BMW is looking to bring a...minivan to the market near the end of the decade...seriously.

I can just see it, i-drive for soccer moms - yeah right...

:(

Well, it's a big market. Can't blame them for wanting a piece of it. I'll still never buy a minivan, even a BMW. :D

Those minivans better come in stick.

:)

Cuz I sure as hell am going to need one soon.

I saw the same thing. It was either in Bimmer or Roundel. Who would have thought that Porche would have come out with an SUV? Unfortunately, this follows the same trend that we have been seeing over the last several years from BMW. I hate to say it, but they have been very successful at it. Despite all of the negative press and enthusiast complaints, sales of the new E65/66 7 Series far exceed those of the E38. They are marketing to the lowest common denominator. They moved the E65/66 shifter to the steering wheel to make room for cup holders! This was a quote from a magazine that I read recently. I think that it was an interview with Bangle. When idiot customers complained that their coolant temperature gauges fluctuated with the varying temperatures, BMW responded by electronically damping the fluctuations so that the gauges almost always remain steady in the center. The next step was to eliminate them completely. What is next, eliminating buttons and putting them on a computer screen? Oh wait, they did that already.

BMW’s sales will increase and the stockholders will be happy. The question is, what will happen to the quality and more importantly the design and technical innovations. What will their long time core customers think? If may not matter if there is an endless supply of yuppie wanna bes and soccer moms that are willing to step up with their check books

Its wednesday and now i want to kill myself..thanks

BMW’s sales will increase and the stockholders will be happy. The question is, what will happen to the quality and more importantly the design and technical innovations. What will their long time core customers think? If may not matter if there is an endless supply of yuppie wanna bes and soccer moms that are willing to step up with their check books

Well said Dave. I tried...I really did...to make myself like the new 745 Sport. In the end I had to go with my 01' Sport. I have not regretted the decision for even a second.

BMW is looking to bring a...minivan to the market near the end of the decade...seriously.

I can just see it, i-drive for soccer moms - yeah right...
damnit...they took my idea to the next level already! i was just talking about that with my wife last week. most importantly i wanna keep my family comfortable...that was 1/2 of my reason behind getting the e38. the other 1/2 is that i need performance. if they can put that in a minivan and keep it between $40-45k, they'll get my money. i was thinking if they made it all wheel drive, they would do VERY wheel...at least in the snowy states. of course, it'll depend if the wife likes it cause i'm keeping my e38!:D

My fourrunner OWNS minvans..and for 32K too

Vehicles that big with no towing capacity suck..my big problem with the X5 is some huge vehicle that can barely tow a jetski and only seats five people

Well, it's a big market. Can't blame them for wanting a piece of it. I'll still never buy a minivan, even a BMW. :D

That's why you make the wife drive one. We have gone through two Odysee's and I don't think I ever drove either one. They are geeky, but in terms of price to versatility ratio, you can't beat them. Ours is on the high end at $33,000, but where else can you get seating for seven that is easy to get in and out of (no climbing over seats like SUV's) and a home theatre on wheels. Not to mention the ability to go to Home Depot and pick up stock (which I never do, but I COULD if I wanted too :)

Seriously, I had to really talk my wife into it. But the bottom line is car pooling. If you ain't got a minivan, you aint in the car pool.

READ - she would have to drive the kids to school every day and may miss Oprah.

I keep thinking about that TV commercial where a few guys are waiting at the carwash while their cars are being dried. One by one, these guys notice who's the owner of the "station wagon", the "sports car" and finally the "minivan". Funny, at the end of the commerical, the minivan is dry and ready to be claimed but none of the guys want to lose face and claim it is theirs.

Funny and memorable. I don't remember what the commercial was for, probably for a sports sedan, forgot the make.

Let's be honest folks -- the BMW SUV wasn't exactly my idea of continuing BMW's tradition of performance and innovation in a DRIVER's car. It was in continuing their tradition of trying to be profitable by responding to the demands of the (American) market and their ridiculous obsession with SUVs. Most ppl in other countries realize that the station wagon is much better suited to hauling stuff along with people while still delivering a rewarding driving experience.

But I digress.

