I have found a member on BFc who will do the GB for cams on the M44 and M42 engine. The cams will be $280 shipped + $60 for valve springs if we can get 4 people to do this. These will be stock regrinds so you will have to send in your cams, or find another set. These will also be tailor made to whatever rear diff. gear you have (3.45, 4.44, or whatever else you may have) and whether or not the car is SC, Turbo, or NA. So this would also be a good mod for the DASC or Mosselman guys, as well as the NA people. Post here if you are interested or have any questions.

-Matt

So is this deal still through Kent cams?

This is through 943184dr. I'll have to ask him who is making the cams.

First off GDB thank you for setting this up, i didn't think there would be a demand for this.

I have a local Machine shop that does all my machine work for me and built my turbo motor that is going into my car. they have been around for a very long time and do awesome work. If you look back a little ways in the FI forum you should be able to find pics of my motor that i posted. BTW this GB is for m42 or m44 motors.

Some more usefull info for prospective grinds: the specs on your turbo/SC how much boost you are running, where you want the power band. basically give me a description of how you want the car to drive and i will get the best combo i can.

For M44 owners wanting valve springs as well (I highly recomend as stockers are pretty inadequete) if someone could send me a stock m44 valve spring i would appreciate it just to make sure the size and all the tolerances are the same as the m42, or if they aren't then i can get some new ones that will work just as good if not better then the m42 springs.

if anyone is going to be interested in copper headgaskets i have those available as well. (have two spares ready to go for very cheap) If there is any interest i can post pics and some pricing. In addition if there is any other custom things people would be interested in for m42/44 motors feel free to let me know. Hopefully soon i should have some pullies in the works (at least ltw hopefully ltw and underdrive)

Tom

for those of you that are F/I here is just a thought. like with any stock regrind cam it would not be a hard thing to acheive a 20% bump in power by doing a set of nicely ground cams and springs. in addition on a F/I motor you should find boost a tad quicker as well as being able to take advantage of that boost a whole lot more efficiently. speaking of that, if anyone would be willing to get me some before and after dyno results i would love to see them.

Tom

Thanks for the info, I have also though up of a few questions for you.

1. What are the stock specs on the m42 and m44 cams.

2. Will the computer have to be recalibrated of will the cams work fine with our stock computer.

3. I am pretty sure that the intake and exhaust cam are identical in specs, do you think that we would benefit by maybe increasing intake lift a little more than the exhaust lift, or increase the duration of one and not the other?

4. Is there any way to get an idea of the gains without actually trying it. (I have tried several different cam specs in Desktop Dyno 2000 and the results were about 1-2 HP increase and I know that it is way off.)


I think pulleys would be a great addition to the m42 - m44 line up, a reasonably priced bored out throttle body might not be a bad idea either.

I also have realized that the exhaust side of the cylinder head could be opened up quite a bit, so I might be down for some porting and polishing sometime.

Thanks for the info, I have also though up of a few questions for you.

1. What are the stock specs on the m42 and m44 cams.

2. Will the computer have to be recalibrated of will the cams work fine with our stock computer.

3. I am pretty sure that the intake and exhaust cam are identical in specs, do you think that we would benefit by maybe increasing intake lift a little more than the exhaust lift, or increase the duration of one and not the other?

4. Is there any way to get an idea of the gains without actually trying it. (I have tried several different cam specs in Desktop Dyno 2000 and the results were about 1-2 HP increase and I know that it is way off.)


I think pulleys would be a great addition to the m42 - m44 line up, a reasonably priced bored out throttle body might not be a bad idea either.

I also have realized that the exhaust side of the cylinder head could be opened up quite a bit, so I might be down for some porting and polishing sometime.

Just to make things easy i will answer your question in the order you gave them to me....

1: This i can't answer at the moment all though give me a couple days and i will see what i can dig up. all though this would be shown on a data sheet to whoever bought the cams for a before and after spec.

2: At the minimum i would have a chip burned for this. Personally i would recomend a piggyback/stand alone to do this. (NickG would be a good source for a chip for all the m44 owners)

3: This would depend on the application, A turbo motor, yes. A S/C engine, they benefit from custom cams (best option) or from NA cams. For NA i would say no if i rmember correctly they do like alot of overlap.

4: Desktop dyno would be your best bet as unfortunatly i do not have any out and in use yet. If anyone would be willing to give me a before and after dyno graph that would be great. but that 1-2hp is no where near what it would actually be. I know at least on FI motors expect roughly a 20% increase over stock cams. (based on research)

As for the Head work, feel free to let me know. I can do just about anything you want to the head. I even have a custom built port in the back of mine so my water temp guage tells me the temp of teh water in the back of the head (most important area) as well as many other differnt custom ports for guages. or for you turbo guys i can have some oil pans made up with drain plugs built into them.

