Hey Guys -

Since there is going to be quite a few of us there. Do you guys want to designate special duties for each person? E.g., someone else and I could bring drinks and food, someone could bring some plates/napkins, another person could bring ice and coolers, someone brings the tent, portable generator with tv and playstation 2 to hone up on our skillzzzzz, etc. ;)

I think it will be a long day and it would be nice to hang out as one big group under one big tent.

We can make Pete's car the showpiece and show everyone the Z8 starter!!! :eek: ... and tell people, it starts like a real formula 1 RACE car! :eek: :stickoutt

We can make Pete's car the showpiece and show everyone the Z8 starter!!! :eek: ... and tell people, it starts like a real formula 1 RICE car! :eek: :stickoutt

:eek:

:D :stickoutt

Hey Guys -

Since there is going to be quite a few of us there. Do you guys want to designate special duties for each person? E.g., someone else and I could bring drinks and food, someone could bring some plates/napkins, another person could bring ice and coolers, someone brings the tent, portable generator with tv and playstation 2 to hone up on our skillzzzzz, etc. ;)

I think it will be a long day and it would be nice to hang out as one big group under one big tent.

We can make Pete's car the showpiece and show everyone the Z8 starter!!! :eek: ... and tell people, it starts like a real formula 1 RACE car! :eek: :stickoutt

We don't need a TV, we all can sit in your car and watch. ;)

This event is 3 days? What day is everyone running?


Pete

I'll be at Nationals to help out the fellas.

But for ProSolo weekend, I'll be at Beaver Run... I really want to check out Pro Solo, that looks SOOOOOOO awesome!!! :mad:

So James, does this mean you aren't going to Beaver Run? I'm kinda torn now with Pro Solo...

Really wish I could run the Pro... but scheduling car events the weekend before and the weekend after Marisa's birthday is probably a baaaad idea :)

I can bring a cooler with beverages, that plus my charming personality and a couple of folding chairs :dunno:

Jed and others -- this is only MY OPINION and does not constitute legal advice. I am going to just put words in BOLD that I found troublesome and my comments. This is directly from their website.

http://www.nationalpreludemeet.com/pricing.htm

************************************************** ******

Track Day Information:

We will have a total of 90 racing positions available. These are on a first come, first serve basis so register as early as possible to secure your spot.

Things to consider:

You will need to provide your own Snell95 approved helmet for Track Day. If you do not have one, it is your responsibility to provide it. If you do not have a helmet, you will not race and you will not be refunded your money. No exceptions. Safety is very important and we cannot stress that enough.

We will be requesting the following information from you due to us no later than the last day of registration. If you do not provide the information, you will forfeit your position and not be issued a refund:

NPM Forum Screen Name (MANDATORY!!!)
Name
Address
City/St/Zip
Emergency Contact Person
Emergency Contact Phone #
Year/Make/Model of Car
Vehicle Color
Driver Classification (Novice, Intermediate, Advanced-- See Below)
Vehicle Modifications (Peformance, Suspension, Interior, Exterior, Audio, Other)


Novice Drivers are those people that have never raced or have raced occasionally. This is a huge problem to me, novices are those that have race occasionally? B.S.

Intermediate Drivers are those with prior track experience and understand what his/her car is capable of.

Advanced Drivers are those people with extensive track time and know not only their own personal limits, but how hard to push the car.

All drivers must be 18 years of age or older by June 4, 2004 and able to show proof of insurance upon request. I have a problem with age -- someone that just turned 18 on the track with us???

If you have health insurance, we'd like to have that information on file in case something happens to you. Its not required by any means, and we do not want to invade anyone's privacy but in the event you are in a life threatening accident, we'd like to make sure we have all the bases covered and know that we can get medical attention for you as soon as possible.This information is voluntary, not required.

I do not like how they have worded this portion and they say it is voluntary; but, then they go on to say this

Your emergency contact information is VERY important to us. If for some reason you are hurt or injured, we need to have someone as a contact to tell us how best to take care of you. We will have this information with us at all times during the weekend allowing us to quickly handle any situation that may come up.

This is also why we have requested your health insurance information! We just want to make sure all bases are covered and you will be taken care of in the event you are seriously injured!

