Are these special order?

Anyone know an online source for them? Also, what is the shaft diameter (huh huh... he said shaft)? Same as the externally adjustable SAs, same as the compress to adjust SAs or something entirely different?

Thanks,

JV

truechoice.com might have 'em

JV-

Check out TC Kline: http://tcklineracing.com/shocks.htm#double

They have the DA Konis there.

I know GC and Active Autowerke has Konis, but they didn't specifically list the DA like TCK did.

Isn't it TC that sells the "special" externally adjustable DA's? I think they add a knob on the top of the shock so you don't have to disassemble anything to make changes, I can't remember....

Isn't it TC that sells the "special" externally adjustable DA's? I think they add a knob on the top of the shock so you don't have to disassemble anything to make changes, I can't remember....

Yeah-

Someone I know has a TCK coilover with the DA Konis- and you can adjust the bound at the top of the shock (there is a flap/hole cut thru the trunk lining to put the wrench in) and rebound is controlled by a dial at the bottom of the shock under the car. I might have the bound/rebound switched, but you have the idea.

But it looks like you can order those DA Koni's separately.

Yeah-

Someone I know has a TCK coilover with the DA Konis- and you can adjust the bound at the top of the shock (there is a flap/hole cut thru the trunk lining to put the wrench in) and rebound is controlled by a dial at the bottom of the shock under the car. I might have the bound/rebound switched, but you have the idea.

But it looks like you can order those DA Koni's separately.

Correct, Nick has TCK DA fronts and might still be waiting on the rears.

Hm. They're pretty pricey. So you're saying that the standard DAs aren't externally adjustable? That's ridiculous.

John

Standard D/A should be externally adjustable. I love my fronts and can't wait for the rears. Pete at TC Kline can drill out OEM shock mounts for you.

Standard D/A should be externally adjustable. I love my fronts and can't wait for the rears. Pete at TC Kline can drill out OEM shock mounts for you.

Nick-what are you running the rears? Stock?

Standard D/A should be externally adjustable. I love my fronts and can't wait for the rears. Pete at TC Kline can drill out OEM shock mounts for you.

Thanks for the info regarding the DAs. According to the new Fastrack we shouldn't have to drill out the factory crappy rubber bushings anymore. I'm hoping to (with Ken's help) make some polyurethane rear shock mount bushings to fit the factory housings..

John

Standard D/A should be externally adjustable.
Is it the S/A that isn't externally adjustable or am I just making things up? :(

Is it the S/A that isn't externally adjustable or am I just making things up? :(

No, you are correct. Standard rear SAs are not externally adjustable.

Well worth the $50 each to get them modified.

John

No, you are correct. Standard rear SAs are not externally adjustable.

Well worth the $50 each to get them modified.

John
Ah, ha...good to see I'm only spreading halfway bogus info :help

Nick-what are you running the rears? Stock?
Just in case you can't wait for him to come back and answer....he is running S/A's from his wagon, which I believe are the same as the M3 spec.

Thanks for the info regarding the DAs. According to the new Fastrack we shouldn't have to drill out the factory crappy rubber bushings anymore. I'm hoping to (with Ken's help) make some polyurethane rear shock mount bushings to fit the factory housings..

John

Just out of curiousity-had SCCA not allowed aftermarket bushings, could you have used E30 or E36 convertible bushings? I am guessing that is not allowable as a backdate/update much like the x-brace and not allowable much less the E46 M3 RSMs. I have a brand new set sitting around if you need them...

Just in case you can't wait for him to come back and answer....he is running S/A's from his wagon, which I believe are the same as the M3 spec.

WHEW! Thanks Bren! :D :stickoutt

Thanks for the info regarding the DAs. According to the new Fastrack we shouldn't have to drill out the factory crappy rubber bushings anymore. I'm hoping to (with Ken's help) make some polyurethane rear shock mount bushings to fit the factory housings..

John

If you do, make me some!

