I know we discussed this once before on the boards, but I was wondering if anyone has ever used one before? According to a website I was reading you gain about 6% increase in Hp which isnt bad considering the price and the ease of installation.

I know we discussed this once before on the boards, but I was wondering if anyone has ever used one before? According to a website I was reading you gain about 6% increase in Hp which isnt bad considering the price and the ease of installation.

Dude, we're still gonna say the same thing. It's a horrible waste of money. It doesn't do JACK. 6% hp is 6hp. Save your money for something that isn't a scam.

Dude, we're still gonna say the same thing. It's a horrible waste of money. It doesn't do JACK. 6% hp is 6hp. Save your money for something that isn't a scam.
6% of 200 is 12 hp which is substantial, especially when added to low end. The main question is has anyone used one before?

6% of 200 is 12 hp which is substantial, especially when added to low end. The main question is has anyone used one before?

My bad, you've got an m20, not m10.

But I think pretty much everyone here has avoided them like the plauge.

I needs to find the site again, but as I mentioned on the LAST thread about this, there is a company that has what looks to be a REAL electric supercharger, making some decent power figures (IIRC like 20% extra power or more), but its operational time is limited to the amount of power on hand in whatever extra batteries you have in the car. Not great for anything other than drag racing or some QUICK highway runs (eats a LOT of juice), but better than sotck IF you can overcome the extra weight of the OTHER batteries needed.

They are adapting them for the Hybrid cars (little different power source issues) and THAT would be awesome. At least for the ones that can use both power plants to move the drive wheels. But that doesn't realy effect us, so.....

http://www.electricsupercharger.com/

Here is the site. I called to inquire about them, and the guy was telling me they dont really draw that much juice from the alternator, and only engage when the throttle is 95% open, so the car has to be up in the RPM range before it kicks on, so it shouldnt be held back at all. There is no extra battery needed at all. If you look at the demo clip on the website, it shows how much air the unit produces and its substantial enough to move a heavy piece of wood across a room. It seems like its designed for low end bursts, which would help in autocross which is what I plan on using my car for eventually.

Buy a couple and let us know what happens... with dyno charts of course.
ken

Here is some more comments I found on them:


the pros of these are that:
if they produce less than 5 lbs of boost then you dont have to upgrade your motor in any other way, it helps increase hp at low revs, most standard alternators will handle the E-ram 1 psi model and you only need one battery (my car stereo uses 60A on start up and I have a 620cca battery and 110A alternator, the charger runs for less time than the stereo) and they are fairly cheap on the gas usage compared to other chargers (especially if you install a solar panel so as to trickle charge the battery), they dont cost much at all and are quick to fit.

the cons of the unit are:
the engine of your car will have to be small, there are alot of different units out there that dont work or miss guide you (20 psi is for the 600cc engines I believe) so you have to be careful of your purchase, they drag preciece hp while your no using the charger (just like any other charger but a turbo is driven off your exhaust yet when it is up to speed, it also helps push the exhaust out, the electric doesnt and neither does the superchargers).

so if you are like me with a 1990 mazda 626GT, 2.0i DOHC NA with a 2.25 inch exhaust all the way through and an after market air filter like K&N and find you have good torque at high rpm but dont want to spend the money so as to get the good torque at lower rpm, this E-ram seems to be good, cheap and simple until you decide you want more power and have more money.

P.S. electric motors can do almost anything, it all depends on the design and type of the motor (and blower fins) used. Nothing is impossible, it's just some things are stupid. It's really just a numbers game.

Yeah, I have heard a few good things about the e-Ram dealys from the owner of a Subaru Impreza WRX, he said it was a fairly decent mod to make. Not entirely sure the validity, but that compnay apparently has a racing team; if they were just pure crap then they wouldn't have a race team I guess...

If you do get one, definetly tell us how it performs, I would be interested to know.

i sadly was curious about these and bought one a long time ago for my e36. It didn't do anything. it cost 200 bucks and it meant nothing. taking out the interior gave it more hp and that didn't cost money. it is a total scam. save your money. trust me. all it does now is sit in my shed with the e36 interior.

Any new info on this. Can u ever get over to the dyno?

These things are complete and utter crap. There is simple engineering that determines how much electricity/power it would take to move the needed amount of air to make a difference, and you would need a couple super-duper alternators, and battery backups.

There is one genuine electric supercharger out there, he uses what appears to be 3 starter motors and an Eaton supercharger. Because of the electrical loads required, it can only be used for short stints and then has to recharge.

Those stupid blower fans on ebay aren't worth $5. And they are available from wholesale supply houses for cheap if one wanted to waste time and money and experiment.

http://www.electricsupercharger.com/
Here is the site. I called to inquire about them, and the guy was telling me they dont really draw that much juice from the alternator, and only engage when the throttle is 95% open, so the car has to be up in the RPM range before it kicks on, so it shouldnt be held back at all. There is no extra battery needed at all. If you look at the demo clip on the website, it shows how much air the unit produces and its substantial enough to move a heavy piece of wood across a room. It seems like its designed for low end bursts, which would help in autocross which is what I plan on using my car for eventually.


