I got my car back yesterday afternoon-
Im on 66 last night heading into DC, moderate traffic... Im cruising on the right lane (slow lane) and I notice these head lights behind me - behind me for several moments. The approching of a left bend, he turns into the left lane and blasts right by... This 8er was modified, sounded nuts with even my windows up... He atleast had an exhaust, not sure about anything else...
So he flys by me, gets through a few cars infront...then i wait for him to be stuck behind another, and do the same, but diliberately downshift right beside him *the gruppeM is a beautiful sound*. I accomplish that and coast up ahead, until....he rapidly turns into my lane and begins to get on my bumper... (As i was side by side with him, i saw his girl in passenger look over- then he looked over once i did the downshift) so i knew he was up to something... we get to a striaghtaway point on the hgihway inside a lighted tunnel... at the beginning of this tunnel we are side by side again, and there is this truck probably 6 car lengths infront. so, i drop gear, we're going maybe 75-80 *cruising*... I jump the rolling start, he immdiately follows... The gruppeM is echoing his exhaust growling- even with the windows up, lots of noise. So I jump the rolling start, and im half a car ahead, then he qucikly gains by 1 meter, back to being side by side. we keep going and I am still leading, but we approch that truck, he is the one in the truck's lane- i continue to floor it, but suddenly he passes me in an instant, then he squeezes right infront of me to go around the truck. We are going maybe 125 at this point and im right behind him now, and there is a up sloped right bend that seems very sharp because of the middle wall (in the center of the highway)- so i take that turn at like 115mph and just notice him pulling further away, even during the turn..he just keeps going... I lose him after a few moments, and begin to cruise... as im getting to this light, the guy is pulled over by a cop....
So I got beat by an 850..., it was black so i couldn't see exactly which 850 it was, but it was much quicker than the m3.....

-the new suspension is lovely, btw ;)

no shame losing to a manual v12 :)

You should've pulled him into a gas station and offered to buy his car; coming across a car like that is like finding a needle in the Pacific Ocean. Manual 850 = Beauty.

That car is worth MONEY.

Wow, I did not realize how fast they were. Nice run.

I saw a nice one today in Boston not sure if it was manual though. It was white and looked oh so good.

drool...

Yep - though it's been posted here a few times, here's a link to some 850csi vids: http://e31.org/videos_e.html

One amazing vehicle, without a doubt. I guess the closest thing BMW has to it now is the M6 (actually surpassing it in HP, less weight, and handling), however the 8 series lines are much more beautiful.

Wow, I didnt know the 850's were that fast either... hmm...

Isn't there a twin turbo 850 in the DC area? I don't think a normally aspirated 850 is that much faster than an E46 M3.

Isn't there a twin turbo 850 in the DC area? I don't think a normally aspirated 850 is that much faster than an E46 M3.

BMW 850CSi 5.8 14.1

Me thinks twin turbo... Nice encounter

Isn't there a twin turbo 850 in the DC area? I don't think a normally aspirated 850 is that much faster than an E46 M3.
I think your right!

My manager at my restaurant had one, but auto but with dinan aftermarket parts. He let me drive it around when i was around 16 years old. It was a cool car, i really liked it, and did feel quick, but not as fast as an e46 m3 imo. He regrets ever selling that car now.

Could it have been "John in DC" with his crazy twin turbo 850? sounds like it was fast

Could it have been "John in DC" with his crazy twin turbo 850? sounds like it was fast

Need more info.

Love to put a twin turbo on my 540i

Yea im pretty sure this one was the manual v12...The normal v8, im not sure would have pulled like this one did.

-it sucks he got stopped...he probably had illegal exhaust, because in that tunnel his car was all I heard, and my windows were closed (his exhaust outdid the gruppeM noise)

Wow, I did not realize how fast they were. Nice run.

I didn't either... They seem like heavy coupes, such as the 645... But This one was most def modded and he probably had performance tires, because the rears look as big as tires on a diablo.

When he passed, I felt as if i was driving a 318.... :rolleyes

its okay though :D

there's no shame in being passed by a monster like that. One of those in a tt would be tons of fun.

wow, didn't know the 850 was that fast.... now I wish I can make a run with the 850 even more :drool:

The v12 850's are fast in a straight line, once they're up to speed, but off the line and in the corners, an E30 will eat them alive -- they're extremely heavy and they were built for luxurious cruising, very much like the E24's that they replaced.