BTW. You all may want to keep your eyes and ears open for a turbo kit to possibly give a sneak preview sometime early next year. :devillook

Tom

Glad I could get the wheels rolling on this. I have been thinking about cams for a while, then tiperformance started asking about them so I thought I'd see if I could get a GB going.

One thing that I was curious about, how would the rear end gearing affect the cam grinds? I am not questioning you, I was just curious.

Hmm, pretty good price. But my DD is for sale and I can't take the Z3 out of commission right now. Anyone know of a good place to get replacement cams?

I've got 210k miles on my m42 and am interested in all of this. I am either going to be doing an engine swap, or I'm going to rebuild/build up my current motor.

What do you guys think I should do? I would probably go with the best bang for buck option.

Glad I could get the wheels rolling on this. I have been thinking about cams for a while, then tiperformance started asking about them so I thought I'd see if I could get a GB going.

One thing that I was curious about, how would the rear end gearing affect the cam grinds? I am not questioning you, I was just curious.

To be honest with you i'm not sure exactly how it effects the grind but the result is that it creats a much smaller power loss when shifting.


Hmm, pretty good price. But my DD is for sale and I can't take the Z3 out of commission right now. Anyone know of a good place to get replacement cams?

I would look on Car-part.com for junkyards in your area. or find someone doing a s50/52 swap to see if they still want thier m44 cams.

I've got 210k miles on my m42 and am interested in all of this. I am either going to be doing an engine swap, or I'm going to rebuild/build up my current motor.

What do you guys think I should do? I would probably go with the best bang for buck option.

Personally if you dont mind downtime i would take the motor currently in there out and have it rebuilt (I can do this as well with any custom thing that i offer or that you want) But if downtime does matter to you then i would try and find one to build. Another option is that i have a spare block,rods,head,cams,oilpan and a few other things. The main things i would need for internals are windage tray and asst bolts but i bet i can find those easy enough. anyways to get to my point i have all these spare parts that i can build a motor up for ya (your choice of pistons,pins rings etc) as well as any headwork that you want (the head and all parts assoc. need to be cleaned and worked over a tad. (IMHO that would be your best bet that way you have minimal down time and i would be able to get started on it right away)

Tom

I'm IN. I have both cams out of my car (block and head still at the machine shop), so all I need to know is where to ship them.

Specs on my M42 build.

8.5:1 CR ratio CP pistons
Cermaic coated combustion chambers, piston tops, and exhaust ports
GT28RS turbo (running between 15 to 20 psi), hoping for full 15lbs at 3000rpm (which is not too much to ask actually).
I will be using a smaller rear end. In the 3.5:1 area.
I am doing my own Standalone EMU.

I also have new valve springs I ordered for myself. Car will probably end up being a stop light warrior and occasional auto-x car. Although after the turbo it won't do too well at that I'm sure. 300+hp in a 2400lb car = tires that wish they were made of steel.

Keep me posted!!!

I'm IN. I have both cams out of my car (block and head still at the machine shop), so all I need to know is where to ship them.

Specs on my M42 build.

8.5:1 CR ratio CP pistons
Cermaic coated combustion chambers, piston tops, and exhaust ports
GT28RS turbo (running between 15 to 20 psi), hoping for full 15lbs at 3000rpm (which is not too much to ask actually).
I will be using a smaller rear end. In the 3.5:1 area.
I am doing my own Standalone EMU.

I also have new valve springs I ordered for myself. Car will probably end up being a stop light warrior and occasional auto-x car. Although after the turbo it won't do too well at that I'm sure. 300+hp in a 2400lb car = tires that wish they were made of steel.

Keep me posted!!!


Awesome, send me a pm with your valve spring specs and the other things i needed, such as gear ratios for all the gears in your tranny etc. and i will send you a paypal acct and a shipping address. but we need to wait for 4 people to get in on this so that way i can give that pricing otherwise it will be a tad more.

Thanks
Tom

I have more questions.

1. Before payment and cams are sent out is there any way we can get the specs, I am sure alot of us would like to know what we are getting before we pay the cash.

2. What is the name of the company actually doing the work, and do they have any expierence with the M42 and M44 engine, if not I am almost tempted to stick with the specs that Kent cams, bmpdesign, and bimmer performance use.

3. Since you say that we will need atleast a computer reflash, what are the costs of having Nick G. reflash the computer and could we possibly get a group deal on that?

Sorry for all the questions, I just want to make sure everything is going to work out well.

I have checked on www.car-part.com for a set of cams and it appears that they want atleast $300 a cam. I called one place and they said $300 for a set and most places won't even sell you just the cams. With that said you would be better off buying a spare head or even better yet a spare engine.

I have more questions.

1. Before payment and cams are sent out is there any way we can get the specs, I am sure alot of us would like to know what we are getting before we pay the cash.

2. What is the name of the company actually doing the work, and do they have any expierence with the M42 and M44 engine, if not I am almost tempted to stick with the specs that Kent cams, bmpdesign, and bimmer performance use.

