Hey,

I am pretty sure I am going to my first autoX the 7th, at ed's suggestion :stickoutt. What can I expect, especially since I am going in a stock 318i? I don't want to look like a total fool but thatll be kinda hard considering I have no experience with this type of thing! :)

Someone with some experience share how your first time at an autoX was.

J

Don't worry about it. There are ususally lots of novices there and plenty of people to help you. Put about 40psi in your tires all the way around. You'll tear them up if you run normal street pressures. You'll walk the course.... try to picture driving it in your car. Walk it as many times as it takes to memorize it. Wnen you drive, it will be harder than it looks. Just remember, slow into the corners and fast out!

Make sure that u take everything out of ur car before you go so u dont have anything sliding around inside to distract u.

How did the "first" autocross go??

hey thx for the reply, its not until Sept. 7th

Rule of thumb (From my autocross this weekend)...

no matter how much faster you think you'll go... DON'T downshift into first...

I'm hoping my poor engine will forgive me... (7.2 k over-rev)

-Scott

The San Diego chapter autocrosses are geared for the beginner so don't worry about looking like a fool. Even us veterans look like fools sometimes (hit cones, spin out, get lost on course, etc) so you won't be alone. We usually have a LOT of first-timers at these events so don't worry. Here's a link to an Autocross for Beginners article i wrote:

Link to Autocross for Beginners article (http://bimmer.roadfly.org/bmw/forums/e30/forum.php?postid=986728&page=4)

If you have any questions just post em here and i'll answer what i can.
http://home.earthlink.net/~randylwalters/_uimages/Autocross-LABMWCCA6-8-02RightFrontleveledorig.jpg

The only newbies that I've run into that look like total fools are the ones that come to the event with an attitude, that pull stupid stunts like burnouts, donuts, hotrodding around the paddock, and don't pay attention to what's going on because they're too busy trying to pose as badasses.

Leave your attitude at home, go there, talk to people, have fun. Gawk at people's cool cars. Help setup the course, chalk cones, etc. Go ahead and talk to all the intimidating hard-core people, the ones changing tires and unloading trailers - they all remember when they were newbies, too, and more likely than not are willing to give you tips, pointers, walk the course with you, maybe even ride along with you or let you ride with them...

One thing to remember is that if you don't ask, you won't get. If you want help/rides/info/coaching, be sure to ask someone who looks like he knows what he's doing. If you're shy and just wait around for someone to offer, it probably won't happen...

Have fun,
Jim

I'm autocrossing with the SDBMWCCA next saturaday as well, this will be my 2nd autocross. It seemed like 40%-50% of the drivers were in the novice class at the autocross 2 months ago. As far as the first autocross it's kinda stressful, but the instructor drives you around the track in your car and talks the track over, then you drive for 3 laps. later you drive 4 timed practice laps and then later you drive your 3 timed laps. I didn't do great but I did better than I expected I cut about 4 seconds off my time between my 1st timed practice run and my best timed run, I would have been 8 seconds faster but things went wrong at the end of my last run and I hit a few cones and had some time added to my score. Anyhow it was a lot of fun. If you want to talk to another novice feel free to drop me a line or look for me at the autocross I have a silver 98' 328i.

Walk the course several times. Memorize it. You'd be suprised how suddenly you forget to go left or right at full speed. :D

I agree with everyone here. Just don't drive ten tenths and you'll be fine. As always, there will be practice runs, so get to know the course better that way before you get timed. Just say f**k it to whomever talks s**t to you. Autocrosses are for you, so just have FUN.

Originally posted by Dinan325ic
As always, there will be practice runs, so get to know the course better that way before you get timed.

Practice runs? Where do you autocross?

At SCCA autocrosses here in the Southeast and even at Nationals, you only get 3 or 4 runs and they are all timed. The "real" skill and challenge in autocross is to learn to drive the course fast in only 3 or 4 runs.

There are often "fun runs" at the end of an event. It is amazing how much better you get when you have run the course 6 times. Like I said the challenge is running it fast by the third run!

I plan to do my first autocross in a month or so. What class would I be in with these mods?

chip
intake
exhaust
coilover suspension
X-Brace
non-hinged Strut brace
235/40/17 tires (I understand past a certain width changes a class?)

I mean, I don't want to be put in some class where I will get my ass handed to me. As a novice is there a separate class regardless of modifications?

Originally posted by M3inSC
Practice runs? Where do you autocross?

