First of all, let me start by saying that i just completed my e30 s50 m3 transplant. I got the best deal ever on this engine/tranny combo which included wiring harness, ecu and a dinan stage II chip all for $1700. I do notice that is pings in 3rd fourth and fifth at wot and there is also a hiccup (loss of power)somewhere at around 5500 rpms.

Anyways back to the race. I get the onramp and noticed a car tailgating real close. I can also hear that he had an exhaust. Once we get on the freeway, I hear him go wot and so do I. I was actually surprised on how smooth the acceleration was. Keep in mind, that this freeway is at the desert with no traffic. He was still behind until we started hitting triple digits at which point, he moved to the next lane to make his pass. He finally flew by me ay 125 mph. My m3 ran out of legs as I still have the stock gearing for the e30 m3 which is 4.xx. None the less, that s2000 was quick.

At times like this, I wish I would of had my turbo m3. Once my rebuilt is complete, I'll look for him again.

Man you should of killed that S.

E30 are so light compared to the E36. The E36 give me a close run but I always dawg them by a half a car or a nose. The S2k gearing for the highway is 4:10 and 4:44 dending on years. Good luck next time though.

that will be awesome when you get better gearing! Sounds like a fun car to own!

S2000's are sik wid it!

Man you should of killed that S.

E30 are so light compared to the E36. The E36 give me a close run but I always dawg them by a half a car or a nose. The S2k gearing for the highway is 4:10 and 4:44 dending on years. Good luck next time though.

All I know is that s2000 was quick at triple digits. From what I already heard, he does have chip/software intake and exhaust. I gotta give it to him, he even gave me thumbs up. To make matters worst, his top was down.

That s2k must have been sc'd.

Yea when I ran an S2000 a while ago I was dead even with him on the highway starting in 4th gear up to 120 or so. The S2000 had exhaust and intake that I know of and I think I just had exhaust when this happened. They are verry impressive for a N/A 4cyl car.

Dutch was the top up or down when you ran him?

All I know is that s2000 was quick at triple digits. From what I already heard, he does have chip/software intake and exhaust. I gotta give it to him, he even gave me thumbs up. To make matters worst, his top was down.


They dont really make software for the s2k. You wont see any power gains from it unless you spend 1200 dollars on a stand alone AEM ecu.

S2000's are really quick, especially from a roll when they are in lift. This lift intelligence on mant Japanese cars is very useful. My friend has a Mtrix XRS with a Magna Flow Exhaust, and an Injen CAI. He's running High 14's, but from about a 60 MPH roll, he's even with me when he's in lift, and his car sounds great when it is in lift as well.

Sorry guys, while they are nice cars, S2Ks are turd style. Im slower than slow. Ive driven several of them, and none have impressed me at all. Ive raced quite a few back in the day, and got to the point after the 4th or 5th one I didn't even bother. At CP we did blower kits on a few of them, I got the opportunity to check those out and they were a bit better, but even then not what I would call fast. Sorry, just my crappy opinion. But good runs regardless. :cool

S2000's are really quick, especially from a roll when they are in lift. This lift intelligence on mant Japanese cars is very useful. My friend has a Mtrix XRS with a Magna Flow Exhaust, and an Injen CAI. He's running High 14's, but from about a 60 MPH roll, he's even with me when he's in lift, and his car sounds great when it is in lift as well.

What do you mean by "in lift"?

I raced one with my ZHP coming from Costco and was neck in neck. He was definitely trying and so was I, even though I didn't start in a good gear (4th). He had the top down and a girlfriend and I had the trunk full with Costco stuff. We raced to 125mph or so.

I wasn't really impressed, as I was expecting to get beaten - I attributed the draw to his poor aerodynamics with the top down over 100mph. Or maybe he started in the wrong gear as well, which is worse for him than it is for me.

adc
03 330 ZHP

What do you mean by "in lift"?