3. Since you say that we will need atleast a computer reflash, what are the costs of having Nick G. reflash the computer and could we possibly get a group deal on that?

Sorry for all the questions, I just want to make sure everything is going to work out well.

I have checked on www.car-part.com for a set of cams and it appears that they want atleast $300 a cam. I called one place and they said $300 for a set and most places won't even sell you just the cams. With that said you would be better off buying a spare head or even better yet a spare engine.


1: as for that i can see what i can do. this may not be possible but i will check. chances are i will be able to get you some close numbers.

2: They dont have experience with m42/44 engines specifically but have done many different european grinds.

3: I would talk to NickG on that one, he would be your best bet to see what he can do for tuning for you.

4: That is very true sometimes it is better to just buy the whole motor and build the whole thing to take the power.

If you have any other questions feel free to ask.

Thanks
Tom

I've been having some difficulty coming up with a set of cams too. If anyone finds a good place to get them then please let us know. I may go junk yarding this weekend and see if I can come up with anything.

So right now we have:

1. GDB
2. SQ Bimmer
3. The Neek
4.


We just need one more guys.

So right now we have:

1. GDB
2. Tiperformance
3. The Neek
4.


We just need one more guys.
Via Tom and I's conversation, I would likely be doing this too.

Hey man, sorry but don't put me on the list just yet. I am working on getting the cams, but it seems junkyards confuse the M42 and the M44 and is is becoming a pain. I will keep working at finding a set, but I don't want to be a let down if I can't get them really fast.

What is the name of the shop that is regrinding the cams?
Is it Delta camshaft? I have heard alot of good things about Delta.

What is the name of the shop that is regrinding the cams?
Is it Delta camshaft? I have heard alot of good things about Delta.

Delta would be doing the grinding but i go through another shop that well basically gets delta to do these grinds, you would not be able to get these grinds if you went there yourself. How did you find out about delta?

Tom

Alright, Updated list

1. GDB
2. The Neek
3. SQ Bimmer
4. ????

btw, what kind of prices are you finding for the stock cams tiperformance?

GDB all the places I called wanted about $300 a set for cams, a bit out of line if you ask me. Now on car-part.com you can get a complete head with cams for $200-400, alot of places won't ship a head, due to their warranty.

I have heard of deltcams through a guy that I worked with over the summer at Napa auto parts, his son had a cam reground for his honda there and he said he was pleased with the quality.

I am narrowing down my search and will probably be buying a complete head, so I will have the cams ready to go soon hopefully.

What I really need to know from you is what cam specs I will be getting on the regrind,I would like to run them by my auto teachers and see what they think. I have a 98 318ti that is completly stock, 5 speed transmission with open differential. I am looking for the power to increase throughout the entire powerband so probably a kick in around 2500 RPM's, Please note that I want these to work with the stock Computer, or a minor reflash, because it is a daily driver, not a track car.

Provide me with that info, and I will get the head and have the $ ready to send.

GDB all the places I called wanted about $300 a set for cams, a bit out of line if you ask me. Now on car-part.com you can get a complete head with cams for $200-400, alot of places won't ship a head, due to their warranty.

I have heard of deltcams through a guy that I worked with over the summer at Napa auto parts, his son had a cam reground for his honda there and he said he was pleased with the quality.

I am narrowing down my search and will probably be buying a complete head, so I will have the cams ready to go soon hopefully.

What I really need to know from you is what cam specs I will be getting on the regrind,I would like to run them by my auto teachers and see what they think. I have a 98 318ti that is completly stock, 5 speed transmission with open differential. I am looking for the power to increase throughout the entire powerband so probably a kick in around 2500 RPM's, Please note that I want these to work with the stock Computer, or a minor reflash, because it is a daily driver, not a track car.

Provide me with that info, and I will get the head and have the $ ready to send.

These cams can work with a stock computer but there is NO way to realize the full potential of these cams without getting a custom chip or a piggyback type method of tuning. since you have a m44 talk to NickG he should be able to custom burn you a chip for a very resonable price. if you want you can even come up with some specs between yourself and your teachers and give those to me and i can have them ground to that if you'd like. also where are you located you make is sound like you are local.

Tom

Nope I am not local, I am in Indiana.

I can handle the reflash I just don't want to go with a standalone, and then I can have him raise the speed and rev limiter and hopefully remove the air injection info.

I don't really have any idea as what I should run for the specs, so I was hoping that you would be of help in that area. Do you know what would be good for a stock 318 engine with maybe a air intake and exhaust?

I am also interested in what the stock specs are for the M44 so see how much more lift and duration we will get on a regrind, I have tried the dealer, Mitchall, and all data and have yet to find any specs.

Yah ya'll are better off just buying complete head then removing the cams. Plus you can port and polish while its out.