The only difference is that BMW raced the E24 and much of that engineering technology filtered into the aftermarket world, but since there wasn't ever an M8 or a campaigned E31 chassis, race-tuning an E31 would be prohibitively expensive.

was the 8er aerodynamic?

I think that was John, he has a black 850 twin turbo and I think its an auto not a manual, and is from the DC area. i am going to ask him.

Wow, I did not realize how fast they were. Nice run.

That thing is certainly NOT STOCK

Oh yea, it wasn't stock at all, and sounded as if it could outrun an M5...

Aerodynamic? The guy had ACS type IIs, (with the big lip) and the quad exhausts were looking like Dinan Tips...not exactly sure. Now that I remember, the car was debadged.
I think I put up a decent challenge, perhaps some of you could have/ would have done better with my car...but i'll be the first to tell you, that I suck at dragging. :D

LOL Damn, THe 8series looks so bad ass. The most sporty looking bimmers made I think.

I remember a few months ago, I saw one (green) with a V12, I thought it was fake. I didn't realize bimmer had an 850 OR a V12 until then. I do know, I only saw the guy make a right hand turn onto Fairfax County Parkway and it sounded mean as hell.

LOL Damn, THe 8series looks so bad ass. The most sporty looking bimmers made I think.

I remember a few months ago, I saw one (green) with a V12, I thought it was fake. I didn't realize bimmer had an 850 OR a V12 until then. I do know, I only saw the guy make a right hand turn onto Fairfax County Parkway and it sounded mean as hell.

hey did you go to that "megameet"?

hey did you go to that "megameet"?
hell yeah, we have 2 threads about it on fanatics. We had 30 bimmers driving like asses down 495 and then 95. It was so great. I did a 9 1/2 min video. They had one pic of 495, all you could see was bimmers ahead. it was so beautiful. We had the best roll in. We rolled hard to that thing. We didn't have the biggest group, once everybody showed up to the thing, but we definately rolled the deepest.

MEGA MEET V PICS!!!! (July 02 2005) (http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=273197)

MEGAMEET PICS! NO 56K!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Seriously... (http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=273260)

hell yeah, we have 2 threads about it on fanatics. We had 30 bimmers driving like asses down 495 and then 95. It was so great. I did a 9 1/2 min video. They had one pic of 495, all you could see was bimmers ahead. it was so beautiful. We had the best roll in. We rolled hard to that thing. We didn't have the biggest group, once everybody showed up to the thing, but we definately rolled the deepest.

MEGA MEET V PICS!!!! (July 02 2005) (http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=273197)

MEGAMEET PICS! NO 56K!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Seriously... (http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=273260)


thats cool- I actually went to Tysons II at around 7-730 to see if i would catch you guys...but all i saw there were like 6 or 7 hondas and a few acuras having a "vtec" meet im assuming?? there was an Mcoupe parked away from them, but it was obviously not part of the fanatics megameet. So I guess I missed out

my car was fresh too, just had it Ziano'd

You should've pulled him into a gas station and offered to buy his car; coming across a car like that is like finding a needle in the Pacific Ocean. Manual 850 = Beauty.

That car is worth MONEY.Manual 850s only came as model 850Csi, with a v12 that displaced alot more power then the normal 850i.

thats cool- I actually went to Tysons II at around 7-730 to see if i would catch you guys...but all i saw there were like 6 or 7 hondas and a few acuras having a "vtec" meet im assuming?? there was an Mcoupe parked away from them, but it was obviously not part of the fanatics megameet. So I guess I missed out

my car was fresh too, just had it Ziano'd
we rolled out like right at 7. It was great, we had two full rows of cars parked. We may have stayed till like 7:10 at latest. When we rolled out of the parking lot, people were dumbfounded at the line of cars leaving. I'm telling ya, you don't know what you missed man. That is all anybody could talk about. You really should come out to meets. We are trying to have it now, that whenever we do a meet, we have a couple of "pre meets" and we drive places. Because we all love the drive, but we can only stand around bsing so long. So we are starting to try & plan either multiple "meets" with 30-45 min drives in between, or maybe a meet, then a long drive, to go eat or something, and then drive back.

we rolled out like right at 7. It was great, we had two full rows of cars parked. We may have stayed till like 7:10 at latest. When we rolled out of the parking lot, people were dumbfounded at the line of cars leaving. I'm telling ya, you don't know what you missed man. That is all anybody could talk about. You really should come out to meets. We are trying to have it now, that whenever we do a meet, we have a couple of "pre meets" and we drive places. Because we all love the drive, but we can only stand around bsing so long. So we are starting to try & plan either multiple "meets" with 30-45 min drives in between, or maybe a meet, then a long drive, to go eat or something, and then drive back.