Basically, if I were litigating this, I would argue that this IS a race event, the words being used connotates a RACE event, AND, the fact that emergency contact information is stressed, further indicates it is a RACE event. If it was not a race event, the wording should be much different, e.g., it should be labeled a "driver's school" and they keep using the word "seriously hurt/injured." That even NOVICES have some race experience -- see description above. Thus, all of the participants potentially have RACE experience. It is 'insinuated and implied' that Intermediate drivers have RACE experience since the Novice group is listed as "Novice Drivers are those people that have never raced or have raced occasionally." This means intermediate drivers have raced MORE than just occassionally ... which in my mind, implies frequently. I would forego this event NOT because I am afraid of driving with other Honda drivers; but, in the event something happens, you are almost guaranteed that this event will not be covered under insurance. Another troubling aspect is there is NO MENTION of any instructors even giving guidance to the Novice or Intermediate group students. There are 15 intermediate students.

http://www.nationalpreludemeet.com/registered.htm -- total of 48 track participants thus far.

I may still do it, I have not decided at this point. I have no problem with doing things; but, I do not want some Honda owner trying to keep up and beat me, e.g., over-driving their own car just because I have an M3. You could DEFINITELY see some of that in the previous Schattenbuam PCA. People would get pissed that I would be right behind them trying to pass and they would sometimes overdrive their cars, e.g., two cars spun out right in front of me going into turn 1. Driving on the track is not about getting into a pissing match ... and the younger you are, IMO, sometimes adrenaline kicks in and you drive harder than you should.

I have not decided at this point, I wanted to sign up for ProSolo just in case to have something to do that weekend. Right now, I am leaning toward doing ProSolo. I like auto-x and with Glenn's obi-won knowledge, I think I could become competitive in a year.

Again, only my opinion; but, I've studied their website kind of hard ...

James,

You and I were talking a lot about this over the weekend about the Beaver Run DE.

I do want to do it just for the new track, but the whole timing issue is what worries me. Yeah, I won't be timing myself, but then I don't want to be "blocking" someone who is and get pushed off by a hotshoe. When doing a DE, I know there is the risk of crashing, etc but on the same note, I am not actively looking to ball my car up either.

Yeah, I hear you guys. I am going just to check out the track and drive at my own pace. I am not looking to go balls out. I want to experience Beaver Run at least once. This seems liek the time to do it.

I thought most of the Preludes are going to be in one group, and many of the non-Preludes will be in another group. :dunno.

I will check into that.

I don't see why this event would be any different than the others. :confused:

We can make Pete's car the showpiece and show everyone the Z8 starter!!! :eek: ... and tell people, it starts like a real formula 1 RACE car! :eek: :stickoutt

:lol:

Jed and others -- this is only MY OPINION and does not constitute legal advice. I am going to just put words in BOLD that I found troublesome and my comments. This is directly from their website.... Again, only my opinion; but, I've studied their website kind of hard ...

Uh, this wording is more than a little disturbing. We joke about the whole "race" thing but with the danger that is present being on a track with inexperienced drivers thinking they're "racing" is bad enough. To spell it out in the event information is just stupid.

Be afraid, be very very afraid...

Uh, this wording is more than a little disturbing. We joke about the whole "race" thing but with the danger that is present being on a track with inexperienced drivers thinking they're "racing" is bad enough. To spell it out in the event information is just stupid.

Be afraid, be very very afraid...

John, why do you say this? You act like this event was half-assed or was posted at Starbucks to attract people to register. Just because the people who are registered drive non-BMW cars does not make them any less competent on the track. You make it sound like there are a bunch of immature people getting into something they have no clue about.

http://www.nationalpreludemeet.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=263 This event is not timed if you are not running in the advanced group. After looking at the Register Driver's list, NO ONE from this site is in that group.

Read the thread I posted. Car insurance issues are being considered in this event.

If you are worried, you probably shouldn't go. I can understand the concern. I did, and still have a little but going into this you need to assume that ANYTHING and EVERYTHING can happen on the track. This is true for ANY track or event you do.

For them to actually use the term "Race" in any way is just plain stupid. If something happens out there, (like someone loosing control due to coolant on the track and rolls their car which wouldn't be their fault) their insurance company will NOT cover it.

John didn't say a single word about being non-BMW and there was no reason to put words in his mouth.

For them to actually use the term "Race" in any way is just plain stupid. If something happens out there, (like someone loosing control due to coolant on the track and rolls their car which wouldn't be their fault) their insurance company will NOT cover it.

