This happened last summer but thought I'd post this now. So I'm leaving my parent's house one summer evening. Roll to a stop at a red light. Lo and behold some kid with hat on sideways pulls up to me in a white Prelude - as usual, the music was cranking. He looks at me and my car (which was sparkling clean at the time) and then back at me. Well....you all know what's about to happen. I reach down and disable the ASC+T - all the while doing so with a slight grin on my face. Doesn't Gino dude start revving his 2.2L VTEC at me, just as expected. OK. Well, light turns green, and I launch my car at my normal 3000rpm. Prelude gets a good launch as well. By end of 1st gear I put 1.5CL on him, and maintain that through end of 2nd. Then he signalled and 'HAD' to to turn. Well, I wasn't satisfied, so I followed and turned with him. 90degree right hand turn, which we both took at about 80% (Prelude's handle quite well in my opinion). Tires barely chirpping or squealing. At this point, he's ahead of me, since he took the turn first. So, the driving's still on and now we're in 3rd doing about 120km/hr. From here, his VTEC couldn't help him much. From behind I catch the 1CL he had on me and start walking away comfortably. I shut down at about 170 or 180km/hr or 2-3CL's on him. Get to the lights (red) and Gino boy rolls his window down so I follow. Nice race he says. Followed by "Is that stock?" - it is. And then "what do you have in there, a V6?". hahaha. I smiled and corrected him with a "NO, in-line 6!". Guess he learned something that day. I'll give him credit, he drove the car well. Didn't hear any loud music after that...........

Cdnr328i

Lude had at least an exhaust.

Gino???

Nice run but you need to keep these up to date ;)

Ok. Just to clarify. Up here in TOronto. Gino = picture the Gotti kids!! That should give you a visual!!!

Cdn328i

Was the Prelude a base or a Type SH? A base Lude can run around 15.1, Type SH 15.3....I have a 98 Prelude SH, with intake/exhaust, and I've beaten 328i's before (and I figured out im exactly as fast as a stock RSX-S numerous times)....not saying the Prelude is faster, but its certainly a driver's race.

I dont see you gaining 1.5 CL's through first though, unless the kid didn't launch his car well...if he didnt launch well, its gonna take an extra second or so to hit VTEC in first, and that would KILL his chances. However I do beleive you catching him in 3rd gear, as Preludes have a tall 3rd gear, but the top end is pretty fat....still, great race.

Was the Prelude a base or a Type SH? A base Lude can run around 15.1, Type SH 15.3....I have a 98 Prelude SH, with intake/exhaust, and I've beaten 328i's before (and I figured out im exactly as fast as a stock RSX-S numerous times)....not saying the Prelude is faster, but its certainly a driver's race.

I dont see you gaining 1.5 CL's through first though, unless the kid didn't launch his car well...if he didnt launch well, its gonna take an extra second or so to hit VTEC in first, and that would KILL his chances. However I do beleive you catching him in 3rd gear, as Preludes have a tall 3rd gear, but the top end is pretty fat....still, great race.
yeah I pretty much agreed. As me and you have talked before. Like my buddies bone stock 98 SH and my other buddies bone stock 96 328 they were pretty much even until 3rd gear and the 328 would pull.

Now to take any credit away from the thread starter, but the guy in the prelude must not have been able to drive very good, or he may have added a bunch of weight by putting a system in the trunk. I remember on my 95 Prelude S (140 hp/tq) when I put a system in, it was like dropping an anchor on my car, because that little engine wasn't meant to haul much more, and adding that weight slowed it down alot.

The Lude was not an SH. All I could tell as far as upgrades was the exhaust. His launch seemed to be quite good as both of us didn't have too much wheel spin. It was a hot summer day and tires hooked up nicely. As much as I love Honda's VTEC, it comes on late. My 206ft/lbs of trq @3500rpm kills a Lude's 164ish (?). Stk for stk, with even drivers, I think a 328 should take a Prelude 8 out 10 times. Still, in the real world, it's close enough to be a drivers race. There are a ton of modified Preludes up here that would make me look silly!!!!! But I've yet to line up with one. I also have 2 SH kills on my list.

Like we all know.....anything can happen on the street!