That sounds really good... You guys should meet in like Tysons and do a cruise on rte 7 over to the sterling area... Lots of really good roads for small races and whatnot- also good scenery for foto shoots.

I may come through to a meet or so, but im leaving town in a week.

Manual 850s only came as model 850Csi, with a v12 that displaced alot more power then the normal 850i.


Not true, there are many manual 850i's, and very rarely 850ci's. Not nearly as much as auto but they certainly exist in an attainable number.

Well...John in DC's Twin Turbo has 444 HP and 524 ft-lbs of torque at the REAR WHEELS at a mare 6 PSi of boost (Which he plans to increase to 12 PSi). It also has suspension upgrade with ///Mwrench Camber plates, K-Bar Sway bars, H&R Springs, Bilsteins, etc. He however has Stock tires and exhaust (Atleast 2 weeks ago he did). However, he can outcorner, outaccelarate almost anything on the road.

His Videos:
Dyno tuning = http://tinyurl.com/8epm7
Autocross befor the Twin Turbo setup = http://tinyurl.com/apc7m

Here is the 840 Hellraiser with 0 to 100 MPH in 9.9 seconds.

http://tinyurl.com/8v69m

Mine is a DINAN8 (Barely got the 10 points) that does 0 to 60 in 6.3 Seconds and ¼ mile in 14.005@105.38MPH. I just finished the suspension upgrade that should outcorner Minis now (Video to come soon). And hopefully by next year I plan to get 550 HP at the Crank.

Video Befor Suspension upgrade = http://tinyurl.com/8zey3

Too bad it is not a drop top. I still like my ///MZ3 or sunny days in DC Metro.

Well...John in DC's Twin Turbo has 444 HP and 524 ft-lbs of torque at the REAR WHEELS at a mare 6 PSi of boost (Which he plans to increase to 12 PSi). It also has suspension upgrade with ///Mwrench Camber plates, K-Bar Sway bars, H&R Springs, Bilsteins, etc. He however has Stock tires and exhaust (Atleast 2 weeks ago he did). However, he can outcorner, outaccelarate almost anything on the road.

His Videos:
Dyno tuning = http://tinyurl.com/8epm7
Autocross befor the Twin Turbo setup = http://tinyurl.com/apc7m

Here is the 840 Hellraiser with 0 to 100 MPH in 9.9 seconds.

http://tinyurl.com/8v69m

Mine is a DINAN8 (Barely got the 10 points) that does 0 to 60 in 6.3 Seconds and ¼ mile in 14.005@105.38MPH. I just finished the suspension upgrade that should outcorner Minis now (Video to come soon). And hopefully by next year I plan to get 550 HP at the Crank.

Video Befor Suspension upgrade = http://tinyurl.com/8zey3

Too bad it is not a drop top. I still like my ///MZ3 or sunny days in DC Metro.


thats a fast car....

- him or not...this 850 outcornered and outaccelerated me just as well

The v12 850's are fast in a straight line, once they're up to speed, but off the line and in the corners, an E30 will eat them alive -- they're extremely heavy and they were built for luxurious cruising, very much like the E24's that they replaced.

The only difference is that BMW raced the E24 and much of that engineering technology filtered into the aftermarket world, but since there wasn't ever an M8 or a campaigned E31 chassis, race-tuning an E31 would be prohibitively expensive.

Umm!! It was done with the 840.

http://www.clube31.net/forum/album_pic.php?pic_id=319
http://www.clube31.net/forum/album_pic.php?pic_id=320
http://www.clube31.net/forum/album_pic.php?pic_id=321
http://www.clube31.net/forum/album_pic.php?pic_id=322
http://www.clube31.net/forum/album_pic.php?pic_id=323
http://www.clube31.net/forum/album_pic.php?pic_id=324
http://www.clube31.net/forum/album_pic.php?pic_id=325

Also to note that the BMW Motorsport did campaign the E31 Chasis and the result was the 850 CSi. There is only 1 M8 in the world that was a prototype pulling 550 HP and later that engine went to Mclaren F1.

http://www.e31.net/modelle_e.html#M8

Sorry...I had to correct. I will stop posting anymore as I just realized that this may not be the proper board for all this information.