John didn't say a single word about being non-BMW and there was no reason to put words in his mouth.

*DING!* on both points.

For them to actually use the term "Race" in any way is just plain stupid. If something happens out there, (like someone loosing control due to coolant on the track and rolls their car which wouldn't be their fault) their insurance company will NOT cover it.

John didn't say a single word about being non-BMW and there was no reason to put words in his mouth.

First off, I agree, the word, "race" is not the best term to use.

Secondly, I probably should not have said, "non-BMW", but my question is, why is this event any different than the other events?? There are going to be instructors there. There are inexperienced drivers at EVERY event. In the thread I posted, Luke said that car insurance is a factor here.

Thirdly, I was speaking to John V...not John D. If I recall correctly, he can ask me the questions or stick up for himself. I was not attacking him.

I am trying to clear up some confusion.

Dammit! Am I gonna have to lay the smack down again?

"Let it go."

:smiliecap @ Glenn ...

side note -- interesting article -- no more six-spd manual for BMW's.

http://autospies.com/article/index.asp?articleId=1319&categoryId=1

why is this event any different than the other events??

Why is this event different?

A) A DE, if it is truly a DE, is an untimed event. Insurance companies will not cover timed competetive events. In general, autocrossing is given a pass (see Eric Wong and his curb surfing incident), though I don't know why.

B) A DE is not a race. If your insurance company finds out that this event was officially promoted as a RACE (and believe me, they will), then they will consider it TO BE A RACE and they will not cover any damages that might occur at said RACE. Regardless of how it is actually run, the organizers claiming this is a racing event marrs the viability of it as true driver instruction. Besides, I can just picture someone going out there thinking that it really is a race and balling up his car or someone else's car. Stupid. You have to get the point across to the participants that it is not a racing event and should not be treated as such. The promoters did just the opposite.

I have nothing against the Honda community just as I have nothing against DEs. I have done DEs. I agree that if properly run and promoted they are safe and fun. This issue could be solved in my mind by removing any indications from the event promotion that it is in any way a competetive event.

Go ping your insurance company. Fax them the information sheet for this "DE" and see how they respond to it. That will be the true litmus for whether we are overreacting or not.

:smiliecap @ Glenn ...

side note -- interesting article -- no more six-spd manual for BMW's.

http://autospies.com/article/index.asp?articleId=1319&categoryId=1


“With SMG, you can shift faster and it is better for the engine, the clutch and the transmission,” says Scheibner.

HA, that's why BMW is replacing a ton of clutches under warranty for SMG cars. :biglaughb

Why is this event different?

A) A DE, if it is truly a DE, is an untimed event. Insurance companies will not cover timed competetive events. In general, autocrossing is given a pass (see Eric Wong and his curb surfing incident), though I don't know why.

B) A DE is not a race. If your insurance company finds out that this event was officially promoted as a RACE (and believe me, they will), then they will consider it TO BE A RACE and they will not cover any damages that might occur at said RACE. Regardless of how it is actually run, the organizers claiming this is a racing event marrs the viability of it as true driver instruction. Besides, I can just picture someone going out there thinking that it really is a race and balling up his car or someone else's car. Stupid. You have to get the point across to the participants that it is not a racing event and should not be treated as such. The promoters did just the opposite.

I have nothing against the Honda community just as I have nothing against DEs. I have done DEs. I agree that if properly run and promoted they are safe and fun. This issue could be solved in my mind by removing any indications from the event promotion that it is in any way a competetive event.

Go ping your insurance company. Fax them the information sheet for this "DE" and see how they respond to it. That will be the true litmus for whether we are overreacting or not.

And you know what, after hearing that someone was denied recently, I will probably never take my car out on the track now. I had planned to once it was paid for and I had other means of transportation, but not now. Bt the time my car is paid for, insurance companies will have written clauses into everything saying DE's are not covered either. I will NOT risk putting my family into that much of financial trouble. It's just plain stupid.

Just a personal note, I have not read the whole thing (too long :)), but I can tell you that I will not be going to any event (except autox) that is held on a race track that does not clearly state "driver education", "instructor", "student", etc.

Following my crash at VIR, BMWCCA Tarheel Chapter sent me a very nice explanatory letter to pass on to my insurance that closed the deal, and Geico paid up. However, some of those details just have to be related to the event, or the insurance companies are very quick to find ways around it.