These things are complete and utter crap. There is simple engineering that determines how much electricity/power it would take to move the needed amount of air to make a difference, and you would need a couple super-duper alternators, and battery backups.
There is one genuine electric supercharger out there, he uses what appears to be 3 starter motors and an Eaton supercharger. Because of the electrical loads required, it can only be used for short stints and then has to recharge.
Those stupid blower fans on ebay aren't worth $5. And they are available from wholesale supply houses for cheap if one wanted to waste time and money and experiment.

I am stilling waiting on the dyno results. djminkin did put one on his car, and claims there is a difference in 1st and 2nd gear, but has never gone over to the dyno to prove it.

So..I share an opinon along the same lines as greggearhead, but I am just wondering where the dyno results are.

Hey Djminikin what is your opinion?

thanks
J

Looks like an expencive hair dryer. You would get the same results from hooking the air pump to the air box. You can do that for free! All of these items I see like this are just junk. Don't waste your time. You can do other mods that WORK for $300 and get 16hp gain. Cold air intakes, Exhaust, Nitrous Oxide (yes folks its called nitrous, not NOS!), etc.

oh man these things work great i'm runnin 2 of them and my vacuming time has gone down by at least 1 full second and my carpets have never been cleaner, j/k
but seriously i watch a video a while ago where the ran a car on a dyno then installed one of those electric charges and the car actually put down less power... please don't ask for the vid because i searched for it before posting and can't find it.

6% of 200 is 12 hp which is substantial, especially when added to low end. The main question is has anyone used one before?

If you have 200HP in an e21 chassis you do not need an electric supercharger.

And instead of agitating the anthill why not buy said SC and test it yourself. It is obvious no one here is going to do it.

If you have 200HP in an e21 chassis you do not need an electric supercharger.
And instead of agitating the anthill why not buy said SC and test it yourself. It is obvious no one here is going to do it.

Rather than an electric supercharger..how about a regular supercharger for the M20 325i e30 engine??

I am interested in a regular supercharger if its reasonable cost and increases performance.

Well these is one in the works:: :stickoutt :D
http://seambmw.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2
We recently finished the Research stage of our M20 Supercharger Project. We are going to run an Eaton MP62 blower, with internal bypass valve at ~6.5-7lbs of boost. The Prototype will incorporate an air to air intercooler and the goal is to have a completely bolt on system based on a blow through design.

If anyone out there has suggestions, feel free to add your thoughts to this project!

Barrett

Info I just found on the Eaton MP62 supercharger:
http://www.magnusonproducts.com/mp62.htm

The Magnuson/Eaton MP62, 4th Generation is a “State of the Art” supercharger, engineered for 2.0 to 4.0 liter port injected engines. It was designed as a compact, flexible supercharger for increased power with original equipment quietness and reliability without adversely affecting fuel economy. The MP62 has proven itself in a number of applications, and this latest version has taken this stamina and versatility to the next level with “S Port” technology and a built in bypass for unparalleled performance.

*

Most installations see a realistic 40% plus increase in power output.
*

Magnuson/Eaton Superchargers will work effectively in any orientation (flat, upside down, on edge).
*

Different length drives are available, giving the custom installer flexibility in the placement of the supercharger.
*

Magnuson 4th generation superchargers have internal bypass valves. The bypass actuator can be located in any of 12 possible locations (6 on each side of the supercharger).
*

Shown with generic one-piece drive. Two-piece and different one-piece drives are available, as are pulleys with variable offset giving a wide range of possible drive lengths.
*

Two-piece extension drives available in 1" increments. Drive pulley offset design offers further options.

STANDARD EXTENSION DRIVES
For 4th Generation Superchargers
Drive Length Range with 6-Rib R&D Pulley Range with 8-Rib R&D Pulley
1" 3.2" to 4.5" 3.2" to 4.8"
6" 8.2" to 9.5" 8.2" to 9.8"
7" 9.2" to 10.5" 9.2" to 10.8"
8" 10.2" to 11.5" 10.2" to 11.8"
9" 11.2" to 12.5" 11.2" to 12.8"
10" 12.2" to 13.5" 12.2" to 13.8"
Back To Top • How To View Site • Policies • Register Warra

yeah and it takes 80HP to make 120hp.:rolleyes

A turbo will always be more efficient and make more power.

Super general statements beg for disproving, but I won't really go there. I mean, top fuel dragsters don't make that much power. ;)

All things equal (which they never are) a turbo will make more power while sapping less, generally speaking. Not going to argue that point at all.

Eaton superchargers are fine units. Fine for low-boost, high volume production-line type applications. Hence why they are used on Minis, Mercedes, on Fords old Thunderbird SC, GMs 3.8s, Toyota TRD kits etc etc.

They are nick-named "Heatons" by some of us in the industry, because any roots blower has a very poor adiabatic efficiency. Like around 40-50% for a good one - which means as it compresses the air, it heats it a lot. That is bad for power production, knock resistance, and general durability of an engine. It is also fairly rpm limited - the higher the rpms, the more efficiency falls off. Roots blowers are inexpensive to produce and as a positive displacement unit offer a nice boost to low rpm performance, especially nice on small engines.