I raced one with my ZHP coming from Costco and was neck in neck. He was definitely trying and so was I, even though I didn't start in a good gear (4th). He had the top down and a girlfriend and I had the trunk full with Costco stuff. We raced to 125mph or so.

I wasn't really impressed, as I was expecting to get beaten - I attributed the draw to his poor aerodynamics with the top down over 100mph. Or maybe he started in the wrong gear as well, which is worse for him than it is for me.

adc
03 330 ZHP

Lift is Where all the horsepower is on a Matrix XRS. Its kinda weird idea but it works until the person has to shift out of it. Basically a matrix has no power until it reaches 6200 RPMS where all its horsepower and torque is. They call it lift because u feel an extra large jerk back when u hit the lift point.
Many cars like Acura and their vtec have this vvtli (variable valve timing and lift intelligence)

Isn't it just VVTi and not VVTLi?

Isn't it just VVTi and not VVTLi?

VVti is different from vvtli. One has lift the other doesn't. VVTI comes standard with the Matrix XR, but what makes the Matrix XRS so special is that it has VVTLI which includes lift,

In case anybody cares here's the real story behind the toyota system. http://www.corollaperformance.com/TechInfo/VVTLi.html

Ugh. I just spent 5 minutes reading about Corollas. =(

The S2K pulls very hard at higher rpms. They don't have enough torque though for launches as fast as the bimmers.

The S2K pulls very hard at higher rpms. They don't have enough torque though for launches as fast as the bimmers.

Right....

Although S2k's are hard to launch, they're rated at low to mid 5's. That's what E36 M3's do.

Sorry guys, while they are nice cars, S2Ks are turd style. Im slower than slow. Ive driven several of them, and none have impressed me at all. Ive raced quite a few back in the day, and got to the point after the 4th or 5th one I didn't even bother. At CP we did blower kits on a few of them, I got the opportunity to check those out and they were a bit better, but even then not what I would call fast. Sorry, just my crappy opinion. But good runs regardless.

S2k's weren't built for straight line speed. That's why they chose a lightweight 4 cyl engine in a 2800 lb body. Next time you get to drive one, I hope it's at a track or an auto-x.

I can't wait till next year's auto-x season starts again. :evil2

yep

how much power do S2Ks have?

Standard Engine 2.0L 240 hp I4
Horsepower 240 @ 8300 RPM
Torque (lb-ft) 153 @ 7500 RPM

0-60 : low to mid 5's
1/4 mile : high 13 seconds. (although our member, Silverstreak banged out a 13.6, I think?)

....S2k's weren't built for straight line speed. That's why they chose a lightweight 4 cyl engine in a 2800 lb body. Next time you get to drive one, I hope it's at a track or an auto-x.....



You are correct my friend. But for those of us who live life a 1/4 mile at a time (or even live life from a 60 bump :D ) strait line is where its at. And as you said, the S2K is not a strait line car. Thats why I put that in there about that just being my personal, crappy opinion. :cool

You are correct my friend. But for those of us who live life a 1/4 mile at a time (or even live life from a 60 bump :D ) strait line is where its at. And as you said, the S2K is not a strait line car. Thats why I put that in there about that just being my personal, crappy opinion. :cool

Yes, granted it is a crappy opinion, but you must also drive crappy. An S2K is not slow if you know how to drive. Lauch it around 6k rpm and drive it like you stole it.

I thought all S2k's were supercharged from the factory.

I thought all S2k's were supercharged from the factory.

No, just regualr fuel injected. 10,000 rpm red-line helps.

Holy crap, where do you guys get your info from?

Honda (like BMW) has yet to make a factory FI auto. Also, the S2000 has a 9000 rpm redline.

Yes, granted it is a crappy opinion, but you must also drive crappy. An S2K is not slow if you know how to drive. Lauch it around 6k rpm and drive it like you stole it.
You better believe that man knows how to drag race. I've never lost to an S2k, be it from a dig with the drivers launching the piss out of them, or from a roll. But the fact of the matter is I'm sure Phanta would consider my car or your car slow as well.