Wasn't me, gentlemen. I would point out, though, that a stock 850 will eat an E46 M3 for lunch at 60+ MPH. I ran with one several years ago from 60 up to 150+ MPH indicated and he was unable to keep pace.

It's the torque that does it. The 5 litre V12 has gobs of it.

However, the E46 M3 will easily spank the 850 in the twisties and from 0-60. Rgds...

Wasn't me, gentlemen. I would point out, though, that a stock 850 will eat an E46 M3 for lunch at 60+ MPH. I ran with one several years ago from 60 up to 150+ MPH indicated and he was unable to keep pace.

It's the torque that does it. The 5 litre V12 has gobs of it.

However, the E46 M3 will easily spank the 850 in the twisties and from 0-60. Rgds...
lol you or not, I wanna see pics of your car. :stickoutt

Wasn't me, gentlemen. I would point out, though, that a stock 850 will eat an E46 M3 for lunch at 60+ MPH. I ran with one several years ago from 60 up to 150+ MPH indicated and he was unable to keep pace.

It's the torque that does it. The 5 litre V12 has gobs of it.

However, the E46 M3 will easily spank the 850 in the twisties and from 0-60. Rgds...


hehe :D
noo kidding :(

lol you or not, I wanna see pics of your car. :stickoutt

Here's a link to my last TT project update...
http://bimmer.roadfly.com/bmw/forums/e31/5870543-1.html

Happy to entertain any questions you may have. Rgds...

Ahmed:

Let's calm down a bit. Sway bars, shocks/springs, and camberplates won't trim 1700lbs from the 850. An 850 with all those goodies will NOT out corner a stock Mini Cooper. Sure, it may handle well enough to take advantage of its power on the straights but simply stated the Mini will always be able to carry more speed in a corner. Having spent enough time on the track chasing them in my M5 with all the suspension mods and R compound tires, I speak from experience. You can make a big BMW handle very well because of their weight distribution but you can't overcome physics.

Well...Take a looksee. Look at the roofline of both cars and tell me the physics. This was done many a times.

http://www.bmwe31.com/images/Sears_7701%20Small.jpg

http://www.bmwe31.com/images/Sears_6807%20small.jpg

But Yes...It was an exaggaration that Outcornering minis. But this is where I am coming from. I have these on my car along with H&R and Bilsteins with 285 rear tires. Scroll Down to see that it can actually achieve a 1.10 Bias where M3 is 1.15 and M5 is 1.39.

K-Bars (http://www.bmwe31.com/Sway_Bars_Text.htm)

Ahmed:

That is Greg K on Sears Point in the D group of a BMW school I believe, i.e. slow group. I have passed M3's many times in my M5 on track. Sure doesn't mean I am quicker than an M3--just quicker than the driver. If an 850 can hang with a Mini at Sears, the Mini guys was slow period. I had this discussion with the E31 guys two years ago but it was like spitting in the wind.

Ahmed:

That is Greg K on Sears Point in the D group of a BMW school I believe, i.e. slow group. I have passed M3's many times in my M5 on track. Sure doesn't mean I am quicker than an M3--just quicker than the driver. If an 850 can hang with a Mini at Sears, the Mini guys was slow period. I had this discussion with the E31 guys two years ago but it was like spitting in the wind.


Just want to add.........IMHO, a road course is 60% driver, 30% suspension and 10 power :)

Just want to add.........IMHO, a road course is 60% driver, 30% suspension and 10 power :)

And I agree on this 100%

Ahmed:

That is Greg K on Sears Point in the D group of a BMW school I believe, i.e. slow group. I have passed M3's many times in my M5 on track. Sure doesn't mean I am quicker than an M3--just quicker than the driver. If an 850 can hang with a Mini at Sears, the Mini guys was slow period. I had this discussion with the E31 guys two years ago but it was like spitting in the wind.

Yup. And :) on the Spitting in the wind part. But I hope to better my skills to outcorner avg drivers with minis.

But I hope to better my skills to outcorner avg drivers with minis.

It can be done but you will use up a lot of tires (especially the shoulders) and brakes due to the weight of the car. Ask me how I know. I have thousands of track miles in the M5 and quite like it but there is a piont where you just can't go faster without really driving at 10/10ths. I ran a 2:03 last time out at Infineon which is not bad for a 3800lb car but I am sure I could easily hit a 2:00 with a similarly prepared E36 M3.