My crash, thankfully, involved damage only to the car; but imagine if someone was hurt. Things would have been much more serious. Medical bills, disability, etc.

Do not think that it may not happen to you. It truly takes a small mistake sometimes. Especially when we go to track events as groups, competitive nature kicks in that speeds increase, attention decrease and focus shifts.

Just my 2 cents...

Just a personal note, I have not read the whole thing (too long :)), but I can tell you that I will not be going to any event (except autox) that is held on a race track that does not clearly state "driver education", "instructor", "student", etc.

Following my crash at VIR, BMWCCA Tarheel Chapter sent me a very nice explanatory letter to pass on to my insurance that closed the deal, and Geico paid up. However, some of those details just have to be related to the event, or the insurance companies are very quick to find ways around it.

My crash, thankfully, involved damage only to the car; but imagine if someone was hurt. Things would have been much more serious. Medical bills, disability, etc.

Do not think that it may not happen to you. It truly takes a small mistake sometimes. Especially when we go to track events as groups, competitive nature kicks in that speeds increase, attention decrease and focus shifts.

Just my 2 cents...

That's some good information.

My intention is to clarify the whole event. I OBVIOUSLY don't know the ins and outs. I want to learn too.

I will pass on the details to my Ins Co. and see what they say.

Thanks

Andy, good luck, becareful, and I wish you well.

I am researching insurace at DEs and Autox with my insurance company right now. My policy explicitly excludes any "racing or speed contest."

Opinion: The excessive use of the word RACE :eek: makes it really hard to claim later that this was a DE and not a "racing or speed contest." I'm not a lawyer and I do not play one on TV, so take that for what it is worth. I have also heard suggestions to verify with your carrier if you are or are not covered. If you are covered, get it in writing specifying the date and location of the event.

I am researching insurace at DEs and Autox with my insurance company right now. My policy explicitly excludes any "racing or speed contest."

Opinion: The excessive use of the word RACE :eek: makes it really hard to claim later that this was a DE and not a "racing or speed contest." I'm not a lawyer and I do not play one on TV, so take that for what it is worth. I have also heard suggestions to verify with your carrier if you are or are not covered. If you are covered, get it in writing specifying the date and location of the event.

:laugh

Hey, post up the info you get back from your ins. co. I am going to ask mine too.

I sent Luke an email asking him to come here and clarify.

Don't think I am not nervous too. I hope to make sure that we are all covered. It's easy for people, including myself, to make arbitrary statements. Let's get the facts first. :)

I'll gladly pass along what I learn. Since I drive a convertible, I'll never run on a track. (Not enough rollover protection for me, I just don't feel safe without a full cage at those speeds.) My main concern is autox. I know that here on Bf.c State Farm has the best reputation for covering people at a DE. A friend of mine is switching to State Farm because he is just starting to get into DEs and he heard that they have best attitude toward DE drivers.

Scott

Scott, call the agent directly. I know some are better then other's. My agent has multiple Corvette's and is a car enthusiast.

I appologize to all for what I said. I think my concern for this event got the best of me. :)

:D

So who is bringing what to the Tour and ProSolo?

I'm bringing my car, driving suit and shoes. Who can bring the Ferrari Under Armour?

I appologize to all for what I said. I think my concern for this event got the best of me. :)
yeah we got mad temper, us PeRsIaN'ZzZz have a lot of PeRsIaN PaSsIoN and PeRsIaN PrIdE!!!

George can bring A Hot Dog.

yeah we got mad temper, us PeRsIaN'ZzZz have a lot of PeRsIaN PaSsIoN and PeRsIaN PrIdE!!!

i thought you were greek........ :confused:

George can bring A Hot Dog.
only if theres a grill. otherwise i will bring snack :D

yeah we got mad temper, us PeRsIaN'ZzZz have a lot of PeRsIaN PaSsIoN and PeRsIaN PrIdE!!!


Tru DAT!!

DAMN IT!!! My car is out in the rain right now. :mad: See, temper flaring again. :mad:

DAMN IT!!! My car is out in the rain right now. :mad: See, temper flaring again. :mad:
That sucks... If the tape holding your car together gets wet you might have to spend another dollar for a new roll. :stickoutt

---Eric

Tru DAT!!