The minivan, on the other hand, as anyone with more than one kid can attest, is an indisposable necessity for modern families. When my wife and I bought the Odyssey back in late 2000, I looked hard for a high end, performance oriented minivan. Guess what -- it didn't/doesn't exist. The best we could do was an Oddyssey EX with nav, and we had to get dealer installed leather as Honda didn't offer factory leather at that time. BMW coming to market with a minivan is a fantastic idea. Drop a 4.6 or 4.8 engine into it, make it 4wd, and sign me up.

Let's be honest folks -- the BMW SUV wasn't exactly my idea of continuing BMW's tradition of performance and innovation in a DRIVER's car. It was in continuing their tradition of trying to be profitable by responding to the demands of the (American) market and their ridiculous obsession with SUVs. Most ppl in other countries realize that the station wagon is much better suited to hauling stuff along with people while still delivering a rewarding driving experience.

But I digress.

The minivan, on the other hand, as anyone with more than one kid can attest, is an indisposable necessity for modern families. When my wife and I bought the Odyssey back in late 2000, I looked hard for a high end, performance oriented minivan. Guess what -- it didn't/doesn't exist. The best we could do was an Oddyssey EX with nav, and we had to get dealer installed leather as Honda didn't offer factory leather at that time. BMW coming to market with a minivan is a fantastic idea. Drop a 4.6 or 4.8 engine into it, make it 4wd, and sign me up.
what he said...

Let's be honest folks -- the BMW SUV wasn't exactly my idea of continuing BMW's tradition of performance and innovation in a DRIVER's car. It was in continuing their tradition of trying to be profitable by responding to the demands of the (American) market and their ridiculous obsession with SUVs. Most ppl in other countries realize that the station wagon is much better suited to hauling stuff along with people while still delivering a rewarding driving experience.

But I digress.

The minivan, on the other hand, as anyone with more than one kid can attest, is an indisposable necessity for modern families. When my wife and I bought the Odyssey back in late 2000, I looked hard for a high end, performance oriented minivan. Guess what -- it didn't/doesn't exist. The best we could do was an Oddyssey EX with nav, and we had to get dealer installed leather as Honda didn't offer factory leather at that time. BMW coming to market with a minivan is a fantastic idea. Drop a 4.6 or 4.8 engine into it, make it 4wd, and sign me up.

Some validity here, but I have to say there's no way in h*ll it will be 4WD, as that would wipe out their X3/5 market. For proof, note that there's no 4WD 5-series wagon, only a 3-series...

And I will stay with an SUV for hauling the family - call it the carwash stigma if you must...! (see carwash post above)

Some validity here, but I have to say there's no way in h*ll it will be 4WD, as that would wipe out their X3/5 market. For proof, note that there's no 4WD 5-series wagon, only a 3-series...

And I will stay with an SUV for hauling the family - call it the carwash stigma if you must...! (see carwash post above)

Reed, but if it's not 4WD, would BMW actually make a front wheel drive vehicle?? The answer is probably no and BMW is not stupid enough to try to market a rear wheel drive minivan against the front wheel drive competition. Minivan's must be front wheel drive for safety reasons. Anyone remember the first Ford Aero Whatever or the Chevy early entries?

I'd say it is going to be all wheel drive. All the major minivan makers will have this as an option within the next two years (Toyota does now, next year for Honda). I don't think it will cut into the X3/X5 market as I don't think people say - should I get an SUV or a minivan? They are two separate markets. BMW is looking to take away from Toyota, Honda and Chrysler.

Sign me.....um.....my wife up for one of those bimmer bad boys when they hit the street.

Reed, but if it's not 4WD, would BMW actually make a front wheel drive vehicle?? The answer is probably no and BMW is not stupid enough to try to market a rear wheel drive minivan against the front wheel drive competition. Minivan's must be front wheel drive for safety reasons. Anyone remember the first Ford Aero Whatever or the Chevy early entries?

I'd say it is going to be all wheel drive. All the major minivan makers will have this as an option within the next two years (Toyota does now, next year for Honda). I don't think it will cut into the X3/X5 market as I don't think people say - should I get an SUV or a minivan? They are two separate markets. BMW is looking to take away from Toyota, Honda and Chrysler.

Sign me.....um.....my wife up for one of those bimmer bad boys when they hit the street.

