were the real deal, and now they is just so much technology that the car pratically drives itself.

I want to get an E30 M3 one day, but I can only wish myself the best of luck...

I'll tell you what, after riding in this fixed-up E30 M3, S2000 and M Coupe, it makes my E36 M3 feel like a boat. I big boat, like one that that they ship cars overseas with.

I got about 30 seconds from completuing an E30 M50tuB25 swap, and grabbing some S50 cams to go with it, which probably would have put down 190 wheel with the usual chip and intake deal, maybe a bit less. Turned out the Engine had bad compression, and I was too broke to rebuild it after all the swap prep. Back to stock it went.

I wish I would have manned up and gone through with it now that I hear how sick the S52 was.

WOW! If that car is a handful at 250whp, I wonder what my friend's E30 will feel like with his 288 whp OBD1 S52! :redspot

:needpics

Personally I am of the philosophy that the E30 M3 deserved less engine weight than the s50 or 52. His setup probably undermines the car's driving characteristics. But it sounds like he gets much use out of it, and 250 hp in my car's chassis would be amazing! What'd you think of the M coupe?

Sounds like a hell of a ride. What is the name of his shop?

Hi Eric,

His shop is this small-azz shop near the last 280 exit (King St?). It's called Silver Star Auto. Give him a call or stop by some time. It was at Zoe street off Bryant between 4th and 5th.

About the 50/50 weight balance of the car, this car has all kinds of modifications including coil-overs. He probably corner-weights his car before trackdays judging by how meticulous he is.

Just to quantify how old school this guy is, he showed me a few parts he bought from Dinan. And when he said Dinan, he meant Steve Dinan, and he meant before he started the big company that it is.

By the way, he also owns a PIMP 2002 tii. I think he said he swapped the S14 into that car.

thats awesome man

Well it sounds great.

But dont forget that the S14 engine can be built to have 300 HP with less weight than the m52.

You can also increase the displacement to 2.5 liters.

so it all depends on what you want to do.

later,
J

True, but not all of us have the free $15k - $20k to do that type of project, nor do we feel like having a somewhat unreliable engine which wont last longer than 50k-75k miles in most cases.

A S52 can be built up to 300 hp easily, and with little additional stress on the engine itself. Cost-wise, it should't be more than $5k net, once the S14 and accessories are sold. Best part, it'll last 150k miles without major issue. And, short of all out racing, who the hell cares about "balance"? DE hero's dont impress anyone.

Will

Sounds like a fun time. Curious, what color combo was the E30?

His WHP sounds right on target. Sounds like the same kind of engine setup my '98 E36 M3 has and it's pulling 255 WHP. That E30 sounds like a blast.

It's all about makin' it raw, baby!!! :buttrock

///Marco

Hi,

He had Zinnotberry on the outside and black interior. He had some red/black perforated leather seats, though. They were damn comfortable and hugged really well. I kind of hate him for showing me all I'm missing.

Uber, can I check your car out sometime? I'm really curious what a "nice" E36 would feel like... because I'm having thoughts of switching platforms (E30 or Coupe)

Sounds really cool. I really want to see (feel!) his E30 in person.

Sure, I'm always up for showing people my car! :D

FWIW, switching to an E36 coupe (I'm guessing you have an E36 sedan) wont improve performance. Both cars feel the same. Mod the entire suspension and it'll be rockin'. Going to an E30 M3 would be damn sweet though. I really want to add a silver on gray E30 M3 to my garage!

///Marco

where in berkeley are you from? i go to school here so maybe i have seen your car around.

yeah, his name is Fred and he is nutts about cars. He can talk to you for hours and hours and hours about cars..cars...cars... his original s14 motor went into his 2002.
His e30m3 is fast, but he's got US S52 in it, wait until you drive an e30m3 with euro s50b32 (almost 100 HP more stock)... talk about the torgue and power difference. Say, can you imagine 380 HP e30M3?