That s2k must have been sc'd.
^^^^^

Thats the most reasonable assumption so far.

Yes, granted it is a crappy opinion, but you must also drive crappy. An S2K is not slow if you know how to drive. Lauch it around 6k rpm and drive it like you stole it.


If you look in the sig, you'll see my old Camaro, notice the kind of power it made and the times it ran. It was about the slowest car in my group of friends that I rolled around with, ranging from my high-12 sec car on down to a few low-10 sec vehicles. Working in the fast car business for the last 3 years, Ive built and assisted on dozens of vehicles making well over 400 rwhp up to a couple of 3rd Gen Vipers and C5 Vettes making well north of 700 rwhp.

That being said.....I find the S2K REALLY FRIGGIN' SLOW. I can drive just fine thanks. But anything with 155 lbs/tq, thats just pathetic. Keep this car on auto-X or road course and Im sure its well at home. In a strait line, its not even in the ball park. As I stated, even the two Ive dabbled with that we put blowers on were still not what I would call fast cars. Im sure to someone who the fastest car they've driven to date is an E36 M3, the S2K is plenty fast though. :cool

Honda (like BMW) has yet to make a factory FI auto.
BMW's actually made two factory FI cars.

The 2002 turbo:
http://www.bmw2002.co.uk/turbo.htm

And the 745i. (E23 style) I can't find a good page of just this car, but it was a special 7-series with a turbocharged M30 engine that was only sold in South Africa. They've imported a few of them into the U.S. as grey market cars.

BMW's actually made two factory FI cars.

The 2002 turbo:
http://www.bmw2002.co.uk/turbo.htm

And the 745i. (E23 style) I can't find a good page of just this car, but it was a special 7-series with a turbocharged M30 engine that was only sold in South Africa. They've imported a few of them into the U.S. as grey market cars.

The 745i was actually sold in Europe too. Saw plenty around when I was living there...

And let's not forget that in Europe, roughly 50% of all BMWs sold are diesels, and 100% of those are turbocharged. So BMW has been making FI cars for about 40 years now...

adc
03 330 ZHP

But anything with 155 lbs/tq, thats just pathetic.

Well that makes sense, I should have know what type I was talking to. The muscle car guru. Its OK I love torque too, and no, I've never driven a muscle car (unless you'd call an 84 Mustang a muscle car, but I wouldn't). If I had a 12 second anything I'd think an S2k to be slow...but your posts will become unoriginal real fast if you keep interjecting "that car is so slow...compared to my old Camaro". I get it, you're a drag racer (a good one as I've heard), and you can't imagine owning a 4 banger, and I'm actually surprised you own an import, that is ussually forbiddon. Maybe I have you mislabeled, and I'm sure you understand that the S2k doesn't have any power under 6k rpm...due to its low displacement high reving nature, but to call it slow for what it is just seems ignorant to me.
Eh, whatever, I love all things automotive, so rock on!:buttrock

comparing it to your old camaro.. well too bad now all you have a acura CL...

my CURRENT non-m e36 did 13.4@97... so yeh... who cares what you did before in ur "what i had" car... s2k's are real nice cars.. i personally wouldn't buy one because i dont like the styling of it as much as i like BMW roadster styling... u say lack of torque... dont knock it till you drive it... when that v-tec kicks in and you keep revving past 6k which you aren't used to... u start feeling REAL good....

cars have their own aspects... hondas make great power with small engines... domestics rely on cubic inches to make power/torque.. having a lighter, smaller engine gives hondas the edge in cornering...

back to the subject


sounds like a good race.. but get those hiccups figured out and get the turbo m3 back out on the road :)

-Sam

I agree with the last two posts.

But this really is comparing apples to oranges. The M-series and the S2000's are at home on a road course. The camaro belongs on the drag strip. You get the camaro on a road course, the M3/S2000 will TEAR it UP. The same goes for the camaro, if the M3/S2000 were on the drag strip.