DAMN IT!!! My car is out in the rain right now. :mad: See, temper flaring again. :mad:


hey, i can power wash it for you. if you don't mind peeling clear coat, that is...

hey, i can power wash it for you. if you don't mind peeling clear coat, that is...
Do you think your power washer is strong enough to blast through my layer of tree sap? :D

---Eric

That sucks... If the tape holding your car together gets wet you might have to spend another dollar for a new roll. :stickoutt

---Eric

Eric, I think you posted on the wrong website. This isn't the Alfa website. ;)

:D

Eric, I think you posted on the wrong website. This isn't the Alfa website. ;)

:D
The last time I saw your car I saw quite a bit of tape holding things on. Mine is tape free (both cars). :stickoutt Did you fix yours?

And STOP WINKING AT ME!!!

---Eric

Do you think your power washer is strong enough to blast through my layer of tree sap? :D

---Eric

tree sap, yes. special sauce, no. :bj:

This was a thread about WHAT to bring to ProSolo and Nationals. :rolleyes:

Both of you two stop being TROLLS! :stickoutt

Okay, on-topic ... are we allowed to grill there, e.g., charcoal style? I doubt it, right?

Is everyone going to bring their own thing, or can we coordinate to bring stuff separately?

Mine is tape free (both cars). :stickoutt
---Eric


:eek: Then what's holding the engine in?? :eek:

:eek: Then what's holding the engine in?? :eek:
Engine? :confused:

---Eric

i thought you were greek........ :confused:
you dumb. me and andy r PeRsIaN :rolleyes:

in a 30min timeframe i wonder how many cicadas will fly into a running grill and cook themselves.

Guys,

Let me address a few things.

This is NOT a RACE nor is it timed. This is considered an open lapping Day/ HPDE. All Novice students will be driving under the care of instructors. I did not create the page, and I didn't realize how many times the incorrect word was used, the page is being redone tonight to reflect the correct words.

This was NEVER meant to be promoted as a Race or a Timed event in anyway. I'm sorry if you got the wrong impression. If you logged into the NPM forum you would see that this is an instructional, safe fun day. This is not Honda Challenge ;)

Insurance Issue: We made it "voluntary" due some people *might* not have it. If you have it, by all means give it to us. This is in regards to health, everyone must have auto Insurance.

NoSoup4U, your comments about Honda's and their stygma are just childish. I'm sorry that you feel that *we* are going to try to *race* you because you have a BMW? Get off your high horse. No one is going to try to run you off the road, it's rather concerning you even think that. Last time we checked, it was the National Prelude Meet, we love all cars, and people that drive them, that's why we opened OUR meet to all of you. Many of you have logged in and are excited about this LAPPING event. We edited the page sometime ago to remove the word *race* but by accident just never uploaded it.

Let me know if you need any more information.

Luke

hey, I thought this thread was about our gaithering at Nationals and pro solo :95

hey, I thought this thread was about our gaithering at Nationals and pro solo :95
The Maryland and Surrounding Areas forum went off topic? :eyecrazy:

---Eric

Guys,

Let me address a few things.

This is NOT a RACE nor is it timed. This is considered an open lapping Day/ HPDE. All Novice students will be driving under the care of instructors. I did not create the page, and I didn't realize how many times the incorrect word was used, the page is being redone tonight to reflect the correct words.

This was NEVER meant to be promoted as a Race or a Timed event in anyway. I'm sorry if you got the wrong impression. If you logged into the NPM forum you would see that this is an instructional, safe fun day. This is not Honda Challenge ;)

Insurance Issue: We made it "voluntary" due some people *might* not have it. If you have it, by all means give it to us. This is in regards to health, everyone must have auto Insurance.

NoSoup4U, your comments about Honda's and their stygma are just childish. I'm sorry that you feel that *we* are going to try to *race* you because you have a BMW? Get off your high horse. No one is going to try to run you off the road, it's rather concerning you even think that. Last time we checked, it was the National Prelude Meet, we love all cars, and people that drive them, that's why we opened OUR meet to all of you. Many of you have logged in and are excited about this LAPPING event. We edited the page sometime ago to remove the word *race* but by accident just never uploaded it.

Let me know if you need any more information.

Luke

Thanks Luke!! :buttrock

Specialque -

Alright, you want to get in a pissing match with me :mad:. Where the fcuk do you get that I am putting down honda's b/c I drive a BMW? Can you even fcuking read?