Cdn328i

The Lude was not an SH. All I could tell as far as upgrades was the exhaust. His launch seemed to be quite good as both of us didn't have too much wheel spin. It was a hot summer day and tires hooked up nicely. As much as I love Honda's VTEC, it comes on late. My 206ft/lbs of trq @3500rpm kills a Lude's 164ish (?). Stk for stk, with even drivers, I think a 328 should take a Prelude 8 out 10 times. Still, in the real world, it's close enough to be a drivers race. There are a ton of modified Preludes up here that would make me look silly!!!!! But I've yet to line up with one. I also have 2 SH kills on my list.

Like we all know.....anything can happen on the street!

Cdn328i
yeah vtec takes awhile. I don't knwo exact RPM NY330xi will tel lya. But it is in the 4k range I think(but it may be 5k, I can't remember where they redline). But I know a good lude driver can shift and always stay in VTEC if he does it right. My buddy hooked up a cool plate to put in his car with Blue leds that spells VTEC and lights up whenever it engages. If he times it right, it doesn't shut off when he is getting on it. But also, stock for stock a 328 should take a Prelude 10 out of 10 times. But on the street it is more of a drivers race, with a little bit of handicapp placed against the lude.

VTEC hits at 5200 rpms...redline is 7400 BUT fuel cut off isnt until 8100....When racing a Prelude, the 1-2 shift is very important. If you shift at redline, you're gonna drop off VTEC in 2nd gear, which REALLY hurts acceleration. Perhaps the Lude driver did this, which may be the reason why you gained "1.5 CLs" in the beginning.... I shift every gear around 7800 and the extra revs and time in gear help acceleration a lot....Also, id say the Lude driver didnt launch well, b/c if he barely spun his tires, he was probably launching around 2-3K...I launch around 4000-4500 and feather the clutch and get nice spin then the tires hook up for VTEC...

Prelude has 156 lb-ft @ 5200, and a flat spot around 4500-5000..

Id say stock for stock, the 328 is gonna win most of the time bc of its immediate torque advantage...but find someone that knows how to launch one like a beast and hit VTEC right away...its gonna be close

Id say stock for stock, the 328 is gonna win most of the time bc of its immediate torque advantage...but find someone that knows how to launch one like a beast and hit VTEC right away...its gonna be close
Yeah if it were two equally skilled like well above amateur drivers or pro drivers, it would probably be a close race. But the natural advantage is still on the 328's side. But how does a 325 compared to a lude? Is that more even or is the lude quicker in that case?

Giterdone and NY330xi,

I agree with both of you on your points. Stock vs stock, all things even, a 328i will take a Prelude. But when it comes to real time, street runs, it's close enough to be a driver's race - underdog being the Lude. Now....a stock 325, that's a closer race. Both cars making about the same power and close to the same weight. FWD 4cyl vs RWD 6cyl. Trq goes to the 325, as does the rear drive launch advantage. But when that VTEC kicks in at I believe 5200rpm, the Prelude's power is quite surprising. Love their high rev range too. I like what one of you guys said about keeping it in the VTEC range. I think many (not so skilled drivers) fail to do this.

I always try to keep my launches at an even 3000rpm. Depending on temperature and tires, I usually get a decent launch. 4500rpm seems pretty high to me - unless it's an AWD beast like a WRX.

Thanks for the posts guys.

CdnR328i

Yeah if it were two equally skilled like well above amateur drivers or pro drivers, it would probably be a close race. But the natural advantage is still on the 328's side. But how does a 325 compared to a lude? Is that more even or is the lude quicker in that case?

I think a 325 vs a Lude is a very even match, stock for stock, but I've beaten a few....E46 325i's i mean...

an E36 325 has like 189 hp and more torque, that would probably fair better....ive never raced one, but I can tell you that I've raced an auto 330ci 0-100 and won by a car...is a 5 speed E36 faster or slower than that? I think i remember seeing auto 330's at 15.1 1/4 mile....

On a side note, I recently just took out the 330xi (dad's car) for the first time in awhile and...man, nothing beats a BMW... :buttrock

Good 1, i had a similar experience, the 328 is just slightly faster than a 5th gen lude.