Just out of curiousity-had SCCA not allowed aftermarket bushings, could you have used E30 or E36 convertible bushings? I am guessing that is not allowable as a backdate/update much like the x-brace and not allowable much less the E46 M3 RSMs. I have a brand new set sitting around if you need them...

No, you can't, and they wouldn't help anyway. The problem is two fold. One, the factory rubber mount sucks. The rubber separates from the metal, and eventually disintigrates and pushes through. Then you have a non-attached shock. I just think the rubber is too weak.

Second, the externally adjustable koni has a larger diameter shaft than the stock shocks. So your only legal option previously was to drill out the factory mount, which is a worse situation than the stock one.

Now, you can make your own bushing and put it in the factory plate.

John V

Just in case you can't wait for him to come back and answer....he is running S/A's from his wagon, which I believe are the same as the M3 spec.
They're E36 M3 spec. I don't like them. It's very apparent which end has ther D/A Kline shocks and which end has the S/A E36 spec version.

They're E36 M3 spec. I don't like them. It's very apparent which end has ther D/A Kline shocks and which end has the S/A E36 spec version.

The reason I bring up DA rears is because I'm thinking the additional compression in the back would help get the car to rotate quicker coming out of corners. Right now, it just pushes.

But at $375 a pop, to me it's not worth it.

Thoughts?

John

I honestly don't know. What I do know is that I'm not ever comfortable with the shocks, so they have to go. :p

AD's are $1600 for a set of 4... I'd get those before spending $800 on the rear Koni's.

AD's are $1600 for a set of 4... I'd get those before spending $800 on the rear Koni's.

Some ppl, like Tunnell didn't speak highly of ADs. :dunno

There are two reasons not to get Advance Design shocks from what I hear:

1) This is hearsay, but I'm told they need relatively frequent rebuilds.

2) This is FACT: With stock springs they will raise the car a LOT. Well over an inch. You can bleed the gas out of them if you've got the time and the patience to do it, but that just seems to defeat the arguable point of getting them.

They can be built to your spec, so they wouldn't raise the car. And TCK was the one who had leaking problems?

They can be built to your spec, so they wouldn't raise the car. And TCK was the one who had leaking problems?

Doesn't TCK use Koni?

Doesn't TCK use Koni?

Yes

Yes

That's what I thought...

TC Kline's Koni D/A setup is used on many track and autox cars alike...the shaft of the dampers are slightly larger in diameter John, you're right. They are pretty expensive but allow good adjustment....also you're right on about the bump adjustment in the rear...we've often made changes there depending on grip and track conditions and it proved to work in our favor. I can't say which is better between GC and TCKR since there are guys out there that win with both. I can tell you that TC has these dampers specially valed to match a wide range of VVS 60ID front springs and rear spring rates (although the rear is not a true 60ID, it rather sits on an sdjuster)...playing with spring rates will be the owners call and is based on the usage of the car...if anyone wants more info, I'd suggest calling Pete at TC Kline Racing for specific questions.

TC Kline's Koni D/A setup is used on many track and autox cars alike...the shaft of the dampers are slightly larger in diameter John, you're right. They are pretty expensive but allow good adjustment....also you're right on about the bump adjustment in the rear...we've often made changes there depending on grip and track conditions and it proved to work in our favor. I can't say which is better between GC and TCKR since there are guys out there that win with both. I can tell you that TC has these dampers specially valed to match a wide range of VVS 60ID front springs and rear spring rates (although the rear is not a true 60ID, it rather sits on an sdjuster)...playing with spring rates will be the owners call and is based on the usage of the car...if anyone wants more info, I'd suggest calling Pete at TC Kline Racing for specific questions.

Well unfortunately I can't change spring rates. I really don't care about having bound control up front (unless the D/A shocks would let me go lower in bound damping up front). I want to add some bound damping in the rear to get the rear end a bit more lively.

But for $375 a pop, it's not worth it.