Well, if it were 4WD, I'd at least look at it, I suppose....

But to me at least, a 4WD minivan starts to look pretty similar to an SUV, especially if you don't use the SUV to tow and never take it offroad...

First, No way in hell would I buy any Minivan. Thankfully my wife feels the same way. There are several people I know who love them, different strokes for different folks, right!

Second, lets not confuse 4WD and AWD. AWD vehicle in no way, shape or form = 4WD as you see on many Trucks and other SUV's. If BMW mocked the AWD they have on the X-5 it may be a hit, but I also think that depends on the price tag.

I admit to having an ‘88 Dodge Caravan a number of years ago. It was never a sports car, but of course, it was never intended to be. It was a very reliable and efficient way to haul around seven people and extra gear in the back. It was perfect for when I had a family with kids in their pre-teen and early teen years. I also used it at work to take the whole crew from the project that I was working on out to lunch in one vehicle.

We eventually bought a ’92 Ford Explorer. It did not seat as many people, but it could haul a lot more in the back, especially with the seats folded down. That worked out quite well, but again, it was never a sports car. I have kept it around because it has been cheap to drive and it takes care of the trips to the dump and Home Depot. Again, it does what it was intended to do.

Or at least I should say that it “did”. The transmission on the Explorer has been starting to go out. Rather than spend the money to get it fixed, I decided to buy a low mileage ‘88 Chevy Silverado 3500 pickup. It is an older model and it doesn’t look that great because the paint is peeling, but it is a big strong work truck, which is exactly what I wanted. It is and extended cab long bed dually with a 454 engine. It can haul over 2000 lbs in the bed and two a ten thousand pound trailer. It is certainly no sports car, but it does exactly what I want it to.

My point is this. There are lots of vehicles our there for lots of different people. There is nothing inherently “wrong” with certain types, it is just that they are suited for different customers.

With that said, I still feel that BMW is trying to get closer to being all things to all people and it is diluting the qualities that are responsible for making the brand that it was up until the “Bangle generation”.

First, No way in hell would I buy any Minivan. Thankfully my wife feels the same way. There are several people I know who love them, different strokes for different folks, right!

Second, lets not confuse 4WD and AWD. AWD vehicle in no way, shape or form = 4WD as you see on many Trucks and other SUV's. If BMW mocked the AWD they have on the X-5 it may be a hit, but I also think that depends on the price tag.

OK, to clarify, I'm thinking AWD - full-time, non-switchable, etc.

But I still think there are cannibalization issues here, with the X-cars...

With that said, I still feel that BMW is trying to get closer to being all things to all people and it is diluting the qualities that are responsible for making the brand that it was up until the “Bangle generation”.

Dave,

I hear you but having a lot of different lines of automobiles does not always have to be a bad thing. I think if BMW wants to keep up with Mercedes, they have to expand the line. I am sure you are aware of the zillion different lines of cars Mercedes has to offer. BMW's motivation for the X series had to be a response to the M-class and they did it right. The X is far superior to the M-class.

I agree on the Bangle generation. I will trade up this coming spring and sad to say, right now it looks like I am going S-class. I will take a good hard look at the new 5-series, but once you have had a big luxury sporty car, everything feels small and under-powered.

OK, to clarify, I'm thinking AWD - full-time, non-switchable, etc.

But I still think there are cannibalization issues here, with the X-cars...

I don't know anything about cannibalized issues with X-cars :), but I can tell you that my X-5 drives like a champ. It is not like any other AWD SUV/SAV I've driven. It is simply amazing and drives just like a typical BMW car. I do however put dunlop winter sport tires on the X-5 in winter for the fact that the handling with the stock michelins sucked here in Colorado.

I can't wait until the lease is up to try out an '05 maybe '06 model, I like the slight modifications to the X-5. Hopefully thet won't ruin it for '06, or it will be back to Jeep I go [which btw, the new style jeep look sweet in the commercials].

Dave,

I will take a good hard look at the new 5-series, but once you have had a big luxury sporty car, everything feels small and under-powered.

The 540 isn't under powered they just ruined it by restyling the exterior, cheapening the interior and I swear they shrunk its size.

Funny, I really like the exterior of the new 5. Yes, the 540 with the 4.4 is the way to go.