I have 268whp in my car and its insane, but i cant wait until i can save up the money to buy a s/c


Some people say you ruin the e30 m3 by removing the s14, but honestly the s14 is too expensive to maintain, and ridicolously expensive to make 300hp out of it, pricing it out it just showed me it was not in my price range

I rode in a Stock bodies E30 with a S52 in it back in 1999 at Gateway tech..HOLY CRAP! it was a monster! I have a nice E30 Body sitting at my shop that needs a restoration. If it wasn't a rare 91, I would drop an S52 in..But It's going back stock.. Bright Silver with the Black interior, has 60k on the clock.

An S14 is god awful expensive to get 300Hp out of..My 2.5 Race motor coat almost as much as a nice E30 M3..If it dies...I'm putting in a S52 2.8 all aluminum motor, weight same as the S14.

What S52 2.8 all aluminium engine is there?

There is a S52 that has an iron block. Or there is the M52TU all aluminium 2.8 that has 190 hp.

It might not be a S52. It came in the 2.8 Z3. I saw the inside of one at GateWay Tech. The motor is unbelievably overbuilt. It has all kind of internal reinforcements. Looks more like a block that should be in an M car.

2.8 Z3 is the block described above....M52BTU. You can use a 3.0 crank to get it to 2.9 liters, and then have a ton of fun with the head to get some nice power out of. It'd make a killer DMod cars as some have suggested on this board in the track forum.

Sure the weight is the same, but its where you put the weight that matters.

Will

Pete Mchenry actually weighed both S14, and the M52tu and they are almost identical maybe a few lbs heavier on the M52tu. He figured out using a lighter altenator and made them even.

Actually a guy does run a 2.8 in D mod in a E30 325, bright yellow with dayglow green flares . It's not pretty but it's very very fast.

you have to have custom pistons made for the 2.8 with the M3 crank.

You mean Siccardi?

John Siccardi, yes. Not pretty cr but light and fast. Removing weight is a huge advantage!

I have 268whp in my car and its insane, but i cant wait until i can save up the money to buy a s/c


Some people say you ruin the e30 m3 by removing the s14, but honestly the s14 is too expensive to maintain, and ridicolously expensive to make 300hp out of it, pricing it out it just showed me it was not in my price range

widm3r....where are you located in LI? I have to see your car man, I fell in love with it the first time I saw your sig. E30 M3's are the hottest cars ever Period.

yeah, you will see it, although the s14 is lighter, if you corner balance your car, it will handle just as well with a s50, instead of having the s14 in. i also think that the s50 is just more easy to maintain, and can handle alot more, and plus if you want to go f/i, which i do. The s14 is the most expensive engine to put f/i into, and also i want a s/c for the clean powerband and not a turbo so, the s14 just wasnt the platform for me

where in berkeley are you from? i go to school here so maybe i have seen your car around.

Yo, I actually hail from Daly City but I'm a grad student at UC Berkeley... electrical engineering. I hardly ever drive my M3 to Berkeley... I hate parking it and getting it all dinged up. Recently bought a Miata and I will probably do my first FI project with that car. I just couldn't see myself tampering with the perfect combination of power, reliability, and economy of my S52.

In fact, after buying the Miata, I am leaning towards selling my E36 and picking up a lighter, more pure car. Either M Coupe or E30 M3.

Riding in the E30 really opened my eyes to the world of raw handling and raw power. When I drive my M3, it truly feels like a boat compared to the Miata. If I can get 180hp out of the Miata, goodbye E36 M3.

Pete Mchenry actually weighed both S14, and the M52tu and they are almost identical maybe a few lbs heavier on the M52tu. He figured out using a lighter altenator and made them even.

Actually a guy does run a 2.8 in D mod in a E30 325, bright yellow with dayglow green flares . It's not pretty but it's very very fast.

you have to have custom pistons made for the 2.8 with the M3 crank.