Twin-screw blowers are positive displacement, similar in size to the roots but harder to produce. They are more efficient and the efficiency doesn't fall off like the roots.

Centrifugal superchargers are the most efficient and compact units. The only drawback, as some call it, is that they need rpms to produce boost, so low rpms response is softer than a positive displacement blower. With the advances in impeller and housing developments from turbos these are great blowers. I have a lot of experience with the Rotrex units and a few others.


My $.02 (OK, I have already given more than that) - if you want some more hp for the LEAST dollars, try a roots blower. Decent improvement, fab the brackets and your done. You will be limited by heat and detonation for upper power levels. You can get used roots on ebay for $100-300.

A Centrifugal or twin screw would be a great setup, but the entry cost goes up quite a bit. $500-1500 for a blower.

A turbo setup is what I plan on doing (unless a Rotrex falls in my lap), because I don't mind fabricating exhaust, etc, and at altitude, turbos don't lose power like superchargers do, and I like having a larger horsepower ceiling, because while 170hp sounds like a lot in an E21, until you live with it for a while, then 200, then 220, then... you get the idea.

Super general statements beg for disproving, but I won't really go there. I mean, top fuel dragsters don't make that much power. ;)
All things equal (which they never are) a turbo will make more power while sapping less, generally speaking. Not going to argue that point at all.
Eaton superchargers are fine units. Fine for low-boost, high volume production-line type applications. Hence why they are used on Minis, Mercedes, on Fords old Thunderbird SC, GMs 3.8s, Toyota TRD kits etc etc.
They are nick-named "Heatons" by some of us in the industry, because any roots blower has a very poor adiabatic efficiency. Like around 40-50% for a good one - which means as it compresses the air, it heats it a lot. That is bad for power production, knock resistance, and general durability of an engine. It is also fairly rpm limited - the higher the rpms, the more efficiency falls off. Roots blowers are inexpensive to produce and as a positive displacement unit offer a nice boost to low rpm performance, especially nice on small engines.
Twin-screw blowers are positive displacement, similar in size to the roots but harder to produce. They are more efficient and the efficiency doesn't fall off like the roots.
Centrifugal superchargers are the most efficient and compact units. The only drawback, as some call it, is that they need rpms to produce boost, so low rpms response is softer than a positive displacement blower. With the advances in impeller and housing developments from turbos these are great blowers. I have a lot of experience with the Rotrex units and a few others.
My $.02 (OK, I have already given more than that) - if you want some more hp for the LEAST dollars, try a roots blower. Decent improvement, fab the brackets and your done. You will be limited by heat and detonation for upper power levels. You can get used roots on ebay for $100-300.
A Centrifugal or twin screw would be a great setup, but the entry cost goes up quite a bit. $500-1500 for a blower.
A turbo setup is what I plan on doing (unless a Rotrex falls in my lap), because I don't mind fabricating exhaust, etc, and at altitude, turbos don't lose power like superchargers do, and I like having a larger horsepower ceiling, because while 170hp sounds like a lot in an E21, until you live with it for a while, then 200, then 220, then... you get the idea.


I am curious about the kit. Thats all. I will wait for the dyno results


yeah and it takes 80HP to make 120hp.:rolleyes
A turbo will always be more efficient and make more power.

Turbos > Superchargers!!

Ray, no argument from me here. Its well know and widely dicussed.

If and when.. I build another engine for my 323i, other than the 2.8 stroker I have someday I will its going to be a M20 turbo setup.
But at this point, I just want to get my car out of the shop right now...

later,
J

Super general statements beg for disproving, but I won't really go there. I mean, top fuel dragsters don't make that much power.


yes but street driven SCs do not use nitro-methane for fuel. We are talking about street driven cars are we not? Talk about generalized statements...

Meh, opinions are like assholes everyone has one, you, Joe, myself, everyone.

yes but street driven SCs do not use nitro-methane for fuel. We are talking about street driven cars are we not? Talk about generalized statements...

Meh, opinions are like assholes everyone has one, you, Joe, myself, everyone.

Agreed. :D
We where talking about street driven superchargers for the m20.
who knows if the kit that will use the Eaton MP62 blower, with internal bypass valve at ~6.5-7lbs of boost will actually work, be affordable, come to the market and be proven on the dyno. Only time will tell.

I totally agree with you all, it is my opinon the way to go is to turbocharge the M20.
I don't have the resources for this at the time being, and really at this point,
I am sick and tired of the whole body shop location thing and want to just enjoy my car.

We started the thread about some crazy electric supercharger that adds to performance, but also can be a blender or hair drier. lol. :eyecrazy :lol

yes but street driven SCs do not use nitro-methane for fuel. We are talking about street driven cars are we not? Talk about generalized statements...

Meh, opinions are like assholes everyone has one, you, Joe, myself, everyone.


Yep, that was kinda my point, using a general statement to refute a general statement.

Personally, there is nothing I like more than a V8 engine with a huge roots blower and that distinctive whine.

Also, right here in town there is a water/methonal injection setup for forced induction engines. More of a chemical intercooler than anything near nitro used for fuel, but interesting nonetheless.
http://www.snowperformance.net/