San Diego BMW CCA runs autocrosses more like a cross between a safety school and an autocross. According to their web site, they practice all morning, with in-car instructors, etc., then have the option of doing timed runs in the afternoon. A much different format than all of the more competition-oriented autocrosses that I've attended.

Just about all of the autocrosses that I've competed in give you 3-6 timed, competition runs to start with. If there's time at the end of the day, you may get to do fun runs, which are timed but don't count as part of the competition.

Jim

Originally posted by Jed
I plan to do my first autocross in a month or so. What class would I be in with these mods?

chip
intake
exhaust
coilover suspension
X-Brace
non-hinged Strut brace
235/40/17 tires (I understand past a certain width changes a class?)

I mean, I don't want to be put in some class where I will get my ass handed to me. As a novice is there a separate class regardless of modifications?

Classify your car either online at the BMWCCA (if you're going to this one) webpage or at the autocross.

Originally posted by Jed
I plan to do my first autocross in a month or so. What class would I be in with these mods?

chip
intake
exhaust
coilover suspension
X-Brace
non-hinged Strut brace
235/40/17 tires (I understand past a certain width changes a class?)

I mean, I don't want to be put in some class where I will get my ass handed to me. As a novice is there a separate class regardless of modifications?

You don't say what model car you have, but with your mods, your would be in Street Prepared with SCCA Autocrosses. In stock class, you cannot have an intake, non-stock wheels, non-stock springs, or the strut brace. If you are serious about autocross, SCCA Solo II is the only game in town.

There is a novice class where the times are Paxed. That means there is a multiplier that is applied to your time to compare novices in different classes.

For example, if you had an E36 M3, your would be in B Street Prepared Novice and would compete only against other novice drivers.

Hope this helps. If you are doing a BMW or some other organization's autocross, I can't help you.

Originally posted by Jed
I plan to do my first autocross in a month or so. What class would I be in with these mods?

chip
intake
exhaust
coilover suspension
X-Brace
non-hinged Strut brace
235/40/17 tires (I understand past a certain width changes a class?)
What car are you driving? What club is holding the event? Most car classification is club-specific - as far as I know, SCCA is the only club with nation-wide classification rules. Different chapters of the BMW CCA each have different rules for classing cars, and different names for their classes. Local clubs often have their own classification rules, too, but many of them base their classes off the SCCA rules, with some minor local tweaks.

I mean, I don't want to be put in some class where I will get my ass handed to me. As a novice is there a separate class regardless of modifications? Some clubs/regions/chapters offer novice classes. Others don't. Rules and classes for novices all vary depending on what the group putting on your specific event has implemented. So, your best bet on this one is to check with whatever group is organizing the event you plan to attend.

One other thing - if it's your first ever autocross, and there are any of the more serious/experienced folk there, expect to get your ass handed to you. Heck, even guys who have a ton of track experience (both races and HPDEs) come on out and usually get smoked at their first event. But don't take it too seriously - just have some fun, get better from run to run, and before you know it, you'll be hooked just like the rest of us! :D

Jim

I have a 1994 325is. I plan to do BMWCCA and SCCA.

Man, I am getting nervous. I don't want to look like a jackass out there. My greatest fear is getting lost on the track. Oh well, I am just going to do it for fun and learn more about my car.

Originally posted by Jed
I have a 1994 325is. I plan to do BMWCCA and SCCA.

Man, I am getting nervous. I don't want to look like a jackass out there. My greatest fear is getting lost on the track. Oh well, I am just going to do it for fun and learn more about my car.

Don't worry! Most clubs encourage novices and there are generally lots of first-timers out there. Lots of people, even experienced ones will hit cones and go off course. Most experienced people will be glad to help you and give you advice. Ask an experienced person to ride with you or ask if you can ride with them.

Heck, when you spend all day for 4 minutes of seat time, its the socializing that makes it interesting.

You don't say what model car you have, but with your mods, your would be in Street Prepared with SCCA Autocrosses.

I see by Jed's profile he has a 94 325is, so the X-brace makes the car illegal for SCCA's Street Prepared class.

Autocross Short Course

1. BEFORE YOU START:

a. Empty everything out of the car.
b. Start with a half a tank of gas. Each extra gallon of gas cost you about one horse.
c. Put 40 psi in the front tires.
d. Torque your BMW lug nuts to 72 psi.
e. Remove or lower your windscreen.

2. ARRIVE EARLY:

a. Introduce your self to drivers with cars like yours.
b. Tell them this is your first autocross.
c. Ask them if they would not mind walking the course with you.
d. Ask them if they would ride with you?
e. Ask them if you can ride with them?