Let's calm down a bit. Sway bars, shocks/springs, and camberplates won't trim 1700lbs from the 850. An 850 with all those goodies will NOT out corner a stock Mini Cooper. Sure, it may handle well enough to take advantage of its power on the straights but simply stated the Mini will always be able to carry more speed in a corner. Having spent enough time on the track chasing them in my M5 with all the suspension mods and R compound tires, I speak from experience. You can make a big BMW handle very well because of their weight distribution but you can't overcome physics.

I am inclined to agree with this statement. While the 850's handling can be improved with different springs, shocks, etc. there is just no overcoming the 4200+ lbs of weight in the car. As you correctly pointed out: Physics is physics. Rgds...

I am inclined to agree with this statement. While the 850's handling can be improved with different springs, shocks, etc. there is just no overcoming the 4200+ lbs of weight in the car. As you correctly pointed out: Physics is physics. Rgds...

regarding the physics. This prompted me (and this is intended politely) to question the outcomes of the e46 vs m3 dilemna...that there is no way to overcome 4200 pounds. Granted, the 850 has superior torque, but it has less power than the m (assuming we're talking about the i or ci editions). Other examples include:
G35 vs 330 or 325
At higher speeds, there have been numerous reports on the 325 pulling (or at least not being pulled on by) a G35. Similarily, 330's have frequently outpaced G35 from 0-155. Of course, the low end of the race depends on the driver.
At the same time, an s2000 should do quite a number on both of these cars at whatever speed, despite a SERIOUS torque disadvantage.

Then we have to consider the M3's weight. At 3415lbs, it is 800 (800!!!) pounds lighter than an 850i(ci). The torque can't overcome that, as previously mentioned s2000's have taken 330's/g35 sports despite torque defficiency due partially to a weight advantage (one smaller than the m3 vs 8, though percentages would say something different).

The csi should put up a fight, if any 8 at all could.

Again, I'm only saying this, because your claim just seems out of sync with physics (so far, i could definitely be missing something), and my reasons above leave me dumbfounded when i heard the result of the 8/m3 race. I'm not saying I'm right, and will not question your experience because it's obvious how involved you are with the 8.I've merely sat in one, no more. But above you see while I'm still lost with this claim. Please feel free to shed some light on it.

IMO, the 8 is the prettiest Bimmer built, ever.

I can't tell you what the torque effect is, but I can say my 750 NEVER stops pulling until it hits the speed limiter. I know the 750/850's are really restricted in stock form. An intake change makes these cars insane at any speed over 80 mph or so.

Also, the handling actually gets better at around 100mph. These cars are in the zone at higher speeds. I can see a stock M3 getting beat up by a modified 850. Stock for stock I think the 850 would still pull on the very high end, M3 on the low.

Mark M.

I can't tell you what the torque effect is, but I can say my 750 NEVER stops pulling until it hits the speed limiter. I know the 750/850's are really restricted in stock form. An intake change makes these cars insane at any speed over 80 mph or so.

Also, the handling actually gets better at around 100mph. These cars are in the zone at higher speeds. I can see a stock M3 getting beat up by a modified 850. Stock for stock I think the 850 would still pull on the very high end, M3 on the low.

Mark M.

well a modified 850 beat my partially modified m3 ... :D

Then we have to consider the M3's weight. At 3415lbs, it is 800 (800!!!) pounds lighter than an 850i(ci). The torque can't overcome that ....... Again, I'm only saying this, because your claim just seems out of sync with physics (so far, i could definitely be missing something), and my reasons above leave me dumbfounded when i heard the result of the 8/m3 race.
I should like to echo my previous statement that the E46 M3 was unable to keep pace with my 850 up to the 150+ MPH indicated speed. Unlike Ibiza's experience, I never left him "standing still" as he was still in the rear view when I finally let out of it. I estimate that I was 10-15 car lengths ahead at the above stated velocity. Not a spanking but definitely a testament to the 850's higher HP/TQ, better gearing, and lower coefficient of drag. Rgds...

was your car stock at the time?

or to what extent was it modified?

was your car stock at the time?
or to what extent was it modified?
This was long before I did the twin turbo project. At that time, the car was 100% stock. Rgds...

guess i'll have to get me an 850! :stickoutt