I would forego this event NOT because I am afraid of driving with other Honda drivers; but, in the event something happens, you are almost guaranteed that this event will not be covered under insurance.

That's what I said in light of the word race fcuking throughout the paragraphs I posted directly from your website. Moreover, I used Honda drivers in an analogy comparing them to the Schattenbaum PCA drivers in a hypothetical situation. So where the fcuk do you get the thought that I think I am better than a honda driver? Jesus, you are the one with the attitude problem if you feel that has been insinuated by my comments. I respect all cars ... and all drivers whether it's a f*cking $300K vehicle or a god-damn $200 ford pinto. It's not about status symbol .. you are the one bringing that f*cking trash-talk into this conversation.

This is NOT a RACE nor is it timed.

Okay, then why the fcuk is it on your website? Why are there posts previously that one "could" be timed. Are you that obtuse that you believe if you "amended" the website that now this event is A-OK? Are you that obtuse that you do not realize that if one car is timed -- that ENTIRE event will be considered to be a "race", e.g., planned event, e.g., organized event, e.g., an event where driver's can showcase their driving skills at speeds higher than highway speeds, etc...etc... shall I continue with what case law defines "race" as?

A race constitutes "a planned" event. Do a fcuking search in case law before opening your mouth telling me how childish I am, or I am on a high horse. My comments were directed to people worried if the language was acceptable or open to interpretation.

I was using the honda's ONLY as an analogy, if it makes you fcuking feel better, substitute the word honda for BMW. It does not fucking matter if the event was PCA, Ferrari, Bugatti, BMW's, Honda's, Hyundai's ... etc. The whole point of the fucking post was to illustrate to people how this event is being labeled. People had previously asked me why I was so concerned. It's your own fcuking god-damn incompetent fault you did not edit the page.

You've been on the track before, open your fcuking mind Luke and stop being so narrow-minded. For instance, BMW drivers like to out-drive their cars at say (again this is hypothetical in case you can't f*cking read) PCA events. Why? Because it's 'cool' to pass a car that costs twice yours. I speak from experience, it's f*cking cool to pass a Ferrari F355 on the track, a car that costs 4 times my car. I know sometimes I am more aggressive b/c it's human nature. That's all I was saying ... WTF. It was not about being in a BMW next to honda and worrying about my car. If it makes you feel better, I'll rent a Ford Taurus and bring it on the track. Jesus ...

Many of you have logged in and are excited about this LAPPING event.

Again, this statement just shows your lack of judgment skills (e.g., saying I am on a high-horse, calling me childish). Let me be blunt since you were blunt to me: You are a fcuking moron. You are using the word "lapping" -- do you know what a LAPPING event is? Exactly. If you did, you would not use the word "lapping," "touring," etc ...

If you logged into the NPM forum you would see that this is an instructional, safe fun day.

Okay, perhaps I cannot fcuking read, and if I can't please feel free to blast the sh!t out of me. But, where in that entire web-age do I see the words "INSTRUCTION" or "instructors"? I don't fcuking see it ... how the hell can you describe this event as being instructionalwhen there is no fcuking wording describing that novices and/or intermediates will have "instructors" in the cars?

It's not f*cking there or I can't read, so don't give people the delusion and f*cking lie to them that this is run like a driver's education event. It's clearly not. Don't F*ck other people because of your incompetenence. IF you had a modicum of intelligence instead of your smart-ass remarks to me (yes, I recognize the irony in that statement, hey, you pissed me off) ... you would CLEARLY state that each driver participating in the track day, should contact their insurance company to see if their insurance company will cover it. You should also notify them that it is possible that their insurance company, if something does occur, may not cover the accident, even IF it is through no-fault of their own (e.g., a car hits them), and may possibly drop them. You would say their are controlled passing zones.

You would also list the instructors that are instructing ... e.g., if they are professionally licensed or are they some f*cking person that just has been to beaverun 20 times that year. It makes a difference Luke knowing credentials and having full disclosure. I do not want anything to happen, and I still may participate; but, you can't have people believing that there is not a possibility that something could go wrong.

Don't you get it? The LESS you say -- the more leeway a court/insurance company can put their own meaning into something ... in this situation, it is hurting you NOT having everything spelled out in a clear and concise manner.

I did not create the page, and I didn't realize how many times the incorrect word was used, the page is being redone tonight to reflect the correct words.