So the point I'm getting to is (as it's already been stated), Phanta-Z, although I respect your opinion, it really has no value, as what you're comparing really cannot be compared at all. The only fair "comparison" you can give is, if you were to take the camaro and the S2000 to a road course, as well. I'm not going to call the camaro slow, because I can pretty much blow it out of the water on a track. You get your rush from drag strips, and I get mine on a track. Different preferences, thus different cars. Both excel at their own games--so lets respect each other's cars for what they are and go on our way. :cool:

The M-series and the S2000's are at home on a road course. The camaro belongs on the drag strip. You get the camaro on a road course, the M3/S2000 will TEAR it UP.

I used to think like this, until I was torn a new one by a well driven automatic T/A at Summit Point. :stickoutt

Now I'm the first to admit I ain't no Mario Andretti, but that car was pretty quick at the track. A 6sp manual would have been quicker still, because the guy was complaining about the auto box... :eek:

My understanding is that they're not as refined, nor as fluid, nor as balanced as an M3 or S2000 - but I'm convinced they DO handle.

adc
03 330 ZHP

Well, that's your fault! :D

I'm not saying their boats, but there is a reason why they're classed well below S2000's and M3's. :)

None of you have ever driven an S2k. The car has souls and the torque is not much of an issue. Its all in the gearing I've beaten cars with more toque. LT1 Crapmero , Mustang GT, Evo on the highway and E36 M3s(Stock E36 M3's all day).

S2k and M3 belong where the drivers want them. On S2ki there are people running 11.2's on stock street tires no slicks.

None of you have ever driven an S2k.

I have...

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y220/shinpaul/Picture006.jpg

:D

Too bad she's put away for winter... :(

For the guy who said BMW has never made a F/I car he must have forgotten about the M1 twin turbo beast from the 70's none the less ,2002 turbo,plenty of turbo diesels, and many euro spec cars that were turbo.

I drove an S2000 its a fun little car it handles good and has decent pull throughout the rpm range, best thing about the car is the handling. One thing i didnt like was the fact that it sounded like a suzuki 650 V-twin motorcycle engine and the fact it sounded like it was gonna blow up.

For the guy who said BMW has never made a F/I car he must have forgotten about the M1 twin turbo beast from the 70's none the less ,2002 turbo,plenty of turbo diesels, and many euro spec cars that were turbo.

Yeah, I did forget, which I was reminded of once already. I'm deeply sorry. Can we move on now? :rolleyes

The only fair "comparison" you can give is, if you were to take the camaro and the S2000 to a road course, as well. I'm not going to call the camaro slow, because I can pretty much blow it out of the water on a track. You get your rush from drag strips, and I get mine on a track. Different preferences, thus different cars. Both excel at their own games--so lets respect each other's cars for what they are and go on our way. :cool:

Ehhh, LS1 camaros aren't the "straight line POS" they're always made out to be. I'll just leave it at that.

I have...

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y220/shinpaul/Picture006.jpg

:D

Too bad she's put away for winter... :(

Heh me too I love your lip...

http://www.we-todd-did-racing.com/wetoddimage.wtdr/wMTEzNDg0NTZzNDEzZGZkMzF5NTQx.jpg

I'm with phanta on this one, if you have to wring out all the power like a dishrag it's not as much fun. I need more torque too.

I'm with phanta on this one, if you have to wring out all the power like a dishrag it's not as much fun. I need more torque too.

Peeps are all different:D I was actually kinda disapointed with how much torque I had in my M3 in the low revs. I'm actually building her up to breath better up high. M50 is next!:).....once I get this F'in kid to send me the manifold I bought two weeks ago!!:mad F'in internet people

I used to think like this, until I was torn a new one by a well driven automatic T/A at Summit Point. :stickoutt

Now I'm the first to admit I ain't no Mario Andretti, but that car was pretty quick at the track. A 6sp manual would have been quicker still, because the guy was complaining about the auto box... :eek:

My understanding is that they're not as refined, nor as fluid, nor as balanced as an M3 or S2000 - but I'm convinced they DO handle.

adc
03 330 ZHP
But you can bet it took a lot of suspension work to make it go in the corners like that. With the aftermarket, you can get a lot of cars to handle. However, spend x amount on bimmer suspension as well as x amount for the f body, it's not secret that the bimmer will handle better. Same with stock for stock. Plus that driver must have been quite good.