3. WALK THE COURSE.

a. Look for braking points.
b. Look for the late apex. Ask someone to point out the late apex.
c. Look for corners that when linked are really straight lines.
d. Look for the line that uses the entire course.
e. Sometimes looking back helps show you the line.
f. Look beyond the next corner.
g. In an optional direction shalom, think about how you want to enter and exit.
h. Walk the course again.

4. THINGS TO REMEMBER:

a. Remember the traction circle.
b. Remember balance and weight transfer.
c. Make your seat belt very tight by tightening and them moving seat forward.
d. Move the rear view mirror out of the way so you can see right hand turns.
e. If one end is lose add 2 psi to the tires in that end.
f. Between runs check to make sure the tires are not rolling over onto the sidewalls.

5. DRIVE THE COURSE.

a. Start with minimal wheel spin.
b. Shift to second at redline.
c. Use your ears, if you hear tire spin or tire squeal your times will be slow.
1. If spinning the rear tires gently lift off the gas.
2. If pushing the front tires, gently lift off the gas or gently touch the brakes.
3. Immediately after correcting the problem gently get back on the gas.
d. Use your eyes, look very far ahead. You should be looking at the next corner apex before you leave the last corner apex.
e. Be smooth. Smooth is fast. Be smooth on the gas, brake and steering wheel.
f. If you have traction control, turn it off.
g. If you have ABS break early enough not to need the ABS. Save your ABS for when you discover that you missed your braking point and need a little extra stopping power.

6. CORNERS:

a. Autocross (like all races) is won in the corners. The faster you come out of a corner the faster you will be at the end of the straight.
b. Start your turn while still breaking, while the weight is still on you turning wheels.
c. Make "J" turns not "C" turns
d. The apex is later then you think.
e. In corners remember "slow in fast out".
f. If your pushing on the exit of a corner, remember "J" turns & "slow in fast out".
g. If you spin both feet in. That means put in the clutch and the brake.
h. Some corners are just slow. So take them slow and move on.
i. Some corners require a downshift to first.
j. Each shift will cost you about .2 seconds.
k. Unwind the steering wheel at the apex on corner exit.
l. As you unwind the steering, the gas pedal goes smoothly to the floor.

7. FINAL THOUGHTS:

a. If your just starting out, the only time you want to beat is your own.
b. A good driver (seat time = smooth) is more important then car set up.
c. Have fun.

8. HOMEWORK READING ASSIGNMENT:

a. To see what an autocross is all about see http://www.ner.org/soloII/whatis.html
b. For detailed information about autocross see http://www.tirerack.com/features/solo2/handbook.htm
c. For information about driving at an autocross you might like to take a look at http://www.bmwmseries.com/xcross1.html
d. For detailed driving information you might like to take a look at http://members.home.net/rck/phor/

9. EXTRA CREDIT READING:

a. Secrets of SOLO RACING, by Henry A. Watts. ISBN Number 0-9620573-1-2.
b. Speed Secrets, Professional Race Driving Techniques, by Ross Bentley. ISBN 07-603-0518.
c. Inner Speed Secrets, by Ross Bentley. ISBN 0-7603-0834-9

Lester
1999 ///MRoadster

PS: Jim O. here was my first autocross instructor. He is one of the good guys!

Originally posted by randywalters
I see by Jed's profile he has a 94 325is, so the X-brace makes the car illegal for SCCA's Street Prepared class.
Unless the E36 325 convertible used the X-brace - then the update/backdate rules apply and the X-brace is legal. I know the E36 328 convertible came with the X-brace, but that's not a legal update/backdate since it's on a different line in the rulebook. If someone can take a look at the ETK, it should be pretty easy to see if the X-brace was used on the 325 convertible...

If it's not a legal update/backdate for a 325, then it looks like the X-brace is illegal for SCCA's STS and STX classes also. So, the only classes left are Street Mod, or E Mod.... Looking at the rules, the legality of the X-brace in Street Mod is questionable, too, so you may get stuck straight into E Mod, where you would be terribly uncompetitive if an actual E Mod car came out and ran.

If the X-brace wasn't used on a 325 convertible, I'd recommend removing it, so you can run in either Street Prepared, STS/STX, or Street Mod.

Jim

Originally posted by Lester
Lester
1999 ///MRoadster

PS: Jim O. here was my first autocross instructor. He is one of the good guys!