John

If you want less compression in your fronts, why not send your current struts back to Koni and have them revalved (and find something else to drive for 6-8 weeks)?

Koni strutzzZZZzzzzz and shockzzzZZzzzzZ

... help get the car to rotate quicker coming out of corners.
Take out some rear toe...that should do the trick ;)

Take out some rear toe...that should do the trick ;)

I'm only running 1/8" total rear toe.

And Clyde, do you think they could add some compression to the rear instead of taking it out of the front? Any idea what that costs?

I'm not really enthused about having to beg for a ride for the next couple events...

John

I'm only running 1/8" total rear toe.

And Clyde, do you think they could add some compression to the rear instead of taking it out of the front? Any idea what that costs?

I'm not really enthused about having to beg for a ride for the next couple events...

John

I don't know what Koni's policy is, but maybe they can send you a re-valved one and you can send yours back in as a core plus whatever $ involved for the upgrade/change to compression?

As far as I know, they can do pretty much whatever you want: add/reduce bounce and/or rebound on either end. I'm not sure what they charge, but I'd guess that the costs are good enough that it's worth it to rebuild and revalve than buy new with custom valving.

Don't take this as gospel (because I'm probably getting it wrong), but I think I read that Koni will have a truck at Topeka and may be doing something close to while-you-wait rebuilds, but that may be only for cars in compeition. I need to do some digging to find out what's going on.

As far as I know, they can do pretty much whatever you want: add/reduce bounce and/or rebound on either end. I'm not sure what they charge, but I'd guess that the costs are good enough that it's worth it to rebuild and revalve than buy new with custom valving.

Don't take this as gospel (because I'm probably getting it wrong), but I think I read that Koni will have a truck at Topeka and may be doing something close to while-you-wait rebuilds, but that may be only for cars in compeition. I need to do some digging to find out what's going on.

Well, I bit the bullet and e-mailed BobT. He has been really good about giving out advice in the past when I have e-mailed him, so we'll see what he says.

I've never had shocks re-valved before so I don't know what to tell Koni.

"Add some bound in the rear, please."
"Okay, how much?"
"Uh... (shifty eyes) S.. some?"

"Add some bound in the rear, please."
"Okay, how much?"
"Uh... (shifty eyes) S.. some?"

You were listening in on my conversations with the guy that built my shocks, I see... :help

If you let them know what you want it to do, they ought to be able to translate that into valving specs.

FWIW, I want to make some setup changes as well, but I'm not really sure what to do. With the increased rear rebound, transistions are so much better controlled. For the same reason, though, adjusting rotation in sweepers through throttle steering is much more difficult. If I could access the rear rebound without a big production, it wouldn't be a big deal since I could adjust after seeing each course or between runs. I think I may have to start playing with rear tire pressures again. Test & tune from 10-3 on Friday at $2/run. Thankfully, I'm not on my tires, so I don't have to worry about wear. :devillook Probably going to rain, though. :(

Sigh.

You were listening in on my conversations with the guy that built my shocks, I see... :help

If you let them know what you want it to do, they ought to be able to translate that into valving specs.

FWIW, I want to make some setup changes as well, but I'm not really sure what to do. With the increased rear rebound, transistions are so much better controlled. For the same reason, though, adjusting rotation in sweepers through throttle steering is much more difficult. If I could access the rear rebound without a big production, it wouldn't be a big deal since I could adjust after seeing each course or between runs. I think I may have to start playing with rear tire pressures again. Test & tune from 10-3 on Friday at $2/run. Thankfully, I'm not on my tires, so I don't have to worry about wear. :devillook Probably going to rain, though. :(

Sigh.
You break 'em, you buy 'em! :D

(And you do owe me big time.)

You break 'em, you buy 'em! :D

(And you do owe me big time.)
Yeah...and I think a co-drive at a divisional level event in a competitive car should about cover it. :p

Yeah...and I think a co-drive at a divisional level event in a competitive car should about cover it. :p
Uh-huh.

I think you still owe me at the end of the day.