This is just piss-poor management on your part. You are the fcuking contact person for everything? Yet, you NEVERread the page? You never saw that it says for Novice students, "occasional race experience?" -- how is that not a major fcuk-up on your part? How is this supposed to inspire confidence in others that you are going run an instructional, safe fun day ... if you don't even f*cking read your own website.

We edited the page sometime ago to remove the word *race* but by accident just never uploaded it.

First, by accident? By f*cking accident you FORGOT to edit the web-page? Let me give you a Darwin award, that's REALLY competent of you considering what could possibly be at stake. If you were so god-damn concerned and wanted to make sure that this was NOT a race, you would have done it: IMMEDIATELY as soon as you knew about it. This is just piss-poor management skills on your part. Accidents happen ... but, this is a major f*ck-up on your part.

Second, you fcuking contradict yourself ... look at the previous quote in bold, page is being redone tonight ... then you say, We edited the page sometime ago.

So which fcuking story is true? First story is you never read it and didn't see how many times the word "race" is used. Second story, oh ... you did see it and redid the page awhile ago and just did not do it.

So which Scarlet Letter would you like to wear:

a) you are a fucking liar; or

b) you are fucking incompetent.

Sorry for this long "childish" and "high-horse" response.

Believe me, there are hotshoes around no matter what make or brand.

Jed

Yes, that was my whole point.

I agree that there are a lot of immature, hotshots out there. However, I think many of the hotshots are not interested in running at the track. They would rather keep it on the streetZZZ.

Hell, I even tested this theory on one ricer I know. He has a turboed Integra and always boasts how good of a driver he is and how fast his car is. I asked him to come to the driving event and he declined. :laugh

Based on my VERY limited experience, it seems like the guys who are hotshoes are generally the people with more driving experience. :dunno

We will have some class time and there will be instructions on how to behave on the track.

It should be a good time.

god-damn $200 ford pinto.

Where can you get a pinto for $200?

Man, I don't think I have ever heard anyone use the work, "fcuk" as James just did. :laugh

Man, I don't think I have ever heard anyone use the work, "fcuk" as James just did. :laugh

:biglaughb

:rofl:

Where can you get a pinto for $200?

There's a dark green one parked in front of your garage. :stickoutt

note to self - don't call james "childish"

...




Note to self.. never get a lawyer angry :) I think I'll go and change these 3rd action non-finals and final rejections over to allowances now :confused: :stickoutt :( :eyecrazy:

note to self - don't call james "childish"

Or hit him with a pool stick.

And I thought I had a bad temper on the forums. :laugh

James, you are my JohnV :kiss:

Fccccuuuuuuuuukkkkkkk!!!!

I would love to see James litigate with Judge Judy presiding. He would show that old biddy a thing or two!!! :mad:

I don't like to assume anything, but I think it's safe to assume James is not going to Beaver Run.

And I thought I had a bad temper on the forums. :laugh

James, you are my JohnV :kiss:

Internet tough guys UNITE!!!! :mad:

:alright :redspot :buttrock

*ducking*

:stickoutt ;) :D

It would be funny if James is really quiet in the courtroom. The judge asks him to state his case, James just mumbles a little, logs into Bimmerforums and starts typing away. After he is done, he hands the laptop to the judge. :laugh

A mute lawyer?

guys, i think you are misinterpreting james' argument. He was simply expressing his adoration for the clothing line from the clothing store 'French Connection UK' www.fcuk.com

Internet tough guys UNITE!!!! :mad:

:alright :redspot :buttrock

*ducking*

:stickoutt ;) :D

AHHHHHHHHHH

My muscles grow stronger when I post. In fact, I wear my workout clothes and a headband when I post on Bimmerforums. :D

It would be funny if James is really quiet in the courtroom. The judge asks him to state his case, James just mumbles a little, logs into Bimmerforums and starts typing away. After he is done, he hands the laptop to the judge. :laugh

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Then the judge replies on James' thread under his "BaLLaJuDgE_M5" screenname.

AHHHHHHHHHH

My muscles grow stronger when I post. In fact, I wear womens' underpants when I post on Bimmerforums. :D


:eek: :eek:

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Then the judge replies on James' thread under his "BaLLaJuDgE_M5" screenname.

:lol:

:eek: :eek:

:help

:D

thanks for the 911 james, I appreciate the info and concerns since i will be participating at this event!