For the guy who said BMW has never made a F/I car he must have forgotten about the M1 twin turbo beast from the 70's none the less ,2002 turbo,plenty of turbo diesels, and many euro spec cars that were turbo.
Ummm, the m1 did not have turbos. The concept version, however, did have a 2L turbo 4, but that never came close to production

Holy crap, where do you guys get your info from?

Honda (like BMW) has yet to make a factory FI auto. Also, the S2000 has a 9000 rpm redline.
O5's are 240 @ 7800 rpm, with an 8000rpm redline, and displacement was increased to 2.2. More torque was the goal, and ironically enough, that's the statistic I can't remember at this moment.

An s2k's are usually mid to 0-60 cars, due to their picky, high strung engines at launch. But yes, Dave did a 13.66 (beats me how he did it, must've have been towed by a viper!), which does translate to a quick 0-60, but usually it's around 5.5 - 5.7.

Yeah, you're right about the 05's(I always think of my car when someone mentions S2000). 04's the first year that they came with 2.2L engine. The performance is about the same (although, the 04+ models have been tested to be a smidgen faster), but the torque is a lot better down low. The suspension was also redone to be more subtle and stable (lots of people were getting tail-happy).

I've seen the S2000's in the 13.7-9 range consistantly--especially with the AP2's (04+), so that Dave guy's time is realistic.

O5's are 240 @ 7800 rpm, with an 8000rpm redline, and displacement was increased to 2.2. More torque was the goal, and ironically enough, that's the statistic I can't remember at this moment.

An s2k's are usually mid to 0-60 cars, due to their picky, high strung engines at launch. But yes, Dave did a 13.66 (beats me how he did it, must've have been towed by a viper!), which does translate to a quick 0-60, but usually it's around 5.5 - 5.7.

The real advantage is in the 05 gearing not so much the engine.

But you can bet it took a lot of suspension work to make it go in the corners like that. With the aftermarket, you can get a lot of cars to handle. However, spend x amount on bimmer suspension as well as x amount for the f body, it's not secret that the bimmer will handle better. Same with stock for stock. Plus that driver must have been quite good.

Stock suspension, track tires.

I say, until you run some twisties against one with a decent driver... if all you've ever experienced are the BMW boards, you are in for quite a surprise...

YMMV

adc

Stock suspension, track tires.

I say, until you run some twisties against one with a decent driver... if all you've ever experienced are the BMW boards, you are in for quite a surprise...

YMMV

adc

Wow...even though r compounds will help alot, i'm still impressed. But then you could say the same thing with an ace hotshoe in the bimmer.
Still, nonetheless...

The real advantage is in the 05 gearing not so much the engine.
Ah, I didn't know they changed that.

Ah, I didn't know they changed that.

Closer gear ratio and 4:44 final drive vs the 4:10 in the 2000..

So your more likely to be in your power band in an 04.

Heh me too I love your lip...



Trade you for your wheels? :D Nice color choice. :cool

my CURRENT non-m e36 did 13.4@97... so yeh... who cares !