Hi Lester! Thought you forgot how to autox, once you started racing Spec Miatas!

:D
Jim

Jim:

Autocross sure is a bunch safer.

I got over $3,500.00 in damage at Thunderhill in a race in June.

I kissed the wall in trun 8a at Sears Point a week ago, but no real damage except to the paint.

Racing is rubbing!

The real problem is right now I'm sooooo slow! For once I would like to finish in the pack like I do in ASP in the ///MRoadster!

Lester

Josh,

Besides Randy's write-up, here's one I did specific to San Diego events.

http://www.sdbmwcca.com/Firstautox.html

It would be more informative if the links to the pics weren't goofed..... Sigh.

Hey Jim,

Thanks for the link AND THANKS SO MUCH for the EXTENDED use of your garage :). You got so much Lumpia coming your way you might have to give some to Alley!!

Ohhhhhh and we can sign up for the bmw club there too? Cool I don't have to do it online!

Ohhhhhh and we can sign up for the bmw club there too? Cool I don't have to do it online!

Since you're not a member yet, you may not be able make it into the event. They limit entries to the first 80 BMW CCA members, then if the event doesn't fill up with members by like 8:00 am they fill the remaining slots with non-members who are anxiously standing by waiting to see if they get in or not. They admit these non-members in the order that they first arrived so if you want the best chance of making it in then you have to have your car in line at the stadium by like 6:45 am ! We usually have up to 5 non-members make it in so being the first non-member there gives you the best odds of course. Once you're accepted then you simply join the club while you're signing up for the event. At the last event my non-member pal came along with his new/used 2001 M Coupe and he was able to get in (he had guest card #2) - because we were at the front of the line that morning !

Another way might be to join the BMW CCA over the phone if possible (like first thing tomorrow morning), then have them fax you an official letter stating that you're now a member along with your new membership number, then bring that letter as proof. It takes a month or three to get your actual membership card......

Im planning on going on the 6th too. This will be my first time as well, so you wont be alone. I need to figure out how to bolt some stereo stuff down in the car before sat. morning.

since Im obviously not in a stock class, am I gonna get stuck with a bunch of pros??

oh, i dont have a helmet, do they rent them there?

Im planning on going on the 6th too. This will be my first time as well, so you wont be alone. I need to figure out how to bolt some stereo stuff down in the car before sat. morning.

since Im obviously not in a stock class, am I gonna get stuck with a bunch of pros??

oh, i dont have a helmet, do they rent them there?

The event is on Saturday the 7th, so don't show up Friday :-)

I presume your "332i" has a modified 6 cylinder engine. If the car is an M3 then it goes into the M-Modified class (MM), but if the car started life as a 325i or 328i then it will go into D-Modified against my mildly modified stock-engined E30 325is :-)

The club does have helmets for rent, but they sell out early and there's never quite enough to go around due to the high number of beginners so if you want to rent one you'll need to be there early. If you can borrow one from a friend that might be better. It must have a Snell 95 or Snell 2000 rating sticker on the inside under the inner liner. If it's not Snell 95 or 2000 then you won't be allowed to use it.


http://members.roadfly.com/randywalters/Lagoon+PDR+LFa+am.jpg

ok, I b etter get there early. My car is originally a 325, so I guess Im with you. I have no expectations to do well though, the car is built better then I can drive. Im just curious what the car can do, and wanna try it safely!! What time is a good time to get there? IM driving from orange county

Saturday will be my first Auto-X too, if I can pass tech, join the club, and get in line early enough!

Qualcomm, here I come...

ok, I b etter get there early. My car is originally a 325, so I guess Im with you. I have no expectations to do well though, the car is built better then I can drive. Im just curious what the car can do, and wanna try it safely!! What time is a good time to get there? IM driving from orange county

I try to be in line before 7:00 am to make sure i get in. I drive 125 miles to get there so i'd rather be a half hour early than one minute late :-) Do you know how to get to Qualcomm Stadium? It would suck to get lost for 30 minutes then arrive too late to get in :-(

Oh and by the way, we run rain or shine so you might want to prepare accordingly. 70 mph in the rain on bald race tires is a total blast :-D

http://members.roadfly.com/randywalters/SD+AX+Pits+3+E30s+3-30-02+b.jpg

http://home.earthlink.net/~randylwalters/_uimages/Autocross-SDBMWCCA12-08-01RearShot.jpg

http://members.roadfly.com/randywalters/Autocross+-+LA+BMW+CCA+6-8-02+Left+Side.jpg

looks like fun. My front tires are getting very thin, will they fail me ont he tech inspection? I've never been to qualcomm, but I guess I can look for directions online.

psk145:as long as your tires aren't corded then you will usually pass tech.

looks like fun. My front tires are getting very thin, will they fail me on the tech inspection?