Good 1, i had a similar experience, the 328 is just slightly faster than a 5th gen lude.

Never had a problem with a Prelude. If you look back at some of the past magazines, Honda admits that the quickest car they had in the 1/4 was the '99 Civic Si. It was quicker than the Prelude and the Accord. I found it hard to believe but hey that was coming from Honda. A 328is stick should take a Prelude with no problem. I used to take Preludes in my Si. Neither cars were stock, but hey run what you brung. :D

Was the Prelude a base or a Type SH? A base Lude can run around 15.1, Type SH 15.3....I have a 98 Prelude SH, with intake/exhaust, and I've beaten 328i's before (and I figured out im exactly as fast as a stock RSX-S numerous times)....not saying the Prelude is faster, but its certainly a driver's race.

I dont see you gaining 1.5 CL's through first though, unless the kid didn't launch his car well...if he didnt launch well, its gonna take an extra second or so to hit VTEC in first, and that would KILL his chances. However I do beleive you catching him in 3rd gear, as Preludes have a tall 3rd gear, but the top end is pretty fat....still, great race.

stock for stock a 328is stick is NOT a drivers with a Prelude. Come on guys??

good race man.

i have a japanese B16 in my civic. the key is to shift just above redline to stay in the vtec powerband. like stated above. many honda drivers are not smart enough to figure this out. i walked a lude SH that had an intake once. this was before i installed my act SS clutch and act 12.5 lb flywheel. also when i had 24 lb wheels on the car. if honda engines had torque to match their hp numbers, they would be much more respected. i am tired of how i have to wind my little 1.6 liter all the way out when im racing people. redline is 8200 rpms, and a tad over that to keep it in vtec.

BTW, not to hijack or anything. i walked a stock 05 jetta GLI 1.8T 6 speed pretty hard yesterday. i loved it.

again, good race!

-Dane

Never had a problem with a Prelude. If you look back at some of the past magazines, Honda admits that the quickest car they had in the 1/4 was the '99 Civic Si. It was quicker than the Prelude and the Accord. I found it hard to believe but hey that was coming from Honda. A 328is stick should take a Prelude with no problem. I used to take Preludes in my Si. Neither cars were stock, but hey run what you brung. :D

99 Civic SI the quickest car honda had in the 1/4? Both a GSR and Prelude ARE faster, look for any stats you want, GSR runs about 15.4, Prelude (base) closer to 15.2. Civic SI's stock run mid-high 15s. Dont get me wrong I like the 99-00 Civic SI's alot, but they are certainly not quicker than a GSR or Prelude or a modded SH like mine. Maybe a JDM B16, but not a US-spec B16 SI.

And yes, a 328is is faster then a Prelude and probably should win 8/10 times, but they are still close enough for the Prelude to have a chance, with a good driver.

i have a japanese B16 in my civic. the key is to shift just above redline to stay in the vtec powerband. like stated above. many honda drivers are not smart enough to figure this out. i walked a lude SH that had an intake once. this was before i installed my act SS clutch and act 12.5 lb flywheel. also when i had 24 lb wheels on the car. \

-Dane

You beat a Lude SH w/ intake when you had 24 pound wheels and before you have new clutch/flywheel? Of course anything can happen on the street, but the Lude is faster, straight up. I have a Lude SH w/ 138,000 miles, with intake/exhaust, and I'm dead even with RSX-S all the time. You're telling me your as fast as an RSX-S (14.9-15.1?) Not trying to start any arguments hear, just like disputing facts with other Honda people.

civics are the lightest, but they don't have the engine to make them the fastest. I would think if you did a engine swap then yes. But you do an engine swap on any car and it completely transforms it.