-Sam13.4@97mph What are your mods and do you have a slip? That's a pretty impressive time at that mph for a non M E36!Most cars that run that kind of time are doing 104mph and up.Very impressive!Please share...

comparing it to your old camaro.. well too bad now all you have a acura CL...

my CURRENT non-m e36 did 13.4@97... so yeh... who cares what you did before in ur "what i had" car... s2k's are real nice cars.. i personally wouldn't buy one because i dont like the styling of it as much as i like BMW roadster styling... u say lack of torque... dont knock it till you drive it... when that v-tec kicks in and you keep revving past 6k which you aren't used to... u start feeling REAL good....

cars have their own aspects... hondas make great power with small engines... domestics rely on cubic inches to make power/torque.. having a lighter, smaller engine gives hondas the edge in cornering...

back to the subject


sounds like a good race.. but get those hiccups figured out and get the turbo m3 back out on the road :)

-Sam

Dude thats modded....A Civic can run 12's NA but it doesnt matter because its modded. My friend will be running 12.5's NA all day soon. Now he runs 13.3 an engine with no enghine management and no head work. Its just a motor stroked to a 2.5 with an AFC. He recently got individual throttle bodies, AEM stand alone ecu, A good header and exhuast and ect. He currently is making 250 WHP but all of this should put him at 300 hopefully.

13.4@97mph What are your mods and do you have a slip? That's a pretty impressive time at that mph for a non M E36!Most cars that run that kind of time are doing 104mph and up.Very impressive!Please share...

13.4 at 97 mph = he had traction... traction = friction = lower traps, etc...

13.4 at 97 mph = he had traction... traction = friction = lower traps, etc...I'd really like to know the 60ft that was pulled as well.

I did run a 13.3 in the Benz @ 102mph R/T was .500 .People were surprised that I ran a low 102mph @ that ET and pulled a 2.0 60 ft.

I was not happy with the mph which I thought was low.


So basically a good launch can result in a lower mph?

There were cars that have run 13.4 -13.6 @ 105+.I could not understand it.

Yeah, a good launch can result in low traps.

Example- with my old Z3 3.0 when it was stock. On stock rubber it ran a 13.89 at 99.5 mph with a 1.8x 60' time.

On drag radials, same day, same track, etc... 13.65 at 99.1 mph with a 1.6x 60' time...

Yeah, a good launch can result in low traps.

Example- with my old Z3 3.0 when it was stock. On stock rubber it ran a 13.89 at 99.5 mph with a 1.8x 60' time.

On drag radials, same day, same track, etc... 13.65 at 99.1 mph with a 1.6x 60' time...:eek: Damn man! 1.8 on street radials and 1.6 on DR's ,that's some launch DAVE!
So basically a low 60 ft and great RT can result in a low mph.I hope that means I should not feel bad.I figured the low mph may have to do with some loss of pwr in the higher rpm range or something.Hence losing some topend power due to chip tuning. Chappy's CLK55 did 13.3@109mph with a 2.0 60 ft., but he had cooler weather.Would this also result in my car having a higher mph due to cooler weather conditions if I ran the same, .500 RT and 2.0 60 ft Dave?

Totally depends. Cold dry air can produce higher traps, and at some tracks cause slippery conditions, etc... it really varies, and can be hard to predict...

Totally depends. Cold dry air can produce higher traps, and at some tracks cause slippery conditions, etc... it really varies, and can be hard to predict...Hhmmm yes that would be another factor to consider.Temps in the mid to low 60's seem optimal,especially for the track don't you think?

Well E-Towns season is over and I'm still down here in Louisiana.I'll have to wait till March when I believe they open the track back up.Thanx Dave for the info!Happy Thanksgiving!;)

PS my head is still struggling with the poster's 13.4@ 97mph.His 60ft must have been 1.6 to 1.8 as well.Fantastic traction or DR's.

yikes dave, 13.65 w/ the z3 3.0? Nuts...

Totally depends. Cold dry air can produce higher traps, and at some tracks cause slippery conditions, etc... it really varies, and can be hard to predict...

I wanna know what you can do with an E36 M3.

Why did that engine/transmission transplant cost 1500????... ahh not working all that good.

Why did that engine/transmission transplant cost 1500????... ahh not working all that good.
Nothing wrong. It showed 82,000 miles on the odometer. The car was going to get smashed at the junk yard.

S2000. suck. wait , what happend in that post? hahaha/ submit that nonsense. dude, frickin post the quick reply