Yah ya'll are better off just buying complete head then removing the cams. Plus you can port and polish while its out.

This is something that i can arrange at a pretty good price as well. I can do just about anything from a simple port and polish to doing things like on my head where i have a custom built port for a water temp sensor to get the temp from the water jacket in the head. (most important area IMHO)

Austin: did you want a set?

Tom

I'm not sure yet. Whats your price on P&P ?

I'm not sure yet. Whats your price on P&P ?

I will compare my products to that of VAC motorsports because they are only company i know of the make real aftermarket engine components meant specifically for the m42 engine. (they dont make any m44 heads only the HG)

Ok here is the price for my stg1 head (basically VAC's stg2)

Full port and polish to most physically possible without endagering waterjacket (this is not a gasket match!!)

New valve guides (will double check but am near positive this well be done)

3angle valve job with 45 deg backcut on the base of the valve with matching machine work on valve seat to keep a good seal

surface top and bottom of head to keep straight and true

balance and blueprint Stock valve springs (need to be included)

pressure test to check seal

Balanced valves

All this for $650 W/O cams $900 W/cams (VAC's stg2 goes for $1300 W/O cams where as mine is $650 W/O cams) so for the same price as VAC's (900w/cams compared to 1300w/o) you can have a very nice head WITH CAMS!!

Additional items are available at an extra cost

250lb valve springs - $70 just for the set $60 with the purchase of a set of cams or head.

Custom built copper m42 head gasket - $90 shipped! (VAC's HG is $170 and they dont make a m42 unit)

If someone is willing to send me a m44 headgasket i can start the production of m44 Copper headgaskets as well.

Custom built port in water jacket in the back of the head for water temp guage sensor - TBA (plug adapter from guage must be supplied)

There is the current product list.

Possible future products when money and time come my way

-Stg1 turbo kit

-pullies (at least ltw, possibly underdrive)

-video of my car which has many of my products

Thanks everybody. I have the gear ratios for the E36 318 and m3 tranny and the E30 318 tranny so now whoever wants to get anything involving cams all i will need is to know what tranny, rear diff ratio you have and your address. then i will send you a pm with my paypal account info. If anyone is worried about this due to that i dont have alot of posts here Go onto DTMpower (mainly the PNW regional chapter) and look for my name (943184dr) you will see that i am very active and well known (about 1400 posts in 2 years) if that helps at all, you can even ask there in the PNW forum about who knows me and how reputable that i am.

Thanks and take care

Tom

Just as an added Bonus, if you all get two people that want heads done by me. I will throw in free shipping.

Tom

I'm going to be giving 943184dr my car for about a month. I could not find anyone who was willing to do the amount of work he is going to do for the price he will do it at. Looking forward to an stg1 turbo :D

I'm going to be giving 943184dr my car for about a month. I could not find anyone who was willing to do the amount of work he is going to do for the price he will do it at. Looking forward to an stg1 turbo :D

Well yours, if you decide to what we talked about will be more of a stg2 :D

Tom

I willingly sit corrected :cool

On the head porting and polishing, are the heads going to be put on a flow bench before and after so numbers can be compared on each cylinder? What is the trun around time, on having a head ported and polished? Also how long will it take to get the cams done?

One other question is how many M42-M44 engines have you built that are complete, and what kind of numbers are be getting? I am planning on doing a before and after Dyno run on my car. Just wondered what others are putting out.

On the head porting and polishing, are the heads going to be put on a flow bench before and after so numbers can be compared on each cylinder? What is the trun around time, on having a head ported and polished? Also how long will it take to get the cams done?

One other question is how many M42-M44 engines have you built that are complete, and what kind of numbers are be getting? I am planning on doing a before and after Dyno run on my car. Just wondered what others are putting out.

As for flow benching, i can have that done as well. if you'd like. for turn around time that will depend on how busy my shop is at the time each one is brought in to them. Unfortunatly the one motor i have built is not in my car yet due to UUC taking now over 3 months to get me my flywheel and clutch pack but hopefully should be running soon (expect output of ~450-500bhp at 25psi after break in) unfortunatly I kind of stumbled into this and haven't really built any other motors but am very willing to work with anyone interested as these will be some of the first versions of these to go out. I assure you all though that the machinist doing to work is a prefection freak!! he is extremely good at what he does and specializes in head work. Honestly i would not be surprised with the stg1 head, cams and some good tuning via a SMT6 or other piggyback. you could acheive about 180bhp+. If someone could give me some dyno sheets of before and after they have done any of my mods with a list of any other mods they have that would be great that way i can post them up on a future site to start selling these products and make them available to the 318 crowd.

Thanks
Tom

I'd like to be in on this, but I can't commit right now. Current funds sit at around $100, and I won't be getting paid from my new job for another 2 or 3 weeks which sucks nuts. Not to mention that I would need to go out there and strip off the head and pull the cams, currently I have no time permitting for such activities.