Oh it's a ton of fun, if you like intense driving :-) An autocross course is tighter than just about any canyon road you've ever been on so things happen very very quickly on course. It's a pretty damn intense minute and a half of driving. You'll see :-)

Read up again on all the autocross links, it'll make your day go a little better.


My front tires are getting very thin, will they fail me ont he tech inspection?

Well-worn shallow-tread street tires are much better for autocross than deep-treaded new tires are. The SCCA guys who run in the Stock Tire classes actually get their brand-new street tires shaved and save them for autocross only. They're faster when they're balding :-)


I've never been to qualcomm, but I guess I can look for directions online.

No need. Here's directions to Qualcomm Stadium from L.A. and Orange County:

Take the i-5 Southward past camp Pendleton and past Oceanside
and stay in the left lanes and you'll end up getting dumped onto the
805 south, then continue south for 10 miles then transition to the
8 east (toward El Centro), stay in the right lane for about one mile
and watch very carefully for the tight right 3/4 circle transition ramp
to the 15 North, as if to go to Riverside. Then go a little less than
a mile north and get off at Friars Road West (it says Stadium).
This 3/4 circle offramp dumps you onto Friars Road where you'll
immediately go through one signal and then you take the first
offramp to the right (instead of continuing under the overpass).
At that light take a left and go up over that overpass and down
into the stadium lot's main entrance gate.


It's about 75 miles South of the junction of the 405 and i-5 (El Toro Y)

In my bone-stock GTi at my very first autocross ever:
http://home.earthlink.net/~randylwalters/_uimages/GTi-AntelopeValley-Feb87a.jpg

Same car (albeit fully modded :-) 10 years later right before i retired it:
http://home.earthlink.net/~randylwalters/_uimages/GTi-SD-Tour-98-Pit1.jpg

Randy...must...check...email...important...questio ns...I'm...worried...

:D
:mdrbig
:emo

Randy...must...check...email...important...questio ns...I'm...worried...

What do you mean? I checked my inbox and the last email i got from you was a week ago and i replied to it right away. Or do you mean you have to check *your* email? :dunno

Originally posted by Rollen318i
Hey Jim,

Thanks for the link AND THANKS SO MUCH for the EXTENDED use of your garage :). You got so much Lumpia coming your way you might have to give some to Alley!!

Lol, thanks J!! You can't make me eat lumpia if I don't want to!!

:nono

Originally posted by randywalters


What do you mean? I checked my inbox and the last email i got from you was a week ago and i replied to it right away. Or do you mean you have to check *your* email? :dunno

Hmm. Pacbell might be on the fritz. I know for a fact it's not working at all tonight.

I sent one on Tuesday. I've PM'd the text to you!

Hmm. I take that back. Apparently you're un-pm-able :)...I used BF.C to email it to you, but here's the text as well...

-------

Randy,

That settles it! I was either going to enter the Autocross or put a deposit
on the Ronal's, but I suppose the wheels can wait another week :). I'm going
to join the club and etc. this Saturday morning, then...my dad thinks it's a
good idea that I get the experience...

Do you think having a smaller tire will affect me that much on Saturday? My
right rear is a 195/65 and the rest are 200/60's, but the spare is a 200/60
and while that rim is shot I could go to Discount and have them mount the
spare on one of the good rims...if you think it's that big a deal. If not
I'll just save the cash they'd charge at Discount and get my deposit in on
the Ronal's that much sooner...

Also speaking of tires, my right front tire has a very small nail in it. It
doesn't leak air, or at least hasn't in the 3 weeks I've owned her...but
will this disqualify me as a safety hazard? Is it worth worrying about?

I agree that the front of your car could be a bit lower. Overall, how much
of a drop is that from stock? How much should I expect to spend to get my
car as low as yours...I don't need the same spring stiffness, I don't think,
but I would like it to be the same height...and any recommendations? The car
has new Bilstien HD's, and I swear they seem like
they raise the car a bit...not that I've known it any other way, but it's
just so darn high!

See ya on Saturday!

Ben

--------

----> Click Here for link To Official San Diego Chapter Autocross Info <------ (http://www.sdbmwcca.com/articles/autocrossnew.htm)

Countdown to AutoCross: 5 hours.