You beat a Lude SH w/ intake when you had 24 pound wheels and before you have new clutch/flywheel? Of course anything can happen on the street, but the Lude is faster, straight up. I have a Lude SH w/ 138,000 miles, with intake/exhaust, and I'm dead even with RSX-S all the time. You're telling me your as fast as an RSX-S (14.9-15.1?) Not trying to start any arguments hear, just like disputing facts with other Honda people.


i have a slip in my hand here that says i did a 15.221 @80.58mph. and i KNOW there is room for improvement. i have a difficult time launching. something i am going to practice more this spring. i know the car has a 14 sec pass in its future, without anymore mods. click here for pics and mod list (http://www.freewebs.com/wedrivericearoni/theciv.htm) also, not listed on that page, i have the SiRII transmission with LSD. what people fail to realize is that a 6th gen civic weighs about 2700lbs. putting in a B16 engine and tranny, 170 horses stock, very short gears, and an LSD really makes a decent little sleeper.

i dont know what to tell you man. some cars run better than others?? ive been told my car is slow in comparison to others with similar mods. dont preludes weigh like 3200 lbs? you also have tall gears dont you? your extra torque #'s are supposed to make up for the tall gearing. my car tops out at about 120mph.. in 5th gear just over 8,000 rpms. there are alot of differences between our cars. i dunno dude. i totally lost my train of thought, imma go eat something and try and figure out why post is all overthe place.

-Dane

i have a slip in my hand here that says i did a 15.221 @80.58mph. and i KNOW there is room for improvement. i have a difficult time launching. something i am going to practice more this spring. i know the car has a 14 sec pass in its future, without anymore mods. click here for pics and mod list (http://www.freewebs.com/wedrivericearoni/theciv.htm) also, not listed on that page, i have the SiRII transmission with LSD. what people fail to realize is that a 6th gen civic weighs about 2700lbs. putting in a B16 engine and tranny, 170 horses stock, very short gears, and an LSD really makes a decent little sleeper.

i dont know what to tell you man. some cars run better than others?? ive been told my car is slow in comparison to others with similar mods. dont preludes weigh like 3200 lbs? you also have tall gears dont you? your extra torque #'s are supposed to make up for the tall gearing. my car tops out at about 120mph.. in 5th gear just over 8,000 rpms. there are alot of differences between our cars. i dunno dude. i totally lost my train of thought, imma go eat something and try and figure out why post is all overthe place.

-Dane

First, your civic SI is modded a lot. A 170 (vs. 160) hp 1.6L JDM engine w/ intake/exahust/headers/test pipe/short shift/LSD etc is probably putting out around 155-160 whp. In a 2800 pound car, of course thats gonna beat a prelude, and is probably a high 14's car. I was saying a STOCK 99 Civic SI is not as fast as a Prelude or GSR. Base preludes weigh 2950, SH 3040. Gearing wise, stock FD is 4.27 and my gears end at 37, 61, 89, 116, 140...is that tall? Sounds about average to me. BTW, i like you Civic SI a lot, looks real nice without being too ricey. Find a Prelude w/ intake/exhaust/headers/VAFC/pullies and race him, then PM me.

^^^ :buttrock no worries dude. lol, i never said my car was stock. you never asked. lol. its just a little 97 civic Ex. i have my steelies on right now so it looks like total ass. its not slammed so the suspension looks stock. no tint and all that. my buddy calls it "the humbler" :buttrock . ive been told its kind of a sleeper. the H22 is a beast man, i dig the ludes. id like to see some pics if you have any.

-Dane

I graduated from a 98 Lude to the current M3. The Lude's handling was impressive, but the FWD and having to always wind it up sucked. Not to mention the lack of torque and annoying wheel hop on launches. Only mod was an AEM CAI.

I find it hard to believe that most Honda/Acura people don't know to keep the car in VTEC through the gears for maximum speed/times. This is pretty much common sense. Anyone even moderately into the scene should figure this out immediately, unless your a complete tool.

I find it hard to believe that most Honda/Acura people don't know to keep the car in VTEC through the gears for maximum speed/times. This is pretty much common sense. Anyone even moderately into the scene should figure this out immediately, unless your a complete tool.


it is the truth. the majority of us honda/acura guys are dumbasses.

haha. I'm not gonna even comment on the last post. I will say that I'm sure there are many of us, including myself, who were former Honda/Acura owners. Switching over to BMW. Almost like a progression. I for one am a fan of Honda. I just wanted to try something different. So I purchased a 328i. Part of me still misses my modded EX-R coupe. Lots of fun factor in that thing. Had over 385,000 kms on the original clutch, starter, rad, alty, etc....and I drove that thing HARD!! Took care of it too.