I'm practically working a full time job (pulling about 30 hours a week) on top of finishing out my senior year of HS. I get out of school at noon to go to work at 2, and not get home til 10, and get up at 6 to get to school by 7:20. Fun days huh?

But I've got an NA m42, and will probably keep it that for a few years until I'm ready to really build the car up. I'll eventually be hoping to run a DASC kit on the m42, and would love to see 200rwhp in my e21. As it stands, I have 0rwhp because my old block is about 1 foot infront of the car, and my new m42 is sitting on a stand in my garage waiting for me to clean and renew it (hoses ect).

It will be running with the stock tranny from a 91 e30 318, with a 3.91 rear end. But that's a few months at best away.

I'd like to be in on this, but I can't commit right now. Current funds sit at around $100, and I won't be getting paid from my new job for another 2 or 3 weeks which sucks nuts. Not to mention that I would need to go out there and strip off the head and pull the cams, currently I have no time permitting for such activities.

I'm practically working a full time job (pulling about 30 hours a week) on top of finishing out my senior year of HS. I get out of school at noon to go to work at 2, and not get home til 10, and get up at 6 to get to school by 7:20. Fun days huh?

But I've got an NA m42, and will probably keep it that for a few years until I'm ready to really build the car up. I'll eventually be hoping to run a DASC kit on the m42, and would love to see 200rwhp in my e21. As it stands, I have 0rwhp because my old block is about 1 foot infront of the car, and my new m42 is sitting on a stand in my garage waiting for me to clean and renew it (hoses ect).

It will be running with the stock tranny from a 91 e30 318, with a 3.91 rear end. But that's a few months at best away.
I'm goin for at least 250 rwhp. Why a DASC and not a t/c?

I'm goin for at least 250 rwhp. Why a DASC and not a t/c?

And with the work we are going to do with your car this will easily be acheived and for ALOT cheaper then what you would have to put into the DASC to get it to acheive that.

Tom

And with the work we are going to do with your car this will easily be acheived and for ALOT cheaper then what you would have to put into the DASC to get it to acheive that.

Tom
That's my justification anyway. Just the cost of the DASC is more than half of what this work will cost. And I'll have a mostly rebuilt motor to boot so reliability shouldn't be an issue.

That's my justification anyway. Just the cost of the DASC is more than half of what this work will cost. And I'll have a mostly rebuilt motor to boot so reliability shouldn't be an issue.

DASC should be just under half yeah and the motor will be totally rebuilt to do near 300whp capable (this doesn't increase the cost that we discussed)

Tom

I dunno where you found a DASC but I could only find em for like $3 - $3.5k!

SQ: thats about how much i figured. All though we didn't discuss figures much. Just to be safe on the high side with the cost of the turbo kit, built motor that being about half is WAY on the high side but better safe then sorry. Chances are it would be drasticly less but i didn't want you to get stretched too thin.

ok here is the list thus far (GDB is unforunatly no longer able to participate)

1: SQ bimmer
2: The Neek
3: Tiperformance???
4: JoeZ????
5: Austin???

SQ: thats about how much i figured. All though we didn't discuss figures much. Just to be safe on the high side with the cost of the turbo kit, built motor that being about half is WAY on the high side but better safe then sorry. Chances are it would be drasticly less but i didn't want you to get stretched too thin.

ok here is the list thus far (GDB is unforunatly no longer able to participate)

1: SQ bimmer
2: The Neek
3: Tiperformance???
4: JoeZ????
5: Austin???


Probably not for me :(

I need cam specs before I drop any change on this. I know you trust your man and all, but I need to mill over the numbers and have my machinest take a look at what you're thinking (he also is a perfectionist). I mean from the surface what I'm building might look like a mild version of your car, but in realitiy my car will probably be daily driven for atleast a couple of years (graduating college in December). So I don't want the cams to be TOO wild.

What about the adjustable cam sprockets? do you need those as well to do the regrind?

Isn't head work sort of a moot point with a forced induction application? I mean yeah, every little bit helps. But the Reynold's numbers on the intake charge are so high that usuall NA techniques to create power just aren't worth the money. That's how I see it. I'm getting a 3 angle grind because that's all my machinest does. But other than that, the head is stock. I just don't really see the point.

Austin: a P&P alone would be $300

The Neek: you only need to supply the adjustable cam sprokets if you plan on mechanically advancing the timing. And yes i can have the specs of the cam for you prior to you having them ground.

Oh yes and i checked on the valve guide issue it wont be new valve guides but valve liners that work just as well.

Tom

PS: pricing has been finalized on everything as i double checked with my machinist as to what everything cost.

94318DR -- I don't know about the M44's but the M42 has adjustable sprockets already. I was just wondering if you needed them for the machining process. Of course these cams will come with timing specs already. I just wasn't sure if you would need the sprockets for some reason.