I'll be there around 10:30-11ish. For those that aren't "in the know", that means I won't be driving...the combination of having to drag my dad down to Qualcomm at 7am to sign release papers (I'm only 17), driving on almost bald rear tires (one of which is a 195/65 where the other three are 205/60's), and having nails in the front two tires really just turned me off.

I'll get up early and give her a good vacuum, then Klasse her and install the new rear speakers and then bring her down to watch...so if you guys check this thread before you leave, I'll still see ya down there. Look for the guy with the white BMW shirt and red ///M3 hat...

The one upside of this is that it got me to join the BMWCCA...so now I have something else to do with my Tuesday nights :)...

Well I was there today... and from what I saw (I was there around 1 or so...) it was a pretty good autoX with a lot of good runs. I got the sweetest ride in a Honda S2000 Holy crap those things are fast. I only have one bruise on my elbow from when the instructor spun out and I slammed against the door...hm. Anyway I have some pics from the AutoX of just the cars that I liked anyway. I'll prob. post some up later.:) A lot of them are of the porsche though... Sorry there was an AutoX for porsche on the other side of the stadium... I couldn't resist. So Josh (rollen318i) drove me over to check them out. I'll post those too anyway even though my dad will prob. put me in timeout for posting non-BMW pics.:p

This car I think was one of the fastest in the MM category. Who I might add beat out Ed (AgileM3) with an 82.*** I believe.:)
I like the black...

Here was one of the nicest z3's there.... Sorry the pics are bad, but half of these I took were taken while I was in another car moving and/or hard to get a good angle with. I had to get other cars to move out of the way or move chairs and people away to get pics or plain just ask the people sitting in the cars (porsches' mostly) if I could even take a pic of their car... So yeah I'm not a photographer...bare with me.

Here are some pics of cars that were there, but weren't Bimmers...

:devillook

It was fun, even though I didn't end up driving. Randy, thanks for putting up with my questions! :)

EDIT: Destiny is my girlfriend. :D

Wait did I see you there, you parked next to a black jetta, go figure, and I was on a cell phone when you got out of your car or something, i was parked next to eds m3 and was hanging out right there, I think that was you if your girlfriend is a brunette or maybe im tweaking.

looks like a good turnout. I got back from class late last night, and I didnt have time to bolt down the things I needed to on my car. Hopefully next time. Any more pics?

Originally posted by Rollen318i
Wait did I see you there, you parked next to a black jetta, go figure, and I was on a cell phone when you got out of your car or something, i was parked next to eds m3 and was hanging out right there, I think that was you if your girlfriend is a brunette or maybe im tweaking.

Yep, she's the hot brunette :D...

I was looking for your 318 but I didn't see it...but Ally says you were the dude in the flip flops hanging out by Ed's M3...so I shoulda introduced myself...oh well, at the next one I will...

I joined the club on Friday...so maybe I'll see you at a meeting every now and then if you join...?

Yes, I have more pics but I think a lot of them now are Porsche. Here is a corvette that showed up.

yea i need to join, but yea if you see me just walk up and say hey

Cool. Hopefully I'll be getting BF.C windows on my rear quarter windows in the next two weeks...so look out for a 325i with them running around town...

This guy was really nice to stop in the middle of the road as I ran him down to beg for a pic of his car, lol. It was really shiny and pretty and a kick ass porsche so yes. In the background in the Black Jetta is Josh (rollen318i) and in the backseat is Tyler.

I liked this porsche too...it did really well in their Auto-X...not like any of you BMW people care, but yeah...:p

nice pics alley :)

thanx for pointing out where u were in the pic ben, like we could really tell its u.........:rolleyes:

LOL. I was just doing that cause Ally said she didn't see me there...even though I was standing RIGHT next to her for a while...

Happy to help :)...

Cause I didn't see you there. There was this guy that sourta looked like you, but it turned out to be too tall to be you. I never saw you.

I was like 15 feet from you. Twice. I pointed you out to Destiny. How could you not see me...

A few more pics...

I dunno whats with all the green porsches....

Under the hood of my soon to be z3...:)

The other coupe that was pretty fast, but not as fast as the other black coupe.:(

Sorry this is a bad pic, but you can still see the car. I was in the front seat of Josh's Jetta hanging out the window (pulling a Marita :p) taking this pic as we were both backing out of parking spots, lol. I caught it just last minute before we turned.

Another Porsche pic....