Cdn328i
former 90 Accord EX-R cpe owner

99 Civic SI the quickest car honda had in the 1/4? Both a GSR and Prelude ARE faster, look for any stats you want, GSR runs about 15.4, Prelude (base) closer to 15.2. Civic SI's stock run mid-high 15s. Dont get me wrong I like the 99-00 Civic SI's alot, but they are certainly not quicker than a GSR or Prelude or a modded SH like mine. Maybe a JDM B16, but not a US-spec B16 SI.

And yes, a 328is is faster then a Prelude and probably should win 8/10 times, but they are still close enough for the Prelude to have a chance, with a good driver.

Did you guys forget about a little Honda a called an S2000? The 2001 model I had with the F20C produced a "measly" 153 lb-ft of torque but was capable of high 13s...not with me behind the wheel though :D

Everyone keeps saying the prelude is good for low 15's. Well isn't the 328 manual good for high 14's. So yeah I guess it would make sense the 328 would win most of the time, but it is still somewhat of a drivers race. I think a prelude would take a 325, I know because I own one lol. Yet, I am auto :(

99 Civic SI the quickest car honda had in the 1/4? Both a GSR and Prelude ARE faster, look for any stats you want, GSR runs about 15.4, Prelude (base) closer to 15.2. Civic SI's stock run mid-high 15s. Dont get me wrong I like the 99-00 Civic SI's alot, but they are certainly not quicker than a GSR or Prelude or a modded SH like mine. Maybe a JDM B16, but not a US-spec B16 SI.

And yes, a 328is is faster then a Prelude and probably should win 8/10 times, but they are still close enough for the Prelude to have a chance, with a good driver.


Isn't the NSX-R and S2000 ( I dunno if they make Type Rs for S2000) the quikest Honda around? :D

Isn't the NSX-R and S2000 ( I dunno if they make Type Rs for S2000) the quikest Honda around? :D
umm not sure about the NSX, but I know the S2000 is quicker than the above mentioned in your quote. But I think they meant the "normal" hondas. S2000 is in it's own class and doesn't fall into the Honda category. it is like the Cobras with Ford, although made by ford, they are definately a few rungs up on the ladder. :stickoutt

^^^^^^^^FWD boys, FWD :buttrock ^^^^^^^^^^^

the nsx is definately the fastest honda out there....smokes the s2000...

Did you guys forget about a little Honda a called an S2000? The 2001 model I had with the F20C produced a "measly" 153 lb-ft of torque but was capable of high 13s...not with me behind the wheel though :D

Nah i didnt forget the S2000, I just figure its common sense that obviously thats the fastest Honda (minus NSX!!!). The newer 2.2L motor has even the car mags getting 13.8-13.9...the older one was closer to 14.1-14.2.

I think Silversteak took an older S2000 to the strip and stock ran 13.9...8000 rpm launch!!!!! :buttrock

NSX, yes, of course...the fastest honda...high 12s/low 13s...especially the NSX-R...

But i have only seen one of the road once...and Honda probably only sells 100 of them a year. I was talking more about mainstream honda's.....

8000 rpm launch!!!!! :buttrock

:lol dangerous.

I beleive Silverstreak ran a 13.6-13.7 in the 2.0 S2000...~7500 launch

Back when I frequented the s2000 forums quite a bit, the general consensus was you need ~7-7.5k launch to get decent times...need to be close to the 6.2k vtec engagement when traction bites

This would be a blast, and be the fastst honda. Too bad they didn't release it.

http://www.mcclatchie.com/reviews/S2000R.html

that article on the S2000R was a hoax....it got everyone excited on s2ki.com though!

that article on the S2000R was a hoax....it got everyone excited on s2ki.com though!
was it a hoax from the beginning or did honda just have to stop production?

Im a honda nut, and ive never heard anything about that S2000R, real or fake. Not one single solitary thing. So its def. not true, nor was it even planned for production.

An I6 in it would never happen by the way...

Maybe a 2.4 L 4, which at the old S2K's 120 hp/L...would be around 290 hp....sounds good enough for a Type R to me...

Im a honda nut, and ive never heard anything about that S2000R, real or fake. Not one single solitary thing. So its def. not true, nor was it even planned for production.