They won't need the bearing caps either will they? I can't remember how the bearings worked on the cams. But I think that they are the same as crank bearings (only smaller).

Just thought I would ask this, but do you think it would be beneficial to use a MAF sensor from a M3 after all this work is done??

TheNeek: they do need them for the machining process so that way if you plan to mechanically advance the timing or retard it via those sprokets then they would redo the marks on them so they fit with the new cam grinds. also they would need the bearing caps only if you plan on having me do the whole head. (which in your case it sounds like you already have that worked)

Tiperformance: using a MAF would be beneficial if you were using a piggback unit that can run it. personally i am using a MAP sensor which i found to be superior in the sense that it wont be blocking any airflow compared to the MAF sensor.

Tom

Not sure what cams I would need. I know one 318 on the board has 275/275 10.5 and 11psi boost. I plan on running 11psi also s/c. Not sure if I missed it but what warrante comes with the cams or head work ?

Having custom software is proving to be somewhat difficult in Dallas as no one does this for BMW's. I need piggyback with MAF sensor. Parts is the easy part its the tuning thats the hard part.

Any luck on getting the stock camshaft specifications on the M44? I have checked several places including the dealer and I have had no luck.

A few more things for you.

With a regrind will we need valves with longer stems on a regrind due, because I have heard that the reground cam will have a smaller base circle and you need longer valve stems to make up for that?


Also Before this group buy, I contacted many places about getting cams reground, even Delta who is going to be regrinding the cams for this GP, and none of them could do it. Have you checked with Delta to make sure that they will and can regrind the cams to any specs? Because everyone told me before that "we can only repair a cam to factory specs"

Do you know what the process is for grinding a new cam?

One place that told me that they could probably do it told me that they would have to make a master cam for each different cam profile that I would want, because they would not have a master for a M44 camshaft, $150 a pop to make the master on top of the regrinds. This place was in IL I am pretty sure.

I was also told that you can only regrind a cam so far. And judging by the specs on BMPdesign their cams are ground on billet blanks, not reground. So to get those cams you will either have to find Blanks or have a shop that is willing to weld material on the lobes and then regrind, which isn't as reliable from what I have read many of places.

Any luck on getting the stock camshaft specifications on the M44? I have checked several places including the dealer and I have had no luck.

A few more things for you.

With a regrind will we need valves with longer stems on a regrind due, because I have heard that the reground cam will have a smaller base circle and you need longer valve stems to make up for that?


Also Before this group buy, I contacted many places about getting cams reground, even Delta who is going to be regrinding the cams for this GP, and none of them could do it. Have you checked with Delta to make sure that they will and can regrind the cams to any specs? Because everyone told me before that "we can only repair a cam to factory specs"

Do you know what the process is for grinding a new cam?

One place that told me that they could probably do it told me that they would have to make a master cam for each different cam profile that I would want, because they would not have a master for a M44 camshaft, $150 a pop to make the master on top of the regrinds. This place was in IL I am pretty sure.

I was also told that you can only regrind a cam so far. And judging by the specs on BMPdesign their cams are ground on billet blanks, not reground. So to get those cams you will either have to find Blanks or have a shop that is willing to weld material on the lobes and then regrind, which isn't as reliable from what I have read many of places.

1: I wil double check on valve stems to see if longer ones will be needed.

2: I do not know the process for grinding these cams all though i do know that if you call delta yourself they will tell you that they cant do it. all though when i talked to my machinist who does hundreds of cams a month through them (they are one of the biggest engine builders in the area) he talked to them and it just involves a bit more work to get it to work but they will do it.

3: you are right, you can only grind a stock cam so far. if someone was able to get ahold of a source for blanks then they or myself could make different cams all day long for these motors.

Tom

Also the M44 uses rocker arms. If we increase the ratio on the rocker arm we will inturn get more lift. Does anyone know if there are aftermarket rockers that will fit this engine?

Also the M44 uses rocker arms. If we increase the ratio on the rocker arm we will inturn get more lift. Does anyone know if there are aftermarket rockers that will fit this engine?


I'm sorry but if i understand rocker arms correctly it is impossible for a m44 to have rocker arms cuz that would imply that it is a OHV engine. someone correct me if i'm wrong.

Tom

Also the M44 uses rocker arms. If we increase the ratio on the rocker arm we will inturn get more lift. Does anyone know if there are aftermarket rockers that will fit this engine?

I don't know about you guys, but my cams act directly on the valves (through the dydraulic tappet of course). If you've got rockers, then you don't have an M42. I've never lifted the valve cover off of an M44, but I SERIOUSLY doubt that it has rockers. Rockers are for M10's that are SOHC.

And if I need new valves I'm out. Unless the reground cams are drop in, I can't do the group buy. BUT, I don't know how far the hydraulics can adjust for, but the whole point of the hydraulic tappets is that they "adjust" themselves. I'm sure that as long as you don't get too radical with the grind it will work with the original tappets. BUT, this is still a good point. Something to think about, if the regrinds give me NASTY valve lash I'll be super pissed.

I don't know about you guys, but my cams act directly on the valves (through the dydraulic tappet of course). If you've got rockers, then you don't have an M42. I've never lifted the valve cover off of an M44, but I SERIOUSLY doubt that it has rockers. Rockers are for M10's that are SOHC.

And if I need new valves I'm out. Unless the reground cams are drop in, I can't do the group buy. BUT, I don't know how far the hydraulics can adjust for, but the whole point of the hydraulic tappets is that they "adjust" themselves. I'm sure that as long as you don't get too radical with the grind it will work with the original tappets. BUT, this is still a good point. Something to think about, if the regrinds give me NASTY valve lash I'll be super pissed.

Here is an update, i just got back from talking to my machinist and here is what he said. These cams will be ground by removing part of the base circle consequently moving the location of the center of the camshaft thus changing the parameters of the cam. But by doing this (here is the reason why delta said what they did) this alters how much play you have with the valve stem there is actually quite a bit of play in the valve stem already but this means that I cant do any wild cams without the head, the reason i would need the head is the valves would have to be modified in order to give some more clearance with the stem but I can do mild and even not so mild cams very easy and you should be just fine. even if anyone went with a wile cam we can just alter the stock valves to work, no one will need new valves.

Thanks again.

I'm sorry but if i understand rocker arms correctly it is impossible for a m44 to have rocker arms cuz that would imply that it is a OHV engine. someone correct me if i'm wrong.

Tom

check this out http://rust.mine.nu/bmw/showparts.do?model=CG73&mospid=45265&prod=19980500&btnr=11_1565&hg=11&fg=25

M42 uses solid lifters, the M44 uses the "HYDR.VALVE PUSHROD" and "ROLLER DRAG LEVER"

check this out http://rust.mine.nu/bmw/showparts.do?model=CG73&mospid=45265&prod=19980500&btnr=11_1565&hg=11&fg=25

M42 uses solid lifters, the M44 uses the "HYDR.VALVE PUSHROD" and "ROLLER DRAG LEVER"

Well I'll be damned... learn something new everyday. M42's are still hydraulic... not solid lifters.

Well I'll be damned... learn something new everyday. M42's are still hydraulic... not solid lifters.

Same here all though the m44 still has hydrolic lash adjusters just they are underneath the knuckle of the rocker arm. so the same still applies to the m42/44 grinds that are avilable without me having the head.

Tom

Ok here is an update. I found a company i can get cam blanks for both m42's and m44's for all i need are a set of stockers in order to have the blanks made. The only kicker is that the blanks cost about $600 a set. so if anyone is interested i can have some completely custom cams ground for about $850+shipping. or i can do stock regrinds for the price quoted before.

Tom

And this mystery company is? I'll have to pass on the regrinds if I can get blanks. I'll have my local shop do the cam grind for me.

And this mystery company is? I'll have to pass on the regrinds if I can get blanks. I'll have my local shop do the cam grind for me.

The company that i found the blanks from? that would be kent and piper cams in the UK. the dealer for them is specialized engines in the UK.

Tom

What would be the cost of the cams For just a single person, since it looks like we are going to have a little trouble getting 4 people? I am looking to do the Kent Cams specs.

What would be the cost of the cams For just a single person, since it looks like we are going to have a little trouble getting 4 people? I am looking to do the Kent Cams specs.

Cost per person is $300+shipping. I do not know what the kent cams specs are so i can't answer anything based on that. what were they?

Thanks
Tom

I am waiting for www.itsallaboutspeed.com to finish their intercooler kit for the DASC. Ideally I would want the intercooler, cams, and polished head all installed together, so I can have Nick to get my computer to run with the setup complete. I heard a 20% increase for the cams... what if I get it with a polished head too? What can I expect?

http://www.downingatlanta.com/images/power&torque.PDF

I am waiting for www.itsallaboutspeed.com to finish their intercooler kit for the DASC. Ideally I would want the intercooler, cams, and polished head all installed together, so I can have Nick to get my computer to run with the setup complete. I heard a 20% increase for the cams... what if I get it with a polished head too? What can I expect?

http://www.downingatlanta.com/images/power&torque.PDF

Honestly i would not be surprised with those two items to get 220+whp easy at 8.5psi. If you went with my stg1 head i bet you could gain ALOT more.

Tom

Honestly i would not be surprised with those two items to get 220+whp easy at 8.5psi. If you went with my stg1 head i bet you could gain ALOT more.

Tom

I have a 95 318 with a polished head, S&S Valves, Titanium Valve springs, ARP Stud Kit, 11 PSI pulley, 272 X 10.5 Cams, and a MAF conversion and I got 212 RWHP on a dynojet.