Yeah, weight shouldn't be much different. I weighed my E30 M3 at the same time my friend did his (and he has an M52 in his E30 M3, pending the S50/S52) swap and the cars weighed roughly about the same. I was pretty amazed and even more motivated to do the S50 swap.

Last night this same friend and my brother went out crusing and when they got onto the free way, from around 2nd gear they both punched it. Both cars are pretty heavily modded. It was 2.8l vs 3.0l and SURPRISINGLY my friends 2.8L was able to pull ahead and maintain his distance. I definately have a lot more respect for that engine now.

I coudn't imagine a 3.2l Obd1 in an E30 M3 :buttrock

I coudn't imagine a 3.2l Obd1 in an E30 M3 :buttrock

Or an S54 that I am almost finished with.

Tony

^ :worship: :worship: :worship: :worship: That swap is just plain sick.

-Serge

^^^more pics please....that looks sickkk

awesome shoehorning... looks like you even have room to spare!

s50/52/54 conversion, I'd take it anyday vs 2.5 claimed 300 hp souped up s14

Reasons of longevity, ease of finding parts and requires less maintenance

6 cylinder power is just so smooth...nigh and day difference:)

Your doing a s54 swap, that is just madness, how are you fitting it in there?

I hate to one up anybody but I went for the ride of my life as well. I saw a e30 m3 in my town that I hadnt seen before, (theres only 4 or 5 of them) Anyways, I saw it at the autoparts store when I was leaving so I went back in and asked one of the two guys in there if it was his. He said yes it was and I continued by telling him it was nice. He said "wait until you see the motor" He pops the hood and there is an LS1 Z06 Corvette motor. He was an older guy and was more than happy to take me for a spin on the freeway. That car sounded amazing as you can imagine. Im sure someone will raise the B.S. flag on me but go right ahead. That had to have been the biggest smile Ive ever had. I think he was just as excited as I was. It is his daily driver and said the swap went really smooth.

Nah, there should be no BS flag thrown on your pos Mpowerd88, because there is a site that sells those swaps

There is? do tell...

I dont remember the site name, but they do z06 swaps, and then a bunch of jdm engine swaps, for easy, cheap power in an e30, all though it is a hybrid car, its still fast as hell, i wouldnt do this route because it isnt a bmw anymore really, id rather swap another bmw engine in???

I remember reading about it on the e30 3 series forum

sounds sick....

If you do an engine swap, will it pass smog here in Kalipornia?

Im not familiar with the laws in california... but in ny you are aloud to replace your engine with a newer engine, but im not sure if it matters if you use another engine that isnt built by the same company

I actually did some research. We are allowed to use a newer engine of the same car/body style. In other words only s14 engine. I hope I am wrong.

that sucks, i hope its not going to be a problem when i move out to california, maybe just get the car registered in a different state.

Hmmm..... All I need is a 6speed and a lightened flywheel and im set

good luck with the install!!!

Sounds like quite the beast!

We did build/rebuild 300hp S50 motor for E30 M3 there some pics on my site.
that thing is bad ass !!!
edva

Or an S54 that I am almost finished with.

Tony

That is suicidal dude.

Once I get done with my S50B32 conversion (yes Euro 3.2) I will be keeping my eyes open to trade it for an S62.

Excuse me but you rode in an E30 M3 with S52 engine...you did not ride in the original E30 M3 as far as I'm concerned. Not taking anything away from your friends car but you really need to ride in a track prepped E30 M3 with a 300+HP S14 and short gearing to see what this car is all about and how it was intended. I think you'd be surprised.

I was just driving my friends E30 M3 the other day, they are such a blast, truly makes me miss my S50 318is. Once I'm done with college and hopefully make a decent income I'm going to search for a lachsilber E30 M3 and restore/engine swap etc. I felt the same thing when getting back in my E36; big, quiet, felt like a 5-series.