An I6 in it would never happen by the way...

Maybe a 2.4 L 4, which at the old S2K's 120 hp/L...would be around 290 hp....sounds good enough for a Type R to me...


i agree. and i too have never even heard of it.

99 Civic SI the quickest car honda had in the 1/4? Both a GSR and Prelude ARE faster, look for any stats you want, GSR runs about 15.4, Prelude (base) closer to 15.2. Civic SI's stock run mid-high 15s. Dont get me wrong I like the 99-00 Civic SI's alot, but they are certainly not quicker than a GSR or Prelude or a modded SH like mine. Maybe a JDM B16, but not a US-spec B16 SI.

And yes, a 328is is faster then a Prelude and probably should win 8/10 times, but they are still close enough for the Prelude to have a chance, with a good driver.

First of all an Acura is not a Honda. When I say that I mean strictly desinated Hondas in the US. A Prelude is quick in the right hands but it is not quicker than a Civic Si '99. It is a heavy car. I am talking stock for stock. I owned a GSR and a Civic Si and the GSR is quicker than both no doubt. My 328is would kill either of the cars stock for stock.

First of all an Acura is not a Honda. A Prelude is quick in the right hands but it is not quicker than a Civic Si '99. I am talking stock for stock. I owned a GSR and a Civic Si and the GSR is quicker than both no doubt. My 328is would kill either of the cars stock for stock.

Acura is not Honda? Yes, they are. Acura is like upscale honda, and every model uses the chassis of a Honda (Integra/Civic, Accord/TL etc). Same manufacturer. In Japan, everything is just Honda.

And I have to disagree, a Prelude (base model not SH), is faster than a 99-00 Civic SI, stock for stock. GSR vs. Prelude is a close driver's race for sure but the edge, speed wise, the Prelude is faster. stock for stock. I've seen stock 97-01 Prelude base run 14.9 (best) at the strip, average of 15.0. GSR's are closer to mid 15s. And ive raced a few GSR's, and i win by 2-3 cars everytime. I have an SH w/ intake/exhaust.

:redspot

I would say stock for stock WITHOUT factoring in DRIVER SKILL. It would go something liket his

Prelude > GSR > Civic SI

I would say stock for stock WITHOUT factoring in DRIVER SKILL. It would go something liket his

Prelude > GSR > Civic SI


Exactly right. Well said!!! :buttrock

^^i would have to agree.

I have owned 2 of the 3 cars mentioned GSR and Civic Si and I have had different results, along with most of the guys I hung with that had Si's. The GSR was a little quicker and the Prelude was nothing too shaby.

Acura is not Honda? Yes, they are. Acura is like upscale honda, and every model uses the chassis of a Honda (Integra/Civic, Accord/TL etc). Same manufacturer. In Japan, everything is just Honda.

And I have to disagree, a Prelude (base model not SH), is faster than a 99-00 Civic SI, stock for stock. GSR vs. Prelude is a close driver's race for sure but the edge, speed wise, the Prelude is faster. stock for stock. I've seen stock 97-01 Prelude base run 14.9 (best) at the strip, average of 15.0. GSR's are closer to mid 15s. And ive raced a few GSR's, and i win by 2-3 cars everytime. I have an SH w/ intake/exhaust.

:redspot

I know that I meant strictly Honda not Acura in US terms...read the whole thing before you try to explain something I already know. When I said in Honda's lineup, I meant waht you can get at a Honda dealership.

It was 13.66, and a 7700 rpm launch on that 01 S2000, get it right, guys... ;)

It was 13.66, and a 7700 rpm launch on that 01 S2000, get it right, guys... ;)
PWNT!!
;)

It was 13.66, and a 7700 rpm launch on that 01 S2000, get it right, guys... ;)

DAMN thats a good time!! I wonder how you could do with the new 2.2L S2000? Its supposed to make 10-15 extra whp but its redline is now 8000, rather than 9K, and its still rated at 240 hp.

I've driven the 2.2, but not at the strip, it feels stronger, and much better around town...

It was 13.66, and a 7700 rpm launch on that 01 S2000, get it right, guys... ;)


Whooa! I'm glad the tranny didn't fall off launching with such high mad revs :D