-Chad

I have a 95 318 with a polished head, S&S Valves, Titanium Valve springs, ARP Stud Kit, 11 PSI pulley, 272 X 10.5 Cams, and a MAF conversion and I got 212 RWHP on a dynojet.

-Chad


Hmmmm. maybe I was wrong all though that seems a bit low for that amount of mods to the head.

Tom

I have a 95 318 with a polished head, S&S Valves, Titanium Valve springs, ARP Stud Kit, 11 PSI pulley, 272 X 10.5 Cams, and a MAF conversion and I got 212 RWHP on a dynojet.

-Chad

This is the design I plan on following since its proven and produce's the power I am looking for. But I've already talked to you about that I might look you up when I need that pulley. I am behind I wished to have my machine work done before xmas might not make it.

Have you raced anything so I can get an idea of what cars its equal to ?

Hmmmm. maybe I was wrong all though that seems a bit low for that amount of mods to the head.

Tom

The car does run a little rich I get down to about 11:1 at WOT. So I know I can make a little more power if I lean it out a bit. Also, the split second unit is a piggy back system, so if I went Stand Alone like TEC III, or SDS I am sure that I would pick up the extra 8 HP in a sec.


As far as racing I have gone up against a stock E36 M3 and E30 M3 and I eat them allive. I think it is the power to weight thing since the cars weighs 300 lbs less. I have a friend who has a DASC as well with Supersprint headers, and exhaust plus a CAI and I can pull three car lengths on him through second gear.

I would like 225 to the wheels but I am very happy with the results. Maybe a Zex system and Iwill get 312 RWHP, now that would be a trip. I am such a horsepower whore.

so is anyone still interested in having me do work for them?

Thanks
Tom

Ok i have some new info. the blanks ground to your specs would be $650+shipping. If anyone wanted to go pretty radical with these though i would need your head in order to modify your stock valves or you would have to put new valves in it to allow for increased stem length needed.

Thanks
Tom

ok here's something else, if anyone needs an intercooler let me know i can have those made as well as turbo manifolds. :D :D

Tom

Ok can you find out a few more things for me?

Are they porting the heads by hand, or using a CNC mill to do the work. I know the polishing is more than likely done my hand, just wondering about the actual porting process.

Are the Cumbustion chambers CC'ed afterwards and if so what how close are they to each other,because if they are off it can cause emissions problems, among other things.

Ok can you find out a few more things for me?

Are they porting the heads by hand, or using a CNC mill to do the work. I know the polishing is more than likely done my hand, just wondering about the actual porting process.

Are the Cumbustion chambers CC'ed afterwards and if so what how close are they to each other,because if they are off it can cause emissions problems, among other things.

I will check on these things tommorow. But just to give you an idea i beleive that the porting is done with a CNC and the combustion chamber's are CC'ed and made sure they are balanced but i will double check.


Tom

anyone still interested? I would love to build some parts for you guys.

tom

The more I think about it... the less I want reground cams. I'm building my own intake and exhaust manifold, and I really can't see myself needing much else.

I do have a question though. I've heard that the M42 has a "full pan" of oil which means that you can't run your turbo oil return into the oil pan. Is this true? I can't believe as the crank would dip into the oil causing windage and large amounts of foaming.

The more I think about it... the less I want reground cams. I'm building my own intake and exhaust manifold, and I really can't see myself needing much else.

I do have a question though. I've heard that the M42 has a "full pan" of oil which means that you can't run your turbo oil return into the oil pan. Is this true? I can't believe as the crank would dip into the oil causing windage and large amounts of foaming.

no its not true, one dead give away is where the bottom of the dipstick is, which is located about 1/2 way at least down the pan.

Tom

so is anyone still interested?

Tom

What kind of benifits would I gain with just my stock motor? Would they be large or what?

What kind of benifits would I gain with just my stock motor? Would they be large or what?
lol

What kind of benifits would I gain with just my stock motor? Would they be large or what?

You can have some pretty healthy gains from my stock regrinds. estimate 15-20% based on my research. On custom ground blanks the only limit is what you have done to your head and valves in order to allow the higher lift/duration. keep in mind the blanks are roughly 1/2 the price of shricks and you can go as extreme as you like. The choice is yours as to what you would like to do. all i need to know is your goals and i can come up with a setup that should work nicely.

Tom

lol
Gotta learn sometime...

Gotta learn sometime...
Sorry, I was a little out of it last night, no offense was intended.

But the gains would be pretty decent considering the displacement of these motors but it depends what you want to do with the car. Anything can be done just depends what you want. I think 20-30 hp is easily attained with just a basic setup.

Sorry, I was a little out of it last night, no offense was intended.

But the gains would be pretty decent considering the displacement of these motors but it depends what you want to do with the car. Anything can be done just depends what you want. I think 20-30 hp is easily attained with just a basic setup.

I would have to agree as the stock cams are pretty mild.

Tom