The 540 isn't under powered they just ruined it by restyling the exterior, cheapening the interior and I swear they shrunk its size.

I'm confused.

Are you guys talking about the E60? If so, it's a 545i...and it's fugly!

I'm confused.

Are you guys talking about the E60? If so, it's a 545i...and it's fugly!

Yea, that's right 545 [not 540 anymore] and it is fugly, but not under powered!

Yea, that's right 545 [not 540 anymore] and it is fugly, but not under powered!

True that - 325HP?

Yep, the 545i is what I am referencing.

You guys really think it's fugly? I think the sport version rocks. It seems to me they toned down the front and rear just enough from the seven to still keep it looking German, yet in line with the designs of today.

Most of you aren't going to like this, but our cars (including the last 5 and current 3) are starting to look boxy compared to every other high end car on the road. Don't get me wrong, I think Bangle is bad for BMW, but it seems clear the direction of the rounded design is consistent with Mercedes, Lexus, and Infinity. They are all looking more rounded.

If I could afford to be a 5 car family, I would easily keep my current 7 and also have my prior 7 and 3. But I yearn for the newer options and gadgets as well as a new design that screams new. We had the luxury from 1995 to 2001 of having cars in which the model year was indistinguishable. Don't read into this as me really caring what other people think, I hate the new seven and will not buy one regardless of the "newness". It has more to do with me feeling like my car is getting out dated. Again, if I could keep them all, I would. Just my opinion here, go easy on me :)

You guys really think it's fugly? I think the sport version rocks. It seems to me they toned down the front and rear just enough from the seven to still keep it looking German, yet in line with the designs of today.

Most of you aren't going to like this, but our cars (including the last 5 and current 3) are starting to look boxy compared to every other high end car on the road. Don't get me wrong, I think Bangle is bad for BMW, but it seems clear the direction of the rounded design is consistent with Mercedes, Lexus, and Infinity. They are all looking more rounded.

If I could afford to be a 5 car family, I would easily keep my current 7 and also have my prior 7 and 3. But I yearn for the newer options and gadgets as well as a new design that screams new. We had the luxury from 1995 to 2001 of having cars in which the model year was indistinguishable. Don't read into this as me really caring what other people think, I hate the new seven and will not buy one regardless of the "newness". It has more to do with me feeling like my car is getting out dated. Again, if I could keep them all, I would. Just my opinion here, go easy on me :)

Yup - I don't like it, but as always, to each his own..

And I still think the E38/39 designs look good. Boxy...?...not sure I see that.

Yup - I don't like it, but as always, to each his own..

And I still think the E38/39 designs look good. Boxy...?...not sure I see that.

Looks good? Most sophoisticated, hnadsome vehicles ever made..kind of like older S-class mercedes

All this minhivan stuff.....Im sure if they were renamed they wouldnt be hated.."minivan" appeals to the same crowd as "veggies" "comfy" and "cute"

No profits without market share. Why is it that the 05 3 series is the least f'd up looking of the new batch? Screw that up and there goes a large % of their business.

And I still think the E38/39 designs look good. Boxy...?...not sure I see that.

Maybe a term more like "sharper" rather than boxy. My Scout is boxy.

Our generation of cars looks sleek, IMO. The new ones are really 'porty' :shifty

Our generation of cars looks sleek, IMO. The new ones are really 'porty' :shifty

Is "porty" the same as portly...??

These are boxy:
http://www.chrysler.com/300/img/300c_header.jpg

These are sleak and stealthy, I think:
http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/8/web/416000-416999/416967_87_full.jpg


And while I'm rambling, I would really like to dress one of these up. I'll take the AWD [silver] that is starting to be available:
http://www.allpar.com/cars/concepts/photos/dodge-magnum.jpg


http://www.allpar.com/cars/concepts/photos/magnum-srt-8-rear.jpg

Maybe a term more like "sharper" rather than boxy. My Scout is boxy.
I think not,

http://www.toyotacelicaonline.com/celica1/news/bbx.jpg
To use the venacular of the common people.POS Boxy

I think not,

http://www.toyotacelicaonline.com/celica1/news/bbx.jpg
To use the venacular of the common people.POS Boxy

